Two weapon fighting

shaughn78 · Post by **shaughn78** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 5:11 am

To minimize the penalties you have to have a smaller weapon in your offhand, I have found this to be only daggers & short swords, are there any other weapons that will not increase the pentalties when used in the offhand?

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 7:00 am

no there is not... and as for dual wielding... i use hammers...

Talonsblade · Post by **Talonsblade** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:11 am

dueling

well i find duel wielding with a halfling to be great becouse of there ability to use daggers/short swords with bonuses but you will need a high dex so ty elf's

talyn · Post by **talyn** » Sun Aug 29, 2004 2:45 am

You want a vastly dextrous Elven Ranger wearing studded leather armour. That way you get an AC of 17 (+5 Dex, +2 Armour (?) ) and enjoy the free feats. Then give him Weapon Finesse, and of course reasonably strength. Then give him a Short Sword in his off hand (Thy Dunag Blade early on) and a long or bastard in his main hand. That way he's pretty likely to hit with the Longsword, and likely to hit with the Short. It's only my opinion and what I've found works best, but yes.

Heidrek · Post by **Heidrek** » Mon Aug 30, 2004 6:42 pm

is using a short sword in the off hand necessary in IWD2? I haven't seen it mentioned in the rules anywhere. As far as I can see you get the same penalties regardless of the weapons you dual wield. Also does the Weapon Finesse feat stack with Strength? I know it doesn't give a damage bonus, only a to-hit one which is a shame. I'm thinking of using Golden Heart of Harper in the off hand for Haste/Free movement/bonus HP and main handing some disabling weapon like Scimitar of Souls+3 for it's energy drain.

My Bard only has 12 strength (while wearing Mercy Killer belt) so he doesn't dish out the damage too much, but he won't have to if he's disabling opponents with his weapon abilities.

Mirk · Post by **Mirk** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 1:25 am

the rules say that the off-hand weapon has to be "light" to get -2 main hand / -2 off-hand penalty. only shortswords (and daggers) are considered to be light. weilding any other weapon in the off hand will cause -4/-4 penalties.

hand axes (mostly found in prologue) say something like "used in off-hand" in their description. however, since they are not tagged "light" by the game, the get you -4/-4, if used in the off-hand.

weapon finesse does not stack with str.

scimitars cannot be used with weapon finesse (no matter how high is you Dex, the hit roles are still influenced by Str)

oh, and by the way, Scimitar of Souls is crappy. man, i waited to get this weapon... but when i got it, i was SO disappointed! the DC of the effects the scimitar has are 14 or so, and almost every enemy (well, one who is worth the trouble of draining his levels, anyway) will save against it. as to the Dispell effect, I've found it doing more harm than good, as it dispells all those nifty stuns-holds-emotions-etc. my spellcasters worked so hard to put up. i ended up using a regular +4 scimitar, relying on the Dirty Fighting feat for enemy desabiliating (sp?).

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:10 am

Ambidexterity - You are equally adept atusing either hand.
Prerequisites: Dexterity of +15 or greater.
Benefit: You ignore all penalties for using an off hand. You are neither left-handed nor right-handed.
Normal: Without this feat, a character suffers a -4 penalty to his or her off hand attacks while using two weapons.

Two-Weapon Fighting - You can fight with a weapon in each hand. You can make one extra attack each round with the second weapon.
Benefit: Your penalties for fighting with two weapons are reduced by 2.
Special: The Ambidexterity Feat reduces the attack penalty for the second weapon by 4.

Weapon Finesse - You are especially skilled at using daggers and short swords, which allows you to benefit as much from Dexterity as from Strength.
Prerequisite: Proficient with small blade, base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: With the selected weapon, you may use your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier on attack rolls. Since you need your second hand for balance, if you carry a shield, apply the shield's armor check penalty to your attack rolls.

