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As for his confession - do you think that it would have made any difference if he had been believed? What if were not a psycho, yet confessed to crimes which he didn't commit? I think that was just as likely to happen as him actually murdering people. Did his confession really signify anything, or was it just a perverse act (I'm sure that confessing to crimes we have committed is just as unnatural as killing beggars) similar to the many other perverse acts he committed?

EDIT - @CE, have you read The Cold 6000? I bought it yesterday, and will start reading it after I've finished 'Beyond Lies The Wub'...

Originally posted by frogus
As for his confession - do you think that it would have made any difference if he had been believed? What if were not a psycho, yet confessed to crimes which he didn't commit? I think that was just as likely to happen as him actually murdering people. Did his confession really signify anything, or was it just a perverse act (I'm sure that confessing to crimes we have committed is just as unnatural as killing beggars) similar to the many other perverse acts he committed?

Perhaps it is a religious overtone, ergo he is confessing his sins but there is no one there who believes/listens to him so he rejects the notion of absolvence?

I don't remember very well, but did he have that notion to start with? I will dig out the book sometime and brush up...

Originally posted by frogus
I don't remember very well, but did he have that notion to start with? I will dig out the book sometime and brush up...

I probably should do the same, unfortunately someone had away with my copy, 6 months and they haven't bothered reading it yet...i should get it back some time...they got bored by all the music conversation but then they get bored by me and my musical conversation as well, some people, eh?

I must bid all thee goodnight, i have to pick my brother up tomorrow at 11pm and commute back for the next hour and a half

Originally posted by Mr Sleep
The difference i see between Ellroy and Ellis is that Ellroy's gruesome depictions are usually (not always) after the fact, they are quite often an investigating officer, where as Ellis was using his main character and describing things as they happen.

Interesting...does that make a difference in how the descriptions of violence affect you (or other people)? To me, it doesn't make a difference...I had more negative emotions when I read some sections of Black Dahlia and The Big Nowhere than I had from American Psycho. Mostly because of the stylistic differences between the two writers, Ellis has a fairly "arty" style, whereas Ellroy is IMO more a pure realist.

I was not actually sickened by any of the depictions apart from his old Girlfriend from high school, if they had just cut all that out (like they did in the film) i wouldn't have a problem with it, but i can't go into details as to why that sickens me but it should be pretty obvious I actually skipped the entire section, that is when i crafted my "I am a prude(TM)" badge

You did? Yes, I have heard several people who reacted that way...I think it comes down to what I said in my last post about reading is as violence or reading it symbolically. That's also the difference (for me) with reading documentary books or case-stories, you can never read that in a symbolic way since you know it happened in reality....

BTW i do actually have "I have a syndrome" badge that someone made for me

ROFL Great! You should wear it!

@Frogus: In the book, I think it is clear he actually performed those murders, in the film I know it was much more ambigous. I think his confession signifies an increasing inner pressure, a pressure he previously got relief from by killing, but towards the end the killing no longer gives him what he is looking for, his inner anxiety is not stilled...that's why I think he confesses, and I do think it was both a perverse act and a desperate try to do something...he is clearly relieved after the confession, just as he was earlier relieved after a murderer...

And I do think it would have made a difference to him if he had been believed. Firstly, other people would have been forced to change their view of him, he would had have a change to break free from the image he and everybody else got stuck in by everybody else...and secondly, it would probably have led to radical change since he would have gone to jail, but that is IMO less significant. I do think the scene where the guy he confessed to jokes about it all among their friends, and also confuses Bateman with another person (Marcus), is significant...

Originally posted by frogus
@CE, have you read The Cold 6000? I bought it yesterday, and will start reading it after I've finished 'Beyond Lies The Wub'...

No I haven't, notify me if it is good!

@Sleep: Good night, sleep well, and yes, I do think there is a confession-absolution idea involved, but not a religious one even if the idea comes from religion...

cannot...keep...eyes...open...

It's been good talking to you CE (and Sleep, when you get up ), but nature requires me to sleep. Tommorow I am going to start painting a self-portrait, and then off to see The Merchant of Venice at New College IIRC, so I will probably not be posting, or maybe I will be here for another session in the wee-small hours . Goodnight.

EDIT - re; Cold 6000...I have heard very good things

Good night son, sleep well and enjoy tomorrow...I am thinking of going out to our summer house, so I might not be posting either.

Greetings CE. I see I have missed an intelligent conversation among Frogus, Sleep and you. Ah well, I wouldnt have been able to really contribute anything

Whats new?

Evening Tybaltus

Not much is new, I've been trying to work a bit more today but I can't say I've been overly efficient...what about you?

Originally posted by C Elegans
Evening Tybaltus

Not much is new, I've been trying to work a bit more today but I can't say I've been overly efficient...what about you?

