A C Milan!!!!

[C Elegans]

Gerrard was definately the MotM to me!

He was nowhere to be seen in the first half and didn't have much influence in the second

Seriously, Gerrard was totally invisible the first half, and he only influenced the 2nd half partly. Riise was better in Liverpool, I think.

If you don't think Kaka had much influence in the 1st half, you may have missed his passes that lead to several goal chances and also to the 2-0 and 3-0 goals.

BTW: giles337 was referring to the hand ball that Nesta made in the first half. They digitally zoom in on that at half time on Dutch TV, and Johan Cruyff said it was a penalty.

The Swedish TV-commentators did not think that was a penalty, even though one of commentators (Glenn Hysen) played for Liverpool during his player career.

Do you see any evidence that suggests we are better than hamsters?

[Rudar Dimble]

[QUOTE=C Elegans] He was nowhere to be seen in the first half and didn't have much influence in the second

Seriously, Gerrard was totally invisible the first half, and he only influenced the 2nd half partly. Riise was better in Liverpool, I think.[/QUOTE]
But it wasn't Gerrards task in the first half to run all over the place and to play a central role. In the second half it was his task...and he did it outstanding. And in the extra time he had to play a right winger, which he isn't used to do, and he did a great job! He was covering people, setting up counter attacks and motivated his team members when they wer 3-0 down.

Kaka gave one or two assist, but IMHO not because they were great passes, but because of slappy defense from Liverpool. Traore played like a 6 year old in the first half. Besides those two passes he did nothing of any importance in 120 (!!) minutes of football..very disappointing. When he was taking a penalty in the shoot out I was like: "Oh right, he was on the field for 120 minutes aswell!"

[QUOTE=C Elegans]
The Swedish TV-commentators did not think that was a penalty, even though one of commentators (Glenn Hysen) played for Liverpool during his player career.[/QUOTE]
With all respect, but I would always prefer Cruyff's opinion above Hysen's ..the guy almost invented modern age football and is in the top 3 of best player's ever and he won several championships and European Cups as a trainer. He made players like Bergkamp, Rijkaard, Van Basten, etc into world class players.

[C Elegans]

But it wasn't Gerrards task in the first half to run all over the place and to play a central role.

Hehe, football like politics is a lot about personal opinion, but I interpreted Gerrards 1st half as he was actually efficiently removed and pushed back from his "pass-delivering" role by an efficient Milan defense - a defense that totally crumbled during the first 10 mins of the 2nd half.

With all respect, but I would always prefer Cruyff's opinion above Hysen's

Oh, I don't doubt for a second that Cruyff was a far greater player than Hysen, I just meant that Hysén was strongly parital for Liverpool (he made no secret of that, which I think was good - better to state openly that your are biased instead of faking that you are objective when you are not at all) but still he did not think that was a penalty for Liverpool.

[giles337]

Personally, My MOTM would have to be Jamie Carragher for Liverpool, if not Jerzy Dudek. They both plaed pivotal roles in the Liverpool defence, as after the first half at least, were flawless.

[C Elegans]

In the news it was reported that 20% of Liverpools working population took sick-leave today I wonder if this had any association to the 10 000 bottles of champagne that was reported sold today

EDIT: The BBC news reports that the FA has already decided that Everton will take the 4th Premier League place, and they will try to lobby the UEFA to allow Liverpool defend their title next season.

How sad if the defending champions would not be allowed to compete!

From BBC:

"We cannot change the rules in the middle of the season, we cannot take another team out of the competition for Liverpool," Uefa spokesman William Gaillard told BBC Radio Five Live.

"We can discuss the changes for the future but not for next season. It is the Football Association who must decide between Liverpool and fourth placed Everton and they have chosen Everton."

The FA's chief executive Brian Barwick said he would continue to lobby Uefa to try and get Liverpool a special exemption.

[Yshania]

[QUOTE=Minerva]Well, this is the first time for some time that the news headline is actually "Liverpool won!", instead of "xxx(any English team) won, but there's trouble outside of stadium...

It's been the case each time English teams played in major tournament abroad, there're troubles there. Fighting, stabbing, bandalism... leaving all sorts of mess behind.

So, congraturations to Liverpool fans for having good time without causing troubles in Istanbul. [/QUOTE]

I shudder every time I read a reference to football violence, especially since the accusing finger is more often pointed at English fans than not. I accept there is a very real history of violence involving English fans, and a few years ago certain English club names were synonymous with organised violence (teams like Leeds, Millwall, Luton, West Ham but to name a few) For the most part, these "organised" units existed outside of the game, and football was a vehicle for their aggression. I am not in any way trying to condone their behaviour.

