Sorc or mage, and why?

[fable]

Just those two professions. Which would you play in NWN2, and why? Why not the other? If you play some other profession, that's nice, but please don't comment. Thanks!

[darkpark]

I'd play a wizard since I like having the flexibility of memorizing different sets of spells depending on the situation (or strategy). A sorcerer, on the other hand, is stuck with the spells he/she picks durning level-up/char-creation.

As far as the number of spells either one gets isn't an issue in NWN2 since resting takes only a few seconds and can be done in many places. Thus a spell caster can quickly regain used up spells.

On the other hand, if I were playing the main camp. a second time than I might select a sorcerer since I know what to expect and can pick the appropriate spells that I know will be effective.

[Siberys]

Honestly, I'd rather have the convenience of options rather than more of the same stuff. I'd rather have every single spell in my spellbook that I can prepare that day, I don't like being limited to certain spells even if I get a lot of them per day.

[dragon wench]

Assuming NWN2 is like NWN1 and its expansions... Once I get the game, among the many characters I'll invariably create, I'll certainly build a sorcerer.

I have always preferred sorcerers over wizards because the reality is that I'd rather have a full slate of good spells I can cast many times per day over an entire selection, of which at least 40% are utterly useless.

[Boduro]

I totally agree with Dragon Wench. I prefer the sorcerer.

[Snipercon]

Another possible consideration is item creation. Theoretically after memorizing many spells, a wizard would not have to worry about the spell component of items. On the other hand, if a sorceror wanted to create items they would have to stock scrolls or waste spell picks on otherwise useless spells (light).

As far as combat is concerned the sorceror has more spells and the versitility of offense or defense whenever required. The wizard has bonus feats hopefully to make a few spells highly effective.

Conclusion, one on one the wizard might have a slight edge with the bonus feats. Multiple encounters with various minions, the sorceror will have a MUCH easier time.

My preference... multiclass wizards - they get spell levels faster and are a favored class

[Fljotsdale]

Also based on NWN, I preferred sorcerers all the way; they have the ability to cast a particular spell several times in a row, and a Mage was stuck with how many times he had memorised it at the expense of other valuable spells.

Sure, the set of spells a Sorcerer will know are limited in comparison to the set a Mage will learn - but the Mage, unless he has learnt a spell several times over, can cast each one only once; a Sorcerer can cast each of her spells over and over - which is VERY useful when you are faced with opponents who are only vulnerable to one particular spell type - your Mage will run out of effective spells long before your Sorcerer does.

Which isn't to say Mages are not effective: they are. But you need to be VERY careful when selecting and planning Mage spell memorisation.

[JCDenton]

Playing a mage in NWN2 is a breeze. It takes five seconds of rest to memorize the spells you have, even if there are enemies in your visibility range (but not attack range).

2-3 area effect spells and all enemies are dead anyway, so you dont actually need more. Those that are left can easely be put to death by magic missile or acid arrow (1st and 2nd level spells that you have enough of)

Playing a mage (with good spell selection) is comforting, because you can prepare different defensive and offensive spells according to the threat. Like going through elemental-based traps with "energy buffer". Or get rid of zombies with "undeath to death"

There are also a lot of nice utility spells like "knock" and attribute-enchancers. For instance, I use eagle`s splendor before many conversations. The +4 or +6 charisma bonus gives a nice modifier to my diplomacy skills

The list goes on and on. Wizard has always been a very flexible class that can more or less simulate every ability the other classes have except of stealing stuff.

And healing. But there ARE high level arcane healing spells, "Simbul`s Synostodweomer" perhaps the most famous one... but sadly it is not in the game An idea for modders perhaps? I`m sure the Simbul will provide a copy if they ask her nicely

[Stilgar]

Sorcerer.

Cause i feel (in an RP way) that magic is something you have or you don't.
You can stimulate it to grow more and more powerfull, but it shouldn't be something you can learn like the wizzard can.
.

[Tricky]

Depends on the school. For transmutation I'd totally go for a sorcerer, it justifies focussing on either charisma or willpower. I'm working on a 19 charisma, 22+(and more to come) wisdom build. High will saves + high fortitude (once I transform). 19 charisma will give me that final transformation spell and aint too bad for my bluff checks either. So 19 charisma is more than enough. Why be good at casting spells when you can just.. maul them?

