The cheese sorc spell compilation

[UserUnfriendly]

Finally got he spell table I wanted. for long time added spells to sorc class for fun, but his is my revised 20th version of the cheese sorc. a lot of sorc players have themes, for example, all fire spells, and all mind control spells. this is the cheese sorc, combining the best cheese tech with some perks in spell offense defense.

1
chromatic orb
friends...gotta love those bargins!!
identify
magic missile
sppok...will interrupt dragon spell casts!!!a paniced dragon cannot defend itself!!

2
knock
mirror image...the only protection you need for area effect spell. set up in contingency.
resist fear
stinky cloud...for use with skellies and swords. great with web!
web....eveil spell, 2 web and inc cloud for fun, will not turn victim hostile, so use in certain situations, like in inn of seven vlaes.
3
dispell magic
remove magic..replaced breech with remove. better, by far. area effect and reliable at high level.
haste
melf minute meteors
skull trap...cast in chain, with prot from magic energy, and you have lethal skull fire spell!

4
farsight...cast out of visual range
greater malison
stoneskin
teleport field..use in small area, like dragon lair for disrupting its meellee attacks. equppp ranged weapons, you have about 10 free tuns...it can only do magic...
wiz eye...use with summons.

5
animate dead
cone of cold
chaos
lower resistance
spell immunity

6
death fog....as good as death spell, and I use summons a lot. mandatory.
mislead...try having high level warrior cast mislead from scroll using potion trick, and it can clear mind flayer dungeon in 10 minutes!!!
prot from magic weps
prot from magic energy
true sight
7
delay blast fire ball..for lich killing and evil tricks
mass inv
prot from elements..since I have balderdash patch, multiple castings will not make me immune. but also with prot from energy, it will make you immune. goes wel with mirror image.
projected image....never leave home without it!!
m sword

8 abu dahzim
inc cloud...most evil area effect spell in game!! by far!!
p word blind..funny spell
spell trigger
prot from enregy


9

black blade, for sheer cool ness,its my replacement for "storm bringer" and black razor.
china contingency
shpaechange
timestop
wish.


what you gus think? missing feeble mind and ray of enfeeblement for str drain, but never got either to work reliably. these are all tested cheese spells.

[fable]

Very nice job; but if this is for a party sorc, why do you need Identify? Those Glasses of Identification will do the job, and give your sorc a valuable slot to spend elsewhere.

[ 01-07-2002: Message edited by: fable ]

[UserUnfriendly]

True, however identify is a levl 1 spell, and most of the others suck badly. ANy recommendations to replace identify?

[Fnord]

It doesn't look like you have any spells to deal with spell protections. Even a cheese sorcerer needs some way to deal with the likes of Spell Trap, Spell Shield, or Globe of Invulnerability.

[UserUnfriendly]

Sorry, fnord, coomon and simply untrue misconception about dealing with spell prots. they are useless!!!! the finest spell protection for yourself is mislead and spell immunity. This will block everything, except trap the soul, a demi lich specailty. as for spell protections of liches and mages, by pass them!! one dispell magic and have minsc cast greater whirl wind and shoot full of arrows. area affect spells, like fireball and inc cloud, will totally bypass protections and blast away at target. Spell turning is also not needed, cause I have removed clck26.itm file from my bg2 install, and have the old bounce cloak. spell trap is great, not defensively, but to recharge, and get staff of magi which has 8 hour duration spell trap that also does not spell strike!!!

Spell protections are a JOKE!!!!!
I never bother with a spell that I have a device for, and I only use spells that work ALL the time, and spell strike and such are pretty useless. they only blast spells, so go in with inc cloud and they will fry. also many liches have spell shield, so you waste a valuable 9th level spell on squat.

better to cast inc cloud in area, this will not only bypass lich immunity but also induce casting failure.

cast remove magic, this will strip prot from elements and prot from energy, and let fighters bash or cast a inc cloud and hera them fry.

check the bg spell reference in the game banshee links, fnord, how long have you played sorc? I've fooled with for long time.spell breakers, and save or else spells, are completely useless on a sorc. your basic sorc types are combination blasters, and summons and cheese, like mine, the summon guy, with death spells and all the monster summons, and the blaster, with delay action fireball and other zappers.

remember the untouchables? why bring a knife to a gun fight?

never ever get spell strike, the ruby ray of reversal, and other nonsense. spell prot is even easier, liches cannot cast spells at you until they can true sight you, so you're safe with mislead and spelll immunity.

