Man, Alchemy rocks even more than enchant!

Chris Boney · Post by **Chris Boney** » Fri May 24, 2002 9:02 am

I swear, I had my Heureka experience today in Morrowind, when I found that out. Check out this potion:

Potion of the Mage:
Fortify intelligence 48 points for 178 seconds.
Restore Magicka 13 points for 35 seconds. (-> Thats over 400 mana!!)

And that potion was brewed with ingredients, which didnt even ost as much as an empty common soul gem in a shop!!!
And best of all, there are shopkeepers which offer unlimited ingredients!! For example at the "fine alchimist" in Barlmora, a bit northwest of the mages guild, has unlimited items, which means you buy up his stock, hit the barter button again, and he has exactly the same ingredients again and again!
There is a nifty trick you can do at this (and any similar shop):
If he has a ware unlimited, but only 10 pieces each time you enter the trading screen, just sell some to him, which you bought before. When he has 20 pieces, close the trading screen, open a new trade, and he will always have 20 pieces from then on, even if you buy him totally empty!

If you thought, that selling soul gems would bring a lot of money.. forget it! With alchemy you'll have potions total worth a 100k cash, in the same time it takes you to trap 3-4 ancestor ghosts.
And potions are much more handy for selling, because you have a better control of what the shop can afford.

Btw does anyone know, if somebody has already made up a list of all alchemist shops, or all ingredients ?

Boney

Ned Flanders · Post by **Ned Flanders** » Fri May 24, 2002 9:53 am

Voodoo Dali made up a nice list, it is incomplete I think as she is still playing the game. However, our levels were on par so I had her send it to me.

I'm level 11, have seen a bunch of the SW quadrant of Vvardenfall and have stumbled across 25+ reagents (guess). I've found a few things not in the list she sent to me but if you PM me your email I'd forward it to you. Voodoo can contact me later if she stumbles across this message later demanding royalties.

I'd have to concur with you regarding alchemy though. I've made a lot of money with it. If you've got the time, sell/buy potions a couple at a time and haggle to increase mercantile skill and speechcraft? Since I don't rely on those skills too heavy at the present, I'm not completely sure on effective means of raising those two although I think my idea is plausible.

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Fri May 24, 2002 11:49 am

Boney, you forgot to mention what ingredients are in that potion

I think alchemy is great but I don't think it has to be better or worse than enchanting, they are both rad that's why I have them both as major skills. I like how in alchemy you can sell even your crappy potions like drain luck or whatever for the same money.

I like those long duration restores you get from potions you make yourself - chug a quick restore health and you can just fight and fight as your health quickly regenerates from each hit. I just made a trip up to the northeast where wickwheat and marshmerrow grow in great abundance.

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Fri May 24, 2002 12:27 pm

potion sounds yummy...

can you post ingrediants???

my alchemy skills is at 50, right now....

oh yeah, since i never did home economics in this game, giggle, what instruments you need??

and what is best fortify int potion you made?? long duration, sounds killer with ring of warlocks, good for mana increase jsut before major battles...

Chris Boney · Post by **Chris Boney** » Sat May 25, 2002 1:11 am

Well, please be patient with me, I'm currently working on a big list of all "unlimited" ingredients, that can be bought in a plentyful way (see original post). Currently I have written down 42 ingreds. but the list is far from complete, but already a bit useful. I'll write down those who have fortify int and restore magicka (and fort. magicka as well), so you can try messing around yourself:

Restore Magicka:
Comberry (Ajia/Barlmora) (Scelian Plebo/Sandrith Mora-Wolverine Hall)
Void Salts (Nalcyara of W.H./Barlmora Finest Alchemist Shop)
Frost Salts (Nalcyara)
Daedra's Heart (Nalcyara)

Fortify Magicka:
Emerald (Scelian Plebo)
Saltrice (Scelian Plebo)

Fortify INT:
Bloat (Nalcyara) (Aunius Autrus/in same shop as Scelian Plebo)
Netch Leather (Aunius Autrus)
Ash Yam (Aunius Autrus)

I brewed the Potion of the Mage with an alchemy skill of 97 and a complete master's set of tools (retort, mortar etc)
Can't remember which ingreds I used exactly, but as you can see there are plenty of possibilities for this potion, just take 2 random ingreds from Restore Magicka, and 2 others from Fortify Int., and then experiment a bit around exchanging ingreds with others, in order to have the potion without penalties.