I wonder if wearing charisma items will give you access to spell levels...

[Magrus]

It depends on what I am going for. If I am going for an all out killing machine, I will pick Sorcerer. If I want a caster that has skills and variety, I will pick Wizard. I tend to pick a wizard far more often than a sorcerer due to my wanting to have skills and the bonus feats they get.

Right now, I am playing a Wizard (Necromancer)/ Pale Master/ Eldritch Knight. It's working out fairly well too. I have 4 Item Creation feats, and I can wield martial weapons. Mixing Extend Spell with Bulls Strength, Cats Grace, Greater Magic Weapon, Haste, Mage Armor and Shield I have quite the ability to tear through enemies in combat hand-to-hand. Short of that, I can always go onto a default of fireballs and magic missiles, or the fun and exciting polymorph spell. Or maybe toss Enervation at the boss that got in my way, with Ray of Enfeeblement, and then tear him apart with my sword.

[mr_sir]

First time through it will probably be a sorceror, just for the power and the number of spell casts they get. Once I get a feel for the game I will no doubt switch to a specialised mage as I find these offer a bit more of a challenge (at least they did in NWN1 + expansions) and when I replay games I tend to roleplay a lot more rather than just go for the best possible build (as that gets boring after a while, at least I find that it does).

[NeoTiamat]

Oooh, hard choice. Going by the original (I don't have NWN2 just yet...bleh)

For lower levels (before 15 or so), I prefer Wizards. They get several extra feats over the course of the game, which is always good, and they get new spells a level faster. Getting that Fireball a dungeon or two earlier can be extremely useful.

At the same time, the Feats are only so-so useful. Extend Spell, Empower Spell, Maximize Spell and a Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus (Necromancy) and maybe (Evocation), and one was more or less set for feats. Theres an inherent limit to the number of metamagics you can use.

Once we start getting into the near epic levels, Sorcerors are generally better. Once you have the higher levels, the two main things that make Wizards superior (Feats and faster spells), no longer have so much meaning. You already have all the spells, and as I mentioned that there is a limit to the number of Feats you actually need as a spellcaster. The flexibility of choosing spells on the fly, the large number of high level spells (I love Chain Lightning), and the high Cha (I love talking my way out of things) become bigger draws.

That said, I'll play a Wizard when I finally get the game. If Item Creation becomes more practical then it was in the original (and it seems to be), then the feats are likely to become more valuable. Likewise I've heard of other feats that seem to have potential. Furthermore, the game starts at level 1, (well, 3), so the chance to get the Lightning Bolt or Finger of Death a bit earlier would seem to be a useful ability.

[dragon wench]

Hmmm... with more interesting item creation and feats, playing a wizard in NWN2 probably does merit more than a glance. Though, my preference is still generally towards sorcerers...
This debate reminds me a bit of the one that surrounds druids and clerics.
IMO, in either case it is a question of play style and mood. Each has its advantages and disadvantages, and varying situations will favour one over the other.

If, for example, you have a large group of enemies that are vulnerable to fire, than clearly being able to blast them successively with fireball is going to be an advantage. On the other hand, if a group of enemies consists of different species/races with differing weaknesses, the flexibility of a wizard could come in handy.

Of course, the one thing to remember, however, is that sorcerers are not limited to their memorized spells. They can also cast from any scrolls they find/buy, as well as from the many enchanted items that usually litter the average game. IMO, this factor generally provides sorcerers with the 'best from both worlds.'

[smass]

Of course, the one thing to remember, however, is that sorcerers are not limited to their memorized spells. They can also cast from any scrolls they find/buy, as well as from the many enchanted items that usually litter the average game. IMO, this factor generally provides sorcerers with the 'best from both worlds.'

As far as scrolls go the same argument could be made from the opposite perspective...what's stopping a wizard from crafting a dozen fireball scrolls and carrything them around?