[DaJir]

not true. warding whip is too cool for words. any spell slinger who warrents you stressing over their spell prots will rebuff with protections at least twice. i say hit em with warding whip and don't worry about it. Once you stip off the best, who cares about the rest.

Ug... that rhymed... i'm so ashamed.

[ 01-07-2002: Message edited by: DaJir ]

[UserUnfriendly]

Dajir has a point, but not the way he intended. warding whip is ok, but dropped in this list cause 7th level spells are too good. warding whip will freeze many, not all lich scripts. they will sometimes go into recycle mode, trying to raise spell protections warding whip took down, and do no offensive spells until its worn off. but my point is spell breakers are too easy to bypass, and too limited in what they do to be worth it. punch past with meelee, or bypass with fireballs and other area weps. and in a tight area, with much collateral damage? remove magic and blast with abu dahzim.

I treat magic shields with enourmous contempt.

I use the best magic protection for my char ever found....

mislead with spell immunity. O laugh at all other spell protectsions!!!

[UserUnfriendly]

for sheer ego based fun, I took 40th level kensai, with obscene thaco, around -22 with holy avenger, and added 3 8th level beholder anti magic rays. and use any item.

beholder anti magic ray is finest spell breaker ever!!!!!

spell turnign does not stop, removes spell trap AND stoneskin and induce complete spell failure for 3 rounds!!! ANd best of all, will not turn blue circle hostile!!! with robe of vecna has cast time around 2!!!

This time I want the fighter stronghold, so will turn kensai into sorc after de arnise hold. you keep thaco and greater whirlwinds, with use any item I like combining holy avenger and staff of magi in quick slots.

[Silvanerian]

And I thought giving my solo paladin grandmastery in his chosen weapon at level 20 with the grandmastery patch enabled was the lowest someone could sink in regards of cheating...how do you find your games fun to play, UserUnfriendly?

-Sylvanerian

[UserUnfriendly]

the challenge for me is to setup stable and effective cheats...

from my ccna back ground, eh?

I work with computers professionally, and its actually quite challenging to setup stable, imaginative hacked chars.

[fable]

Originally posted by UserUnfriendly:
<STRONG>True, however identify is a levl 1 spell, and most of the others suck badly. ANy recommendations to replace identify?</STRONG>

On low levels, I think PfE, Reflected Image and Shield all have their benefits. Sure, they don't matter at higher levels, but when you're starting out, each has its uses. With Identify being duplicative, I've used Shield and Reflected Image with considerable success on different sorcs.

[Fnord]

UserUnfriendly,

I thought this list was intended for a soloing sorcerer. My mistake.

If indeed you were intending to solo a sorcerer, I've found that relying on Dispel and Remove Magic alone can be very frustrating, simply because many of your powerful enemies are of much higher level than you. When I soloed my sorcerer, acquiring the Staff of the Magi was a bit of a catch twenty-two. On the one hand, I wasn't yet of high enough level to take on the Twisted Rune; on the other, getting to a high enough to level to take on the Twisted Rune was difficult without the Staff.

Since Breach doesn't rely on the level of your character to determine whether or not it does what it's supposed to do, I found it to be an invaluable asset. That said, you're clearly more experienced in the arts of sorcery than I am, so I bow before your Cisco-certified wisdom.

Forgive me, but what ridiculous salary do you command with a CCNA? I'm an aspiring networker myself.

