Greetings, newbie here

kmonster · Post by **kmonster** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:41 pm

Only humans can dualclass and therefore become kensai/mage. Halfelfs can't, so create a human.
Kensai/mages can wear mage robes once they start gaining mage levels.

"18/whatever" isn't exactly great. 18/01 will give you +1 to hit and +3 damage, while 18/00 will give you +3 to hit and +6 to damage. A huge difference, especially in early game. 18/51 gives +2 to hit and +3 to damage, and doesn't require an insane amount of rerolling.

While a high second number for 18/.. strength doesn't hurt it's not very important either. Strength is the easiest stat to raise (just cast 1-2 "strength" spells (mage level2) and you get 18/00 for a long time for example). It's more useful to get a high overall roll which allows 18 charisma for example.

I don't recommend playing a ranger or paladin PC, you can become "fallen" if you don't act as the game developers want you to. Many players have become fallen without realizing when and why.

Rabain · Post by **Rabain** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:49 pm

Kensai/mage can wear mage robes, you just won't see the robe animation ingame. The game does not contain an animation for the kensai wearing a mage robe. You will still retain any abilities or protections related to the robe you are wearing.

The only reason I'd recommend a fighter class for first time is you will feel more involved in the battles if you are the one up front face to face with your enemy. As a cleric or mage you would end up basing your spell selection on what would be best to help the fighters in battle rather than on pure damage to the enemy...most of the time.

With a party you can complete the game with not too much trouble no matter what class you choose. All of the kits have positive and negatives. Pick the one you like the look of the most and also has the least restrictive restrictions. Kensai and Wizardslayer are the only fighter types I would advise against on a first run through the game.

Have fun!

DomTom · Post by **DomTom** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 5:55 pm

again, thanks for the advice.

nearly made my mind up lol

elf fighter (just general fighter, so i can use longbows)

5 star longsword
however many stars shield & weapon.

something i've never understood in BG

what is rerolling? you talk of 18/01 and 18/75 etc, what does the 01 or 75 mean? someone stated an example where 01 does x damage and y thac0, while 00 does 2x damage and 2y thac0, while 75 does 3x damage and y thac0. i was just playing around with creating a character, and the /xx numbers were always different, so whats a good number?

Sytze · Post by **Sytze** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 6:02 pm

I don't understand most of people's advice here. DomTom walks in, announces he's a newbie and that he's never played SoA before. And what do most of you do? Start suggesting difficult builds, toss around walkthroughs, give him suggestions of characters which aren't easy to handle, etc. It's not like he's played the game to infinity already.

DomTom, I suggest you don't look at any walkthroughs, except those only discussing character builds. You might want to start with something pretty basic and start exploring from there. BG is a learning experience, that's where most of the fun lies; discovering and questing. Pick a character you think suits you right, which won't give you headaches about how to sculpture him into perfection. A Ranger truly is a fine choice to start with. You can specialise in practically everything and you're quite good at it too. If you really like ranged weapons, you could pick the Archer kit and get real good in a ranged weapon of your choice. If you simply want to see what style suits you best throughout the game, a vanilla ranger won’t disappoint you.

Don’t worry about NPC’s. If you don’t like one, what’s stopping you from removing him or her from the party? You’ll come across all sorts of friends, enemies, and everyone inbetween, both dull and fun, strong and weak, whatever your taste’s. Just play the game, have fun, and see what crosses your path.

Ask questions when you get stuck, don’t let all of us spoil your first run through with technicalities and details, with character builds which are difficult to manage even after your first run. Just play and enjoy.

DomTom · Post by **DomTom** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 6:05 pm

it is indeed what i shall do, i just dont want to miss out on anything good in the game. i remember finding things and being disapointed about having made the wrong choice in BG1, but it would be too late to change it back.

Crucis · Post by **Crucis** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 6:47 pm

Sytze, I'm kinda with you here. With the exception of one technical post describing weapon style profs, I've avoided giving DomTom advice. My general advice would be that unless one is a D&D veteran, either from paper and pencil or other D&D CRPG's, I'd suggest avoiding dual-classing. Too much worry about timing your class conversion when a newbie probably should just stay focused on the basics, the plotline, managing his party, and keeping his PC alive.

Personally, I think that some sort of warrior class is a simpler choice than some flavor of mage, but in the end, I'm not sure that that matters all that much, since you'll also be managing your NPC mages as well. I suppose that a generic unkitted fighter is the simplest choice, although a bit bland. Generic rangers and Archers are both good choices that are fairly straightfoward as well.

