The Cheese Guild

Moleman · Post by **Moleman** » Wed Nov 07, 2001 9:52 am

This thread is pretty much saturated by cheese already, but this I don't recall reading from this thread yet:

How to take Drow equipment to the surface? While in Underdark, load one NPC with all equipment you want to save (Jaheira for instance), and remove her from the party. If you choose Jaheira she'll go to Harper Hold and says you'll find her from there. OK, then travel away from Underdark to the Harper hold, and voila, all the drow equipment is intact Jaheira's inventory. You can keep the equipment as long as you keep away from the Underdark Exit -map.

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Wed Nov 07, 2001 3:29 pm

Sorry, moleman, every one knows that one already. In fact, this is why I have kevin patch installed, cause to get drow items after the kevin patch installed is impossible.

an even more evil way, mentioned by someone, or the cheat guide, is to use a human relay method. in the underdark after you are led to the entrance of the surface, you can actually use a human relay method. someone mentioned the trigger for disintegrating drow items is to have the items in inventory after passing thru a specific portal, so if you have a non carrying npc pass thru the portal and "toss" him/her the items via standard inventory move, the function is not triggered. this is in fact simlar to the jaheira or cernd item spoof, when you face faldorn in druid grove, have another npc carry all of her junk, and stand near the duel pit. when she is challenged, she will be in the duel pit without items, open inventory screen and pass her her armor and weps so she can use them in duel.

drow items are good, but not that killer in my opinion, since all my armor are chosen for specific reasons, like jaheira always carry aegirs hide armor, which is medicre protection but provides important chaos confusion immunity. korgy gets gorgon plate for elemental protection. this is important since he always wears helm of charm protection for the incredibly annoying dominate spell every mage in the game tries to toss at you.

baudib · Post by **baudib** » Thu Nov 08, 2001 1:38 am

Is this cheese?

I used to use this tactic against mindflayers:

Have party standing two rooms away, send invisible mage w/chaotic commands open door, toss in cloudkill, and scurry away. He slams door and waits with the rest of the party.

I used this because I thought it was a legitimate tactic; for one, the mindflayers can cheese you themselves, they can psionic blast/stun your entire party even on the other side of the door. In a PnP game, I would argue that a strong fighter (w/chaotic commands) could block the flayers from opening the door.

Of course, for some reason, the cloudkill tends to kill even creatures with MR. I'm not sure if this is implemented properly or not, because sometimes the MR will save them from a few hits, but standing in a room full of cloudkill will get you eventually.

I used to post this tactic on the BIO board and maybe the designers thought it was cheesy, because cloudkill won't kill mindflayers in TOB.

Anyway, I feel justified in doing this because some of my favorite PnP tactics don't work in this game! For instance, minor globe of invulnerability SHOULD stop collateral damage from a wand of lightning, but it doesn't.

Saruman · Post by **Saruman** » Thu Nov 08, 2001 2:25 am

Most uses of the cloudkill spell are indeed very cheesey, especially when combined with invisibility for the casting mage. The reason that it is so cheesy is that enemy AI is so poor that the monsters just stand around in a cloud of choaking nastyness until they are dead, any good PnP DM would never let that happen, even if the Monsters couldn't see the caster due to invisibilty they would still act in some way to remove themselves from the cloud of poison gas and to find and kill the afore mentioned wizard (perhaps using speculative fire)

baudib · Post by **baudib** » Thu Nov 08, 2001 2:45 am

well, in fact, they are going after the mage, even launching psionic blasts at him. Even launching psionic blasts at him through a door. they are not just standing around helpless. Would you think it was cheesy if you casta fireball and close a door? The illithids do not stand around helplessly, they are attacking and even heal themselves.

There is a problem with the AI in that a panicking creature should run as far away from the cloud as possible.

I would argue that if you have a fighter wearing a girdle of giant and protected with chaotic commands that the mindflayers are doing everything in their power to break through the door, but can't.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Thu Nov 08, 2001 11:58 am

You could make a script

IF
Taking damage // if im takking damage
good cutoff //And no npcs are about
THEN
Run // Legit

bbbrisco · Post by **bbbrisco** » Thu Nov 29, 2001 5:06 pm

Can't let the mighty cheese thread lie fallow. I didn't notice this particular item in the list:

At the start, if you're soloing a character without clerical powers, 2 cure lights don't really cut it for healing. If you have a con of 17+ (and what cheese-meister doesn't?), and cast Draw Upon Holy Might before resting, you get 20+ which regens. This should only give you a fraction of a HP (regens at 1/6 turns, and DUHM lasts 1 turn), but it seems to always heal my chars of lots of damage
(around 50-60+ it seems).

