Give 5 trash games that you played

EastFrame · Post by **EastFrame** » Sat Sep 22, 2012 5:31 pm

GawainBS wrote:I'm on the fence regarding ME3: I loved the series, but that ending...

I loved the series too, which what made ME3 feel like such a betrayal. That ending occurred because they scripted the game like a movie. Being a bit old-school (looks at a few grey hairs), RPG's (PnP) were always defined as interactive novels where you got to choose how the story played out. Video game makers have got carried away with photorealistic graphics and voice acting. I find I prefer reading the text on older games (IWD, BG etc) because apparently, my imagination is better!

EastFrame · Post by **EastFrame** » Sat Sep 22, 2012 5:35 pm

DaveO wrote:I don't judge games by the endings. I've finished games that have had short endings, bad endings, or cliffhangers(it's possible to finish a game that has all three like Drakan: Order of the Flame).

P.S. - I enjoyed Drakan: Order of the Flame despite the previously mentioned ending.

Fair point, but I put too much time into ME3 (not only because it was cut-and-paste from DX:HR) not to feel cheated. I play to see how the story plays out. A bad ending is a real let down for me.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:16 am

DaveO wrote:I don't judge games by the endings. I've finished games that have had short endings, bad endings, or cliffhangers(it's possible to finish a game that has all three like Drakan: Order of the Flame).

P.S. - I enjoyed Drakan: Order of the Flame despite the previously mentioned ending.

My problem with ME3 is that it invalidates the entire series and comes as a giant slap across the face.

BTW, what was Drakkan's ending again? I don't recall.

DaveO · Post by **DaveO** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 11:54 am

In the first Drakan game, the main character is determined to get her brother back after he gets kidnapped. She finally finds her brother at the end, and frees him from being possessed by the evil villain. At that point, her brother loses balance and falls into a bottomless void and the heroine leaves the "Rift" where the bottomless void exists. You get a very brief showing of her brother STILL falling in the void and the evil villain laughing. I'm guessing that he'd possess the heroine's brother again and somehow escape the "Rift". I believe the Playstation sequel explains that the brother died, but the sequel ending is not much better than the original game.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:30 pm

There's a Playstation sequel? Wow, didn't know that. Was it worth playing?

bushwhacker2k · Post by **bushwhacker2k** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 12:30 am

Scottg wrote:Nah, Neverwinter Nights (the original campaign) - wasn't truly bad.. but it wasn't good either. Hordes of the Underdark (expansion) was actually decent.

I'm reasonably sure he wasn't referring to the early 2000's game Neverwinter Nights. IMO one of the best games ever made.

LastDanceSaloon wrote:I have no idea what you mean by 'Trash Game'. If a game is so bad that I have to throw it in the trash then it's highly unlikely I'm going to remember the name.

I'm kinda the same way. I just don't latch on to names well, I barely remember the names of things I like, much less games that sucked.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 12:58 am

The original NWN campaign was quite, quite boring.

bushwhacker2k · Post by **bushwhacker2k** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 6:48 pm

GawainBS wrote:The original NWN campaign was quite, quite boring.

I looooved NWN's OC and HotU, don't remember SoU so much though.

Mixing classes together was sooo much fun

Scottg · Post by **Scottg** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:08 pm

GawainBS wrote:The original NWN campaign was quite, quite boring.

-yup!

Scottg · Post by **Scottg** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:18 pm

bushwhacker2k wrote:..don't remember SoU so much though.

..there wasn't a lot to SoU, BUT strangely I did like it.

1. It wasn't long-winded.
2. It had a classic "bad-guy", and while it lacked a *specific* bad-guy (which was a mistake), the "genre" of bad-guy was interesting.
3. I like the pithy desert "sound track" and the "puffs" of sand as I walked around with vanishing foot prints.

Speaking of #3 - this was a BIG mistake in HotU - the graphics were overall VERY poor (non-original when compared to the OC) for the Under Dark. No real new textures or 3D effects (..like the "puffs of sand" - just re-used the same effect in dirt). Only the lighting seemed to be altered much, even most of the Drow buildings seemed to be an after-thought, and only a half-hearted attempt to improve the Illithid map.

LastDanceSaloon · Post by **LastDanceSaloon** » Wed Sep 26, 2012 6:35 am

The original Neverwinter Nights campaign was very long and at times did have the crime of being a bit boring, but not in the whole, only in the part and the two expansions certainly made up for this in spades, making the occasional bout of yawns more than worth the effort to get to the later stages.

Yes, you are also right Scottg, NWN was indeed criticised for being graphically challenged when it first came out, but this was because they actually spent the time making an awesome game rather than hurry something that looks nice - you really can't have it both ways, not in an economic reality sense.