What I would like to point out, though, is such occasions are now fewer and farther between, though incidences may still raise their ugly heads were it not for the general policing of international events (rarely do we see such issues between domestic teams in the UK now)

Let us not forget - yesterday was the 20th anniversary of the Heysel Stadium disaster which saw English teams banned from European tournaments for five years. Poor organisation took risks, and Italian fans were noted to have instigated the riot, yet it was Italian fans that died (innocent poeple) but Liverpool (and England) were blamed.

Years later, Leeds Utd arrived in Istanbul to play Galatasaray and were "welcomed to hell" according to flags and banners flown by local fans. Two Leeds fans were stabbed to death in resulting violence. Each side claimed they were provoked (the Turkish claiming Leeds fans had verbally abused their women and abused their national flag by wiping it on their backside).

You would think that the officials and management in football would subsequently remain mature enough to try and neutralise emotions when the English and Turkish national teams met in Euro 2004, yet the Turkish coach, Senol Gunes, openly accused England as having a "hidden agenda" (as here) when England requested the game be played behind closed doors to avoid conflict.

Yet England are warned, any violence - and they will be banned. The outcry here was that the Turkish manager was trying to have England expelled from the competition by deliberately riling fans to the point of conflict. It didn't happen.

A little interesting read on the subject Efforts to curb football violence

Back on topic. We should have a Mod change the title of the thread!

Way to go Liverpool!!!

Fair play to them. Liverpool played Juventas, without a hint of a repeat of Heysel. They go on to play in Istanbul, without a hint of a repeat of Leeds/Galatasaray or England/Turkey politics. They were not out played for the most part, they showed amazing courage, and they took the trophy for keeps this time! Even if they are not allowed to defend their title, they own this particular cup for having earned it a fifth time. And their fans were a credit to English football.

If I was not a Sheffield Wednesday fan looking forward to the Championship playoffs this weekend, I might well adopt the 'Pool. I am chuffed for them, their passion is infectious...I wish Dudek could teach our goalie the Dudek shuffle! (A legacy of Bruce Grobelaar!)

A memorable final indeed!

[Sytze]

Well, you cannot believe the criticism, scorn and laughter I received and will receive the next couple of days. My Dutch friends were more than willing to confront me with Milan's loss more than ones, especially after they eliminated Ajax in last years' tournament and PSV in this tournament. They couldn't believe I would support a foreign team above a national team.
Not only that, my dad apparently watched the entire game (which is a surprise really, since he's getting older and needs to get up quite early the next day to go to work), and even he sent me an sms, saying "wasn't ac a huge failure, boy!"

Yes, days are fun when people can annoy you, instead of you them.

Anyway, I don't think Liverpool was better. Except for those nasty, nasty 15-20 minutes in which AC's defense crumbled, I think Milan simply dominated. There was no question about it. Except for those three chances, have you seen more?
Furthermore, I was pleased to see the fair-play shown in this match. No ridiculous assaults on someone's legs. There were no fights, even the referee was left alone, although he made some mistakes (I don't know if Nesta's incident was a penalty, I didn't watch the commentary which followed after the game), and even the fans behaved nicely. A worthy final, if you ask me. Too bad Milan lost, though.
As for the MotM, I'm not sure who I would give that honor too. Kaka and Riise certainly deserved it. Perhaps even Dida. Did you see the penalty’s he stopped? Amazing how he can stretch so far. I don't think Gerrard or Dudek earned it, for the first one was, like CE said, nowhere to be seen in the first half. And Dudek, well, he is a clown and you cannot trust him. He stopped some badly shot penalty's, okay, but he's so unreliable as a monkey on dope.

@Ysh: hell no, that would mean I wrote a thread hailing Liverpool. We can't have that! Although I have to admit that, from all the English clubs, I prefer Liverpool above any other.

[Rudar Dimble]

[QUOTE=Sytze]Well, you cannot believe the criticism, scorn and laughter I received and will receive the next couple of days. My Dutch friends were more than willing to confront me with Milan's loss more than ones, especially after they eliminated Ajax in last years' tournament and PSV in this tournament. They couldn't believe I would support a foreign team above a national team.[/QUOTE]
I believe you...I support the British teams above all other teams, while I'm Dutch. And when England plays against the Netherlands, I support the English.