Interesting point here. On the weapon finesse feat, it states: "Since you need your second hand for balance, if you carry a shield, apply the shield's armor check penalty to your attack rolls." So what happens if you are using two small baldes instead of one small balde and a sheild? Also, it says you "may". That to me means there is way for you to turn it on/off, but I have yet to see anyway. Anybody else have any ideas?

Heidrek · Post by **Heidrek** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 3:46 pm

Ok so normal penalty for Dual weilding is -8 to both main hand and off hand.

Dual wielding feat makes this -4 main -8 off hand
ambidexterity makes it -4 to both.

Using a shortword or other small weapon in the off hand makes this -2 on both? I know this is the case in pen and paper rules, but is it like that in IWD2 as well? I hvaen't seen this in the IWD2 rules but I may have missed it

Also does your off hand only get 1/2 the benefit of your strength bonus like it's supposed to in 3rd Ed. rules?

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:06 pm

yes yes yes yes yes yes yes .... yes you have missed it...

Heidrek · Post by **Heidrek** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 6:27 pm

[QUOTE=Wrath-Of-Egg]yes yes yes yes yes yes yes .... yes you have missed it...[/QUOTE]

He He He! Time to break out Golden Heart of Haper in the main hand and Brilliant Shortsword + 5 in the offhand. This way I get most attacks from my more damaging weapon, haste, bonus HP and freedom of movement, while my offhand weapon ignores armour and shields giving it a pretty good chance to hit (the +5 doesn't hurt either!)

Do Clubs count as a short weapon? Monkey Paw of Discipline might be a good offhander for it's extra main hand strike. My bard has 3 attacks as a base, with haste (from harper) and extra attack from Monkey Paw he'll go up to 5, 3 of which will be at his highest base attack!

As most opponents seem to save in HoF, I think I'll have him cast Emotion: Hope when a fight starts to up his attack and damage, then start swinging - He could become quite a force in Melee combat! Can also lob a Chrmatic Orb/Horror or cast Ghost Armour on himself at the start of each round too!

Has anyine else noticed that you can cast a spell and attack in the same round but not cast 2 spells? Seems strange. I checked this and the attacks are not just 'scenery' they can actually still hit. I have often had my Sorceror or Bard cast Chromatic Orb and see if it paralyses them, then as soon as the spell is away, start slinging stun arrows etc. if it doesnt.

Mirk · Post by **Mirk** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 1:07 am

clubs do not count as light weapons. if you want an off-hander that will provide you with an extra attack, what you want to find is Short Sword of Flurry +3.

also, you should know that:

1. an extra-attack weapon in the off-hand will provide the extra attack for the main hand. you always have one attack only with the off-hand.

2. max number of attacks/round is 5. this includes haste, off-hand, all of it. so when your char hits BAB of +16/+11/+6/+1, you don't need an extra attack, as you will have the maximum - 16/11/6/1 main hand, 16 off-hand.

3. in fact, if this char is hasted, it would be better for him to lose the off-hand weapon, as he will get a better chance to hit and better protection (no -2 penalty, possibilty for a shield). I personnaly never do it, because duel-weilding is all about (well, some about) looking coooool...

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 7:15 am

[QUOTE=Heidrek]Do Clubs count as a short weapon? Monkey Paw of Discipline might be a good offhander for it's extra main hand strike. My bard has 3 attacks as a base, with haste (from harper) and extra attack from Monkey Paw he'll go up to 5, 3 of which will be at his highest base attack![/QUOTE]
In the case of dual weilding, only weapons that are labeled as Simple Weapon: Small Blade.

Heidrek · Post by **Heidrek** » Thu Sep 02, 2004 6:05 pm

Oh Well, Sword and Shield it is then. Not so Bad I suppose. I can spend my feats on Spell focus and perhaps Armoured Arcana to offset my small shield arcane failure. My Bard is curently 16 th level with 3 rougue levels too so I should get another attack in a couple of levels anyway, with Golden Heart Of Harper in hand that will give me my max 5 attacks per round. Just need to get the Spiny Black Urchin for it's Retribution effect and we're in business.