NWN certainly was less awe inspiring than it's immediate predecessors Icewind Dale and Balder's Gate but, compared to modern RPGs or the fiasco of Temple of Elemental Evil, I'd much rather have the odd yawn or oddly lit screen than a glitchy tragedy or a tedium grind throughout.

I agree the game deserves criticism, that's how we hope to improve our games (assuming a positive outlook), but I honestly fail to see why NWN deserves any kind of 'heavy' criticism. Surely that should be reserved for NWN II

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:54 am

The expansions of NWN were very good, yes. NWNII was actually a (very) good game in my book. Then again, I'm oddly immune to Obsidian bugs. (Really, not purposely ignoring them, just not experiencing them. For example, I ran in my first Alpha Protocol bug during my 4th playthrough only.)

Scottg · Post by **Scottg** » Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:52 pm

Actually the OC of NWN(1) was rather impressive graphically at that time for what it was (terrain hill "ramps" excepted). To this day I still like the waving grass, the woodland clear streams, and the falling leaves in the forests. My only gripe graphically was HOTU's adding very little new (again graphically). BG2's graphical depiction was V-A-S-T-L-Y superior (..as a comparison), and it was mostly only 2d artwork (..but it was real *art* work).

Like GawainBS, I thought that NWNII (OC) was good (..though a little to long as well). Nor have I experienced a great deal of bugs from any of the campaigns (..the sole major exception would be the "familiar" bug in NWNII OC).

While not "glitchy" (for me) - NWNI (OC) was tedious at best (agonizingly slow at worst), with a story-line that bordered on absurd. The writers should have just concentrated on NWN vs. Luskan, the bizzare "Land of the Lost" theme was unbelievably disjointed. I should note though that it wasn't what I'd consider a "trash" game. I think I'd have to give a game a "2 out of 10" or less to qualify as "trash". (..and NWN1 was probably a 4.5 for me, which isn't far off from what I would rate the first BG - a solid 5, though for different reasons.)

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:51 pm

Damn, Scottg, you're so strict of points.

Scottg · Post by **Scottg** » Wed Sep 26, 2012 4:21 pm

GawainBS wrote:Damn, Scottg, you're so strict of points.

9 is the highest I've ever given a game - PS:Torment. (..and that's even taking into account how unbelievably slow it is at the beginning.)

I'd give Wiz 8 and BG2 something a bit less than this (again for different reasons), perhaps 8-8.5.

My favorite games Thief 1 & 2 I'd probably give 7.5.

Hmm.. maybe I've a bit of Swiss ancestry?

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:52 am

I agree that BG2 is superior to BG1, but why does BG1 barely make the cut?

Scottg · Post by **Scottg** » Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:59 pm

GawainBS wrote:..but why does BG1 barely make the cut?

The Plot was poor. The characters "drab". The locations "thin" and largely uninteresting.

Ex.. Leave Candlekeep (to "protect" your character)? Umm.. isn't Candlekeep home to perhaps the highest single concentration of Wizards, Sorcerers, and other powerful beings - all easily capable of protecting those in the Keep? Later taken over by dopplegangers, what? The "iron trade" problems need looking into by a "newbee" being hunted? "Iron trade" subverted to cause a war - and that strengthens Saverock how (i.e. how do deaths from war come under the portfolio of murder)?

Characters - I barely remember Imoen, Minsc, and Saverock (..that's it). Of the 3 Minsc is the most memorable because of the comic relief with Boo, the other two seemed more like what they were: plot devices. (..and while Minsc was memorable - sadly I remember the *sword* given to Minsc in BG2 ,better than him or Boo.)

Locations: I remember a small town tavern, and Baldur's Gate. Baldur's Gate was good, particularly for the 2d artwork and the overall "size" of the city. Most "maps" however seemed to have little more than seeing how much the player could remove blacked-out pixels.

When I think about the complexity of BG2, BG1 doesn't even come close.

I guess the best way to show the real differences is by asking you to play BG2 again - first, and then within a few weeks start playing BG1. When played in this order the stark differences should become obvious. (..though there are a few things I liked better with BG1 - like *some* free roaming capability, and the map-based continuity of Baldur's Gate as opposed to the disconnected movement in and around Athkatla.)

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:39 pm

Good points. Thanks.

bushwhacker2k · Post by **bushwhacker2k** » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:26 pm

GawainBS wrote:The expansions of NWN were very good, yes. NWNII was actually a (very) good game in my book. Then again, I'm oddly immune to Obsidian bugs. (Really, not purposely ignoring them, just not experiencing them. For example, I ran in my first Alpha Protocol bug during my 4th playthrough only.)

I really didn't like NWN2. I dunno what precisely it was but the games never captured me like NWN1 did.