Wicky

PS: Anyone interested in helping me complete this list? ICQ me, my number is 2366 2379, and I would be looking for a voluntary person too, who can code a small nifty program, which can display ingredients needed for a potion, and it's price based on ingreds, too :>

Chris Boney · Post by **Chris Boney** » Sat May 25, 2002 1:53 am

Here is an interesting result, which I'd like to tell you:
Having Alchemy 100 and a master's set of tools, I brewed this potion:

Potion of the Mage:
Ingreds: Void Salts, Netch Leather, Comberry, Ash Yam.
Weight: 0,4
Value: 135
Fortify INT. 49 points for 139 seconds.
Restore Magicka 13 points for 31 seconds (totalling 403 mana)

The interesting thing came, after I drink like ten of those, boosted my Intelligence to 500++ (had around 1700 maximum mana by then), I brewed exactly the same potion again, to see if there was any difference with the Intelligence beeing that insanely high...
The result was, using the same ingredients:

Superpotion of Sorcery
Weight: 0,4
Value: 198
Fortify INT. 68 points for 198 seconds !!!!!!!
Restore Magicka 17 points for 42 seconds (totalling 714 mana!!!!!!!!!)

That's just another glitch in Morrowind, it shouldn't be possible to quaff the same "fortify attribute" potion over and over again. One time should be enough.
Imagine brewing two different potions, one to fortify Hitpoints and Mana, then another one to have those two regain at this speed.. you'd be practically invincible! Doh!

Boney

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Sat May 25, 2002 1:12 pm

Originally posted by Chris Boney

Fortify Magicka:
Emerald (Scelian Plebo)
Saltrice (Scelian Plebo)

Interesting results there, boney. Nice work on the Intelligence boost results - good to know. I wanted to point out that you can brew up a fortify magicka without using expensive emeralds - I believe the cheap substitute ingredient is Stoneflower petals, anyway its a pretty blue flower. Save those emeralds to give to your sweetheart.

Chris Boney · Post by **Chris Boney** » Sun May 26, 2002 3:09 am

There is a nice list of ingredients, with all effects summarized at the end:
http://db.gamefaqs.com/computer/doswin/ ... potion.txt

Maybe I'll try to bring this list into a more convenient format for easier searching, and to add the sources, where all these ingreds. can be bought.

Boney

cjdevito · Post by **cjdevito** » Sun May 26, 2002 11:36 am

Alchemy is cool, no doubt about it. But rocks more then enchant? Nah. Not unless you find some constant effect potions

Sirius_Sam · Post by **Sirius_Sam** » Sun May 26, 2002 3:42 pm

I agree with Cj...It's awfully hard to beat a constant (or even charged) ring simply because it is reusable and weighs 1/5-1/10th what a comparable potion would (usually with longer duration).

However, since I can't enchant jack squat with my "bigtime" 12 (!) Enchanting Skill, I am limited to the pros for my shiny, new toys

. Since Alchemy was one of my Minor skills as an assassin, I've developed it to about 50-something and have used it to get me out of trouble in emergencies.

With that in mind I did find this rather nice Alchemy chart in PDF format. If you're interested in a color-coded alchemy spreadsheet then you can get it via the link below:

http://www.rpgplanet.com/morrowind/extr ... yChart.pdf

S_S

cjdevito · Post by **cjdevito** » Sun May 26, 2002 5:20 pm

S_S, don't worry about building your enchant skill, it's a complete waste of time. Trust me, I learned the hard way. With enchant 100 and intelligence 100, you'll still fail more then half the time if you try to put more then 50-60 enchant points in an item. Folks who have tested it out say that to reliably successfully fully enchant big items like exquisite jewelry or daedric tower shields, you need an enchant of around 1100 and intelligence of around 1800 (possible with stat-boosting enchanted items, but far more trouble then it's worth).

Far better to simply bite the bullet and pay for the work. Btw, high mercantile and personality really, really helps with the cost... you can cut them down by a factor of 10 if you max both and get the enchanters reaction to 100.

I finally figured out, as an aside, that the economy of the game is balanced... balanced for a character with 100 mercantile and 100 personality, that is. It's the only way that costs actually become feasible without massive cheese tactics.