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: Fnord ]

[UserUnfriendly]

oh yeah, fnord you're right about breach. but absolutely, breach is simply too important to leave behind unless youre playing the total ego trip uber hacked sorc...still fun cause I plan to build up a library of saved games and try out differetn lich and dragon tactics. man azuredge is a lich killer. its disrupt works right thru stoneskin, I think!!!!

but youre right, breach in a normal sorc is absolutely necessary. breach will take down elemental protections, so a chian contingency I use a lot is remove magic, abu dahzim and abu dahzim again. I call it my armor piercer. but breach should replace the remove magic in most conditions. good spell. but I only have a problem with it as I watched the city gate lich shrug off 2 breaches and shrug off my delay action fireball. grrr....

anyway, breach also has invisibility targetting issues, whereas I have managed to throw a remove magic in an area and taken down enough of the protections so my delay action fireball got thru and killed everyone.


twisted rune? dead easy. get simmy or project image, yes you can get them in chapter 2!!! legally...I think trade meet has some. if youre two low level to cast, buy as many scrolls as you can. in twisted rune, save game, cast farsight and walk in, and trigger dialog. note where the beholder and mage comes in, and the vampire too. reload, and cast project image and trap each location with about 5 delay action fireballs or 7 skulls.

project image will not init dialog, so you've wasted everyone except shangalar, and he can be had if you have some summons ready in the back room area.

ccna? before my medical problems I was making around 50 k a year, but I am also a 3 year Novell cne 3.12 and was going to finish up my ccna ccda and finally get some formal mickeysoft certs. yeah, I was going to sell out...

[Xyx]

The list is missing Contingency, Minor Sequencer, Spell Sequencer and Simulacrum.

Oh, and if you cheat, give Nahal's Reckless Dweomer a try!

Spell protections are cr@p, so removals are even worse. Why shoot a Warding Whip when you could blast the mage to bits with a Skull Trap?

[DaJir]

ah yes, Simulacrum. you can never have too many clone spells, altho for a pure caster simmy doesn't really come into its own until TOB when it starts to cast level 9 spells.

Contingency is a decent spell and all, but what spell would you give up for it at that level? its hardly a must have imo.

why would you want more than one spell trigger type spell on a sorc? never been a fan of minor sequencer nor of spell sequencer (and yes, we all know how much of a fan you are for 3 skull traps in a spell sequencer ). I say one is enough cause you can only have one active at a time anyway. Might as well take the best.

[Littiz]

Wrong, DaJir.
You can have a sequencer for EACH type.
I have all of three active at the same time.
If you rest and change your spell selection,
you'll end with much more "castable" spells.
MAYBE you can leave minor seq. behind,
but Sequencer and Spell Trigger are a must, IMO.
Not speaking about the power, they're fun to use, and I think that not all the good combinations have been discovered yet.
The "existing" ones are already enough, though!


[ 01-11-2002: Message edited by: Littiz ]

[DaJir]

Sorry, but just couldn't resist post'n mine. Don't mind the repetative stuff, i'm somewhat of a speed demon and like to get the most use outa my sorc between rests and stuff that does important things on diff spell levels is good.

Level 1 (5)

Identify
Magic Missle
Chromatic Orb
Protection From Evil(nothing says cheese better than free shots at demons)
Spook


Level 2 (5)

Knock
Blur(can prolly change this one over for web, but i can't seem to pass anything up that lowers saving thows. ;p )
Mirror Image
Strength (for golem cheese. take em from 24 str or so to 18/00, no save, no resist. haste, blur, improv invis, mirror image and wear girdle of bluntness and you can go hand to hand with iron and adman golems... if you're into that sorta thing. they seem to cast that stupid poison cloud alot less also. why is it that buff spells are insanely powerful when used on enemies?)
Glitterdust (debateable, but i love cheap invis detection)


Level 3 (5)

Melf's Minute Meteors
Protection From Normal Missles
Haste
Flame Arrow
Skull Trap


Level 4 (5)

Stone Skin
Improved Invisibility (lovely spell and saving throw help owns.)
Polymorph Self ( how you can live w/o the wonders of mustard jelly i'll never know)
Greater Malison
Minor Globe Invulnerability (don't need it but i like play'n with lightning at low levels, so sue me)


Level 5 (5)

Animate Dead
Feeblemind(gotta love the dragon cheese, but so cheesy i'm even hesitant over use'n it)
Breach(don't see how you could live w/o, i'd take a sure thing over a maybe anyday)
Lower Resistance
Spell Immunity


Level 6 (5)

Mislead!!!!(always always cast outa enemy los and just walk in and attack, clones own and the first clone spell ya get is a doozy)
Death Fog
Spell Deflection
Protection from Magical Weapons
Summon Nishruu(ya ya, i know what you're thinking, but i love use'n it damnit. cast this bad boy behind the enemy casters and its the mordenkain's sword but for magic, not good for dmg but great for distraction.)