Not much. Its just a question of defeating the heat, humidity, and dehydration. And the ground is so dry, because we havent gotten rain in 2 weeks. Tomorrow were supposed to get some, but in thunderstorm-style. Other than that, Ive basically spent the day either playing computer games and on SYM.

EDIT-I just read your post in the Hall of Rememberance, and because I dont want to SPAM up the thread too much, I want to bring up Darkpoet. You see, I have always been interested in the people banned here at Gamebanshee. Darkpoet, one person I have almost no knowledge about. Who was he? What made him really different?

@Tybaltus: Same here, the heat and humidity is still not doing any wonders for my intellectual capacity...like you I've been here a lot today, and I've also played Warcraft.

Regarding Darkpoet, I was not one of the people who knew him well, but I had some contact with him on the board since he was a regular and posted much. He was banned for use of multiple aliases, which as you know is against the forum rules. At SYM, he was often very funny and witty - he and Waverly used to have great conversations and joke flame wars. An old favorite of mine was "Has Waverly been here? Yes, I see the slime trail..."
That sort of things. He was also an incredibly nice and social person in the pub threads. Anyway, there were other aspects of him as well. He could sometimes loose temper, and sometimes be incredibly diplomatic. He could upset several members with some of his posts. I am sure some people here had some very unpleasant experiences.

It seems there are 3 members that were banned that seems like they are genuinely missed:
1-Darkpoet
2-Sailor Saturn
3-Aragorn Returns

Yet I hear so little about:
NeKrOmAnCeR
rapier

I know what all of them did wrong to get banned (except rapier-I have no idea who he was).

I figure, you basically have to try to get banned in order to get banned. I mean, you follow those relatively loose and non-strict rules set up, and you'll be fine.

Let me ask you 2 things about these banned members-
1-Other than Darkpoet, is there anyone else there that you knew and liked?
2-What did rapier do?

I know many of the moderators dont like talking about banned people because I know they caused some pain to some forum members, but curiousity is one of my weaknesses.

@Tybaltus: Aragorn Return is missed? By whom? I never heard anybody who missed him, most people don't seem to remember his posts very well and I don't remember him at all. I must say I don't remember Necromancer and Rapier either, so I don't know why they were banned. In any case, nobody gets banned without clear warnings from Buck or the moderators, except in a few extreme situations like immediately posting severe racist statements.

Yes, I liked Sailor Saturn. I wasn't around when she was banned (I wasn't around when DP was banned either, I seem fortunate to miss the critical situations) so I am not sure exactly what happened, but I believe she insulted other members one time too many. She could get very angry sometimes and write things she later regretted.

I know Kam misses Aragorn Returns. He liked his sense of humor.

If you want to know exactly what happened to Sailor Saturn, I found out by clicking on here profile, which can be accessed by the SYM anatomy page 1 or last page of BS's hermit cabin, looking at her last posts, and the mod's receactions towards her. Its a shame that she had such an unbalanced temper and character. She seemed really friendly through the stuff Ive read of hers, and I have a feeling that we could have gotten along like I get along with most people here at SYM. But when you make bad mistakes like she did, you kind of have to pay the price.

I was told that Nekromancer did many things wrong, most notably, he posted links to porn sites.

@Tyb: Kam? Oh I didn't know. Perhaps AR posted much when I wasn't around much, since I don't remember him.

How come you are interested in why previous members got banned? I have to admit I've never thought much about it, perhaps because I know what types of behaviours that will inevitably lead to banning.

Since I was ordered to go here...

Personaly I feel that getting oneself banned can be quite easy when you're new to the forum. Many of the old memeber have imo stretched the rules quite abit, but in a humorous way without even getting a warning. If a new member takes notice and strech them just abit further he might get a very differnet reaction from SYM in general.

@Dottilius: It is good to have a slave...since you have agreed to entertain me wherever I flash this light, I think the least you can to is to come here when I ask

I don't agree that it's easy to be banned from Gamebanshee, not even as a new member - not if you have read the forum rules first anyway. I have seen many occations when a new member is warned for having violated forum rules. I do however agree with your notion that older member sometimes receive "the benefit of doubt" to a higher degree than a newcomer. This is IMO unfortunate, but very difficult to change, here, on other boards or IRL. I do however personally feel that the Moderators and Buck are more fair and objective in their assessments than the SYM population as a whole.

Originally posted by Dottie
If a new member takes notice and strech them just abit further he might get a very differnet reaction from SYM in general.

Hi. Thought I'd drop by, as well.

I think it's pretty much an unspoken rule in all societies that longstanding members of that society have a degree of flexibility in cultural constraints which wouldn't be sanctioned in newcomers.

Originally posted by C Elegans
I do however agree with your notion that older member sometimes receive "the benefit of doubt" to a higher degree than a newcomer. This is IMO unfortunate, but very difficult to change, here, on other boards or IRL. I do however personally feel that the Moderators and Buck are more fair and objective in their assessments than the SYM population as a whole.

Your check is in the mail.