[QUOTE=Sytze]
Anyway, I don't think Liverpool was better. Except for those nasty, nasty 15-20 minutes in which AC's defense crumbled, I think Milan simply dominated. There was no question about it.[/QUOTE]
Ow, how do I hate it when people say: "there's no question about it", when it comes to opinions ! I think there is a question about it, because I think Liverpool were the better team...so please, don't make your opinion look like a fact.

[QUOTE=Sytze]As for the MotM, I'm not sure who I would give that honor too. Kaka and Riise certainly deserved it. Perhaps even Dida. Did you see the penalty’s he stopped? Amazing how he can stretch so far. I don't think Garragher or Dudek earned it, for the first one was, like CE said, nowhere to be seen in the first half. .[/QUOTE]
CE was talking about Gerrard...not Carragher. BTW: it was so cool to see Carragher in pain, while he continued playing. No, I'm not sadistic, it's just why I love British football so much.

[C Elegans]

They couldn't believe I would support a foreign team above a national team.

I have the same problem. I support the teams whos football I love and the countries whos football traditions I love, and that is certainly not Sweden. Swedish club football really suck, it's slow, lack in technical skill and I don't like the mentality. When Sweden play against Brazil, I support Brazil since I always view Brazil as worthy winners. When Sweden play England, I support both equally.
One of the main reasons I like Milan is because Cafu, Kaka and Dida is there. There are many players I like, and in club football I've been an Arsenal supporter since I was a child, but at national level and single player level, I think Brazil is outstanding, they play The Beautiful Game most beautifully of all.

No, I'm not sadistic, it's just why I love British football so much.

I agree, the aspect of English football I really like, is the immense moral among the players. You get the feeling that even if they lost their limbs, they would go off the field to get some stitches and then continue playing even if they were creeping

[Sytze]

[QUOTE=Rudar Dimble]Ow, how do I hate it when people say: "there's no question about it", when it comes to opinions ! I think there is a question about it, because I think Liverpool were the better team...so please, don't make your opinion look like a fact.[/QUOTE]
I thought that might annoy people, but I think that really was how it was. Liverpool barely made it to AC's goal, barely had any possession of he ball, while AC did made and had all those things. Liverpool wasn't the better team, they played defensive, had some luck in the extra time when Shev had those two huge chances and were tired beyond believe. Perhaps they played smart, but they weren't better.


[QUOTE=Rudar Dimble]CE was talking about Gerrard...not Carragher. BTW: it was so cool to see Carragher in pain, while he continued playing. No, I'm not sadistic, it's just why I love British football so much.[/QUOTE]
Err, that was a mistake on my part, I meant Gerrard, but somehow came up with Carrager. Blame the early rising today.

[Rudar Dimble]

[QUOTE=Sytze]I thought that might annoy people, but I think that really was how it was. Liverpool barely made it to AC's goal, barely had any possession of he ball, while AC did made and had all those things. Liverpool wasn't the better team, they played defensive, had some luck in the extra time when Shev had those two huge chances and were tired beyong believe. Perhaps they played smart, but they weren't better.[/QUOTE]
Well, that's your opinion. I disagree...but isn't that the beauty of opinions?

[Sytze]

True. Did you saw the news this morning, by the way? Around 110.000 supports, fans, and other spectators came to support and cheer for the Liverpool team. It looked awesome.

[Rudar Dimble]

Indeed it looked cool.
But to be honest it was nothing compared to the crowd that gathered when Barcelona won the title in Spain a week ago.

[Sytze]

That I missed. What I did see, was that the chairman spoke of a life-long contract for Rijkaard. And now I wonder what the consequences would have been if he would not have won the title...

[Dottie]

[QUOTE=Sytze]
Furthermore, I was pleased to see the fair-play shown in this match. No ridiculous assaults on someone's legs. There were no fights, even the referee was left alone, although he made some mistakes (I don't know if Nesta's incident was a penalty, I didn't watch the commentary which followed after the game), and even the fans behaved nicely.[/QUOTE]

This I agree with. It's really refreshing to se such clean games, though I think the quality in champions league is generarly quite high.

[giles337]

Indeed, It was nice to see such great support from the fans. Especially considering the last round against Juventus, where liverpool fan's attempting to bury hatchets, and close wounds from heysel, were openly rejected, and insulted by the Juve fans.

[C Elegans]

Good news! Today it was decided that Liverpool will be allowed to defend their title next season They will have to go through the first qualifications steps, but that should pose no problem for the defending champions.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/footbal ... 613695.stm

[Kipi]

Well, they didn't have any other option than let Liverpool play
But hey, I'm not complaining, because Liverpool has IMO one of the best defenders, Sami Hypia (yes, I'm from Finland )