(and no, ya don't need true sight. thats what AE spells are for. and plus, nishruu aren't fooled by invis, and invis casters are the most annoying)

Level 7 (5)

Project Image!!!
Mordenkainen's Sword!!!
Khellon's Warding Whip(i don't see how you people take on lichs and high level casters and their millions of in combat spell defenses w/o it)
Summon Hakeshar(can prolly trade this with finger of death or something, but i love magic immune stuff too much to go w/o it)
Limited Wish(can prolly skip it with TOB's new wish spell, but some stuff is too cool even if it is repetative. could replace it spell turning or something, but i'd rather get item or wand to do it)


Level 8 (4)

Abi Dalzin's Horrid Wilting(all purpose peacemaker, don't leave home w/o it)
Power Word Blind(yeah baby yeah)
Spell Trigger(the only trigger i picked, the only one you'll need)
Pierce Magic(spell trap sucks when the enemy uses it and i love spells that pull double duty. love use'n it with chain contingency on those really hard fights. could trade it for incind cloud, but i mostly cast that with scrolls on a clone so...)


Level 9 (4)

Chain Contingency(honestly tho, who needs time stop with this badboy. and the best thing about it is that nothing is immune to it. ;p)
Wish(for the speed demon in us all and really makes that 18 wis you put on your sorc pull its weight. Spell conservation? HA!)
Shape Change(iron golem owns you. magic immune stuff is kewl. makes your simmy pretty good cannon fodder too.)
Spell Strike(god i hate spell protections. must get rid of them all!!! RAAAARR)

[ 01-11-2002: Message edited by: DaJir ]

[UserUnfriendly]

Thank you dajir, about reminding me of the strength spell cheese...since i think I invented it!! Well, give up stinky cloud and relay on staff of air for that baby...

drop blur, if you play kevin patch blurs dont stack, and you can buy the blur cloak at trade meet.

missing dispell and remove magic, or drop remove fro breach. how you can walk around with out dispell magic??? drop polymorph, shapechange is more fun and better shapes...mind flayer and iron golem...a taste of the big metal unit!!!

drop improved invisibility, at high levels mass inv is LONGER and party specific...

I am the proud inventor of the khelbens warding whip as a lich script disrupter, and I got disillusioned with it as it only works for sure on one lich, the city gate lich.

[UserUnfriendly]

new update!!!

drop black blade, go for meteor swarm!!


WHY????

xyx managed to make his opinion of stinky meteor swarm, and i agree it is crappy for 9th level spell, but black blade, if you drain a enemy enough to kill, you could shatter him like with cone of cold, you get the shatter animation, and you lose loot!!!

But, Xyx, buddy, meteor swarm has ONE redeeming feature. inc cloud is the only area effect persistant spell you ever need, and I agree with you, but meteor swarm has ONE redeeming feature...largest radius of any area affect spell in game!!!! Pls check if this is true or typo...for those of us who love cheese tactics, the slightly larger radius could be useful

[Xyx]

Originally posted by DaJir:
<STRONG>Khellon's Warding Whip(i don't see how you people take on lichs and high level casters and their millions of in combat spell defenses w/o it)</STRONG>

Turn Undead works wonders if you have a level 20+ Cleric. It's just too funny to see Liches explode.

Just bashing them in melee never failed me either. Their protections only last 4 rounds. Liches are really slow on their feet, so you can either avoid them until their protections wear off, or you can just Breach them if you're in a hurry.

Then there's the joys of Delayed Blast Fireball. The average Lich does cast Fireshield, but only if you let them live for 10 rounds or so.