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Sun May 26, 2002 8:20 pm

Originally posted by Sirius_Sam
It's awfully hard to beat a constant (or even charged) ring simply because it is reusable and weighs 1/5-1/10th what a comparable potion would (usually with longer duration).

A lot of the potions I make with a alchemy skill of ~50 are weightless - 0.0 lbs, or weigh 0.1 lbs at most. I think there is some random element there, but I just sell the ones that weigh anything and keep the ones that are weightless. Now, I love a good enchanted ring, but in combat sometimes switching over to a ring, you will get hammered trying to activate it, but with a potion it takes effect immediately and you don't even have to switch your weapon out. That's why I use enchanted or cast spell healing after I've won a battle, but potions save my ass during one.

cjdevito · Post by **cjdevito** » Sun May 26, 2002 8:23 pm

Yeah, but with a constant effect restore health magnitude 4 ring, you won't need to heal.

Ever.

Seriously, I took down Vivec without ever loosing more then a few hit points this way.

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Sun May 26, 2002 9:31 pm

I dont know, there's times when I want the 15-20 points per second the potion gives me, but whatever. A constant effect healing ring is - how do you say? nice? But a little out of my league at the moment. I like enchanting AND alchemy, if you don't thats fine - I could care less.

Sirius_Sam · Post by **Sirius_Sam** » Sun May 26, 2002 10:01 pm

I actually like the concept of alchemy (the "witchery" of it is appealing), but it's just too limited ingame for some of the obvious accepted uses of plant lore; Namely, poisons and their ilk.

My previous 'wizardly' characters gave a passing nod to alchemy, but the other schools of magic were so obviously more powerful that I never considered it as a main skill to develop. When I started my current assassin character, I was totally psyched to be able to use alchemy as a 'poor man's enchanting'. I thought, before I actually experimented with alchemy, that I would be able to craft a multitude of one-shot magical items like poisoned arrows and the like...*sigh* no such luck

Even though this isn't possible with the Morrowind engine, alchemy is still a very useful skill for most characters, but I think it comes down to gaming style and character choice. For instance, I also have constant regen items (both health and fatigue), nickel-and-dimed +1 or +2 points on all my armor and clothing, plus..I sneak constantly (with 70+% Chameleon)...even when in combat. So I rarely even get attacked (on a lark, I attacked Vivec at level 39 and killed him -after a long chase *whew*- and he couldn't fight what he couldn't see...so I never got hit...not once).

I don't think CJ was diss-ing Alchemy, but it's obvious that some character builds find more efficient ways to achieve the same results, for their particular playing style

S_S

cjdevito · Post by **cjdevito** » Sun May 26, 2002 10:24 pm

I wasn't dissing alcehmy, as I would have thought was clear from my earlier post in this thread where I said:

"Alchemy is cool, no doubt about it."

THE JAKER · Post by **THE JAKER** » Mon May 27, 2002 1:51 am

OK, sorry, maybe I am in a *****y mood tonight....no offense.

Chris Boney · Post by **Chris Boney** » Mon May 27, 2002 5:49 am

Originally posted by cjdevito
Alchemy is cool, no doubt about it. But rocks more then enchant? Nah. Not unless you find some constant effect potions

With a Set of Secret Master's alchemy tools, which are about three times as effective as Grandmaster's, you almost have constant effect potions. And btw, why do you need health regain while you are not fighting? I'd rather have some 30 point regain in both health and magicka for five minutes from one potion, than 4 point regain health constantly all the time. And as far as I know, enchant cannot regain magicka.

cjdevito · Post by **cjdevito** » Mon May 27, 2002 9:15 am

And btw, why do you need health regain while you are not fighting?

Couple of things come to mind...
1 - with a constant restore health of two or more, it's impossible to drown.
2 - vampire in sunlight, needs five or more constant restore health.
3 - it counteracts poison pretty well too, although I'll grant there are more direct methods

And as far as I know, enchant cannot regain magicka.

Not directly, but it can be done. Enchant some spell absorption items and enchent a summon ancestral ghost item. Summon the ghost, whack it a couple of times so it attacks, then the absorption will refill your mana straight away.

Chris Boney · Post by **Chris Boney** » Mon May 27, 2002 11:54 am

Ok, you got a point.. Enchant is better for Vampires

Boney