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Thu Nov 29, 2001 11:38 pm

Ebrone - welcome to the forum(s) and what a truly mighty first post. Fresh cheese. - Curdis

Littiz · Post by **Littiz** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 3:32 am

Gasp, I'm always late!!!!!
There are a lot of things to say about cheese.
I only say that I try not to use, and to "compensate" the lacks of the enemy AI.
For example I DO NOT use fog of war.
I consider that make preparations for the combat the most cheesy way to play.
You can make some only in very rare occasions
(such as Demo. You can suspect that, if you
free him, he can be dangerous), or when your
thief scouts what lies ahead.
I think it's much funnier to imagine what the
chars could really live, and experimenting the panic sometimes!!!!!
What do you think?

About a cheesy tactic: I use often mislead,
sending away my copy, and I've seen it's
considered as cheese.
But why?
It's a good interpretation of the spell, IMO.
I know they can see me if they kill my copy,
so I send it away!
Even a PnP mage could do it!

Kovi · Post by **Kovi** » Sat Dec 01, 2001 9:35 am

All illusion spells are cheesy. They are defined (and implemented) badly. For mislead:
the original description said: "the image will remain close to the caster mimicking all of the caster's action". So it is an "improved" mirror image: the opponent can't target you as they are "mislead" by the image. Later they have probably changed the description to match the implementation. But do you think you could be able to trick them without the image.

Kovi · Post by **Kovi** » Sat Dec 01, 2001 10:41 am

Additional tricks/cheese (from the experience of my solo shapeshifter without items).

The usual Con heal tricks: I have low con (6), so when I change back from Werewolf I the hp difference is "healed". When turned to GWW a 1/round regenration occurs.

Single weapon trick: the single weapon prof is used with (most) claws. One slot gives -1 AC and +1 to critical hit (19).

Nature's Beauty. It is almost a cheese in itself: permanent blindness with no save. But here comes the biggest cheese: it won't reveal invisibility! Very interesting: how can they see an invisible beauty?

No cheese: Magic Resistance DO reveal invisibility.

Soome nasty bugs (and possible cheese against shapshifters):

Dispel magic always dispels the claws (like a magically created weapon).

Silence prevents shapechange (as an innate spell).

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Tue Dec 04, 2001 3:29 am

I tried out Craig's wonderful bit 'o contingency cloning cheddar, and it works perfectly.

For those who missed it, it works like this:

Have a Projected Image or Simulacrum cast Contingency, Chain Contingency, Minor Sequencer, Spell Sequencer or Spell Trigger.
Select another party member before the clone finishes casting (which will be almost instantly in the case of the contingencies, so you'll have to use the keyboard).
The selected character now opens his/her spellbook for you to construct the sequencer or contingency.

You can even have your Ranger/Clerics build Chain Contingencies this way.

[ 12-07-2001: Message edited by: Xyx ]

Amidala · Post by **Amidala** » Fri Dec 07, 2001 9:51 am

You know it´s cheese:
Use 1-3 Fighters (Paladin, etc.) equip them with good weapons, armors and maybe regeneration items.
Activate the standard script.
When ever you encouter enemys simply watch them hacking everything to pieces, so you dont need to play the game, just watch.
Works 99% of the time.

Kovi · Post by **Kovi** » Fri Dec 07, 2001 11:00 am

Originally posted by Amidala:
<STRONG>You know it´s cheese:
Use 1-3 Fighters (Paladin, etc.) equip them with good weapons, armors and maybe regeneration items.
Works 99% of the time.</STRONG>

Hmmm, you are probably using some advanced scripts. With such auto-play I usually ended up with dead party-members (not to mention a dominated/mazed PC).

Amidala · Post by **Amidala** » Fri Dec 07, 2001 12:22 pm

Well my dwarven Babarian & Korgan have negative saves and Keldorn is close to it.
Now add the 70% magic resistance of Keldorn and the fighter rages for lots of imunity.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Sat Dec 15, 2001 3:22 pm

AI scripts ARE predictable, going against a lich fire and evil protection, drow?Invisabiity
it goes on and on none of them have their OWN tactics

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Sat Dec 15, 2001 7:27 pm

[url="http://www.gamebanshee.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=008377"]This[/url] cheese should have an elevated spot in this thread.

[ 12-15-2001: Message edited by: Bruce Lee ]

[ 12-15-2001: Message edited by: Bruce Lee ]

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Sun Dec 16, 2001 7:38 am

Originally posted by Bruce Lee:
<STRONG>[url="http://www.gamebanshee.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=008377"]This[/url] cheese should have an elevated spot in this thread.</STRONG>

Yes indeed.

Here's the well-earned reward:

RobertC · Post by **RobertC** » Thu Dec 20, 2001 1:51 am

Remember the earlier stated cheese about using restoration to get your simmy's levels back? After this, use simmy's SoTM to put up a spell trap and let him eat a few spells. Should bring his high levels right back

.

RobertC · Post by **RobertC** » Thu Dec 20, 2001 10:56 pm

Are you going to acknowledge my cheese, Xyx?

Am I not worthy?