Considering that in NWN2 resting is made ridiculously easy and has very little restrictions it really takes away from the advantages a Sorcerer has over a wizard. Personally, I find the resting rules to be ridiculously lax and I try to only rest outside of hostile areas. This is more of a roleplaying choice for me as the game allows you to rest and regain spells almost anywhere.

When I want to play an arcane spellcaster in NWN2 on a true core rules server I will go with Sorcerer for the reasons many of you have outlined. However in the NWN2 included campaign the sorcerer's advantages are muted - unless you as a player choose to roleplay true D&D resting rules.

[probo]

I prefer wizard personally, not so much because he gets access to more spells, but because he gets acess to them one level earlier. Then we got the skillpoints, the charismatic sorcerer gets like 2-3 skillpoints per level while the wizard usually gets around 6-7 because of mass int. Now if sorcerer got access to diplomacy that would sweeten the deal

Also something else to think about is specialist classes, my favourite is always the class that prohibits divination (lol), it all depends on which of the d&d games ure talking about when determining that sice they change it over time. Divination is mostly identification and see invisibility stuff, I can live without that - especially with max int/lore which makes you instantly identify anything you want.

Wizards also get free metamagic feats, and you can pick from crafting in nwn2 instead of metamagic feats if you want (thats a plus).


Now is when it gets tricky though.. Eldricht Knight prestige class completely kicks ass if you want BaB, and you do, if not for actually hitting stuff with fiery weapons - then because some good spells are ranged touch etc. Only problem with the EK prestigeclass is that it costs you one caster level!

Since its (imo) a clear choice to use this prestigeclass you will be facing losing (with sorc) another level before getting your spells!!! You cannot live with that

But the wizards free metamagic feats are entirely (except first one) lost too if you keep levelling your EK class

So in conclusion - if playing pure magery class (not taking eldricht knight class) I would prefer wizard. But now im not so sure since EK class owns so much :/ Just remember to pick a hefty amount of strength at creation if your going EK! I made my wizard with 8 starting str, im still kicking major ass with him in melee though wearing a good 2handed sword and many buffs such as bull strength and haste.

It would also seem that the amount of hits per round you have in any of your polymorphed forms are directly related to how many you have in normal form, so EK just basicly helps alot ^^.

Then again you *could* play ure mage as pure overkill nuker too and rest inbetween every encounter I guess... hmm.. long post, enjoy

[Snipercon]

Has anyone mentioned that since wizards are based on intelegence they will likely have more skill points also? Just a thought.

Conversly, sorcerors could potentially have more influence over people being based on charisma.

[Magrus]

Has anyone mentioned that since wizards are based on intelegence they will likely have more skill points also? Just a thought.

A few people, yes.

[GoldDragon]

Both, Actually.

Wizard for Defensive and Other uses (such as knock), and the Sorcerer for Blasting things (offensive spells).

[Magrus]

As to that, I have had success going with a mix of Wiz/Sorc before. Generally, one level of Sorcerer, and the rest wizard works best for me. I end up with a handful of 1st level spells that I know I will use regularly that I do not need a high caster level for. Having access to True Strike and Mage Armor that can be cast on the fly when you have run out of your wizard spells can make a difference. Combining True Strike with ranged touch spells is nifty too if you need to make that last ranged touch spell count.

However, I have done the opposite when creating a sorcerer. Taking a level or two of wizard and being able to learn all 0 and 1st level spells through scribing scrolls makes a difference. Some spells you really only need 1 caster level for. Ray of Enfeeblement is still useful as a 1st level caster, you will still do 1-6 Str damage, rather than 11-16 at 20th. It is quite a bit lower, but...a lucky shot with the spell against the brute coming towards you could mean anywhere between 1-3 points less damage each time it connects with you. Not to mention a loss of accuracy. Just as having say, the Shield Spell memorized as a wizard, when you do not know it as a Sorcerer. Mage armor is more versatile as it last 60 times longer, however they stack, and while a high level caster can use one Mage Armor for the whole day, Shield lasts only a few minutes each casting. Casting it as a wizard when confronting a nasty enemy for a boost or protection from Magic Missiles but not wanting to spend a Spells Known Sorcerer slot on it is very useful at times.