Backstabbing?

Fer'or · Post by **Fer'or** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 1:58 am

Howdy.

How do I backstab? Do I just have to make my thief hide in the shadows and hit the enemy in the back? Because I didn't get any strange message when I tried that.

Harbinger · Post by **Harbinger** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 2:03 am

Yes thats all there is to it, use either hide in shadow or invisibility to get behind enemy and stab away. Note you must be directly behind enemy for this to work. Oh yah and you must have the proper weapon equiped like dagger, shortsword, katana, or longsword.

Stilgar · Post by **Stilgar** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 2:53 am

The weapons you canuse for backstabbing have to be usable by thieves. (so staffs and clubs work to).
But not the staff of magi cause it's only usable by mages

Fer'or · Post by **Fer'or** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 12:56 pm

Wow, didn't expect it to be so easy. Thanks!

Phantom Lord · Post by **Phantom Lord** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 4:43 pm

Be careful, backstabbing may lead to severe addiction ...

Stilgar · Post by **Stilgar** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 4:56 pm

Originally posted by Phantom Lord
Be careful, backstabbing may lead to severe addiction ...

And who do you think you are to say that
*hides in shadows*

Try it with the staff of striking sometime (can be purchased in the temple district)

CrownHead · Post by **CrownHead** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 6:12 pm

While we're on the subject of backstabbing and this conversation doesn't seem to be going anywhere, I was wondering,

If you have a cleric/thief and you summon a spiritual hammer, can you backstab with it?

Stilgar · Post by **Stilgar** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 2:59 am

Originally posted by CrownHead
If you have a cleric/thief and you summon a spiritual hammer, can you backstab with it?

Nope a hammer (also a conjured one) is not usable by thiefes.

Luis Antonio · Post by **Luis Antonio** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 9:36 am

Nope a hammer (also a conjured one) is not usable by thiefes.

Can you imagine a Crom Fayr backstab? Wow...

I've never tried this, but can Rangers backstab???

Numinor · Post by **Numinor** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 9:39 am

No, they can't.
The Stalker (Ranger Kit) can do a weaker backstab, up to x3 damage (thieves can get up to x5, assassins up to x7)

Mirk · Post by **Mirk** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 11:32 am

actually, stalker's backstab multiplyer goes up to x4...

CrownHead · Post by **CrownHead** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 12:39 pm

For some reason in the first game you could backstab with a spiritual hammer.

Stalkers backstab goes up to x4? Is this another one of those benefits that's left out in the character details?

Fer'or · Post by **Fer'or** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 4:12 pm

So my ranger (who can hide in shadows) can't backstab?

Bummer

nephtu · Post by **nephtu** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 4:48 pm

No!

No more than an invisible fighter or mage could.

Stalker kit Rangers and thieves (but not swashbucklers) can backstab when using thief-usable weapons in the main hand - and they must be invisible / hide in shadows / misled, etc. - and typically behind the target.

Backstab will not work on creatures with innate see invis (demons, ilithids, dragons) and some creatures, such as golems are immune.

JackOfClubs · Post by **JackOfClubs** » Fri Jan 16, 2004 9:21 pm

Originally posted by Fer'or
So my ranger (who can hide in shadows) can't backstab?

Bummer

Well you can still get a free hit in because they won't attack until after you strike. And a Ranger will have a much better thac0 than a thief.

A nice strategy I use is to have the ranger act as spotter for a mage casting area effect spells (preferably Abi Dalzim or something else that won't harm the Ranger). Then when the enemy has been softened up, he can take down at least one of them without a fight. I guess this is all kind of obvious, but my point is that the inability to use the backstab multiplier is not the only factor in evaluating the Ranger's stealth ability.

garazdawi · Post by **garazdawi** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 4:49 am

Re: No!

Originally posted by nephtu
Stalker kit Rangers and thieves (but not swashbucklers) can backstab when using thief-usable weapons in the main hand

Then crom feyr off hand and celestial fury main hand would work wonders wouldn't it?

Mirk · Post by **Mirk** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 8:53 am

actually, the strength modifier for damage is NOT multiplied by the backstab, it's just added once. so there's not a BIG difference betwenn backstabbing with str 25 and say str 21.

Khrondor · Post by **Khrondor** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 6:42 pm

If your into backstabbing (I am). Do an assasin for the 7x. Also dual class him/her to a fighter for the added damge. Since i was gonna carry the char over to TOB. I went with staffs for Staff of the ram +6. This thing is awesome. Not all staffs can back stab, the +4 one u can buy will though.

I made a level 25/26 assasin/fighter for it. Dont dual class at that high a level unless u do all the quests so u can get as much exp as possible, and you need to get another thief while u are a warrior. Use any item is bugged i think, After i picked my 2 assasin skills (use any item and assinate), I could use any item even as a lvl 1 fighter. Its up to you if u want to exploit this (I didnt).

I also did a Kenais/thief, which worked out better, was more fun, but less damage on back stab. If your doing SOA only, definetly do the assasin. Try to find items to improve THACO, since hitting was my biggest problem at lvl 20 or so. I cant tell you which weapon to use. You might be better off with a long sword or Katana, over a staff for max damage. If you Have TOB, u can do watchers; still play the rest of SOA and use the staff of the Ram +4, which should have good damage, but I never tried it till later.

My char has 100% magic resistance when using Cars. and 50% when using staff of the ram. I have done a 200 point backstab (not a critical either). Average is 120-160. Highest is 386 for a critical. the kensai/thief. uses long swords/scimatar and does about 80-100 or so damage average. which is fine for most mages. He also has 5 attacks a round and got alot more skill points, so I could do traps also.

If u want max (or at least max as far as i can tell) backstab in SOA & TOB. Do the following. ( I did all but the evil path, i should have)

* Level 25/26 assasin/fighter
* MUST GET USE ANY ITEM skill for the assasin's pick
* 5 points in staffs
* 2 points in 2 handed weapons
* 22 STR belt
* Steal the +1 str ring from your high level cleric (he wont need it)
* Take the evil path in Tears of Bhal quest, for the 2 Str ( it is my understanding this stacks with other STR items)
* Use Staff of the Ram+6
* Non detection cloak or Harper pin (Jharia doesnt need it, she does good with Belm and the +3 acid club)
* Gloves with +1 THACO/+2 Damage

Rest is up to you. Basically u are looking for damge, you need to have good THACO also so u can hit. And good AC/ magic resis is nice.

One thing I didnt try was a 24/27 Kensai/thief, with staff as a profeciency. I dont know if the kensai damge bonuses would out weight loosing 2x on back stab. Plus I think u loose assinate, which makes all attacks do back stab damage for how ever long.