DomTom, don't let yourself get too hung up on taking a fighter class PC so that you can get those 5 stars in a weapon or 2. Sure, it's a nice benefit, but it's also not the end all and be all of melee combat. Oh, a fighter with 5 stars in his favorite nasty weapon can a potent warrior, but so can many other warrior subclasses who are limited to only 2 stars in their weapon profs. Something to consider about those guys that can only get 2 points in their weapons is that while Mr. Fighter is learning to be a grandmaster in weapon X, Mr. Paladin or Mr. Ranger is learning to be pretty capable in a number of weapons and may not find himself just dying to find the next great weapon X cuz that's the one in which he's a grandmaster. (Sorry for the vagueness.) Rangers, Paladins, and Barbarians tend to be (grand)masters of no weapon, but skilled in many, along with their other class benefits. You don't have to have grandmastery of your weapon to be deadly in battle.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying to not play a fighter, if that's what you've got your heart set on. Everyone has their favorite class and often those people can seem to get the most out of that class where others cannot.

Good luck to you!

Crucis · Post by **Crucis** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 6:59 pm

DomTom wrote: something i've never understood in BG

what is rerolling? you talk of 18/01 and 18/75 etc, what does the 01 or 75 mean? someone stated an example where 01 does x damage and y thac0, while 00 does 2x damage and 2y thac0, while 75 does 3x damage and y thac0. i was just playing around with creating a character, and the /xx numbers were always different, so whats a good number?

What you are asking about here is a feature of the 2e AD&D system called "exceptional strength". Warrior classes (fighter, ranger, paladin, and barbarian, and maybe monk (I don't know)) are allowed to have "exceptional strength" at creation. Non-warriors, ignoring any racial bonuses or penalties, are maxed out at a STR of 18. Warriors who happen to be created with a STR of 18 then get a second roll from 01-100 (represented as 00) that represents the exceptional portion of their Strength, with the higher the number, the better the Thac0 and damage bonuses. (BTW in case you don't know or don't remember, Thac0 means "To Hit Armor Class 0", and is basically just your base to hit roll.)

Also, you should have a game manual, in your BG2 folder on your computer, named "Baldur's Gate 2 manual" in a PDF format.

kmonster · Post by **kmonster** » Sat Jun 23, 2007 8:02 pm

Sytze wrote: I don't understand most of people's advice here. DomTom walks in, announces he's a newbie and that he's never played SoA before. And what do most of you do? Start suggesting difficult builds, toss around walkthroughs, give him suggestions of characters which aren't easy to handle, etc. It's not like he's played the game to infinity already. ...

A Ranger truly is a fine choice to start with. You can specialise in practically everything and you're quite good at it too. If you really like ranged weapons, you could pick the Archer kit and get real good in a ranged weapon of your choice. If you simply want to see what style suits you best throughout the game, a vanilla ranger won’t disappoint you.

I don't understand how you can recommend a ranger for a first time player.
Rangers can become fallen and the chance that it will happen for the PC is quite high.
He'll become fallen if he doesn't act like the developers want him to (there even exists a mod because many players don't agree with their definition of what are evil choices).
The program doesn't even announce clearly when the character becomes fallen, so many have made their save when their character had already fallen and when they realized that the character has become fallen they didn't even know when or why this happened.

The fact that there are 2 ranger NPCs who can join the party (the first one right at the start) doesn't make the ranger more interesting.

It's a myth that a game with warrior PC is easier to play than with a mage PC, the opposite is true. It's of course easier just to hack at everything with a warrior than casting spells with a mage, but you won't get far without a mage in your party. Making the PC hack and the NPC cast is not easier than making the PC cast and the NPC hack.
When making the PC a mage you can avoid having a vulnerabe low HP character by choosing good stats and casting "find familar"(can only be cast by the PC) for even more HP. Dualclassing from another class can make such a character even less vulnerable.
If the mage is your PC you keep the spells learned for the whole game, if the mage NPC leaves all the powerful spells scribed from partially unique scrolls are gone.
If you screw up your party so that only your PC remainins a warrior PC can get into big trouble when just bashing doesn't help any more while a mage PC who scribed the scrolls available will have many,many options available.

I hope you understand now why I don't recommend playing a ranger to someone who "loves the mage class".

DomTom · Post by **DomTom** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:17 am

also remember im not that much of a newbie, i am one for sure, but i do know the very basics.

i finished BG1 with fighter and mage, although as i said, i had problems with the mage one at the end battle, most likely because i didn't know how to play around with the stats.
(although this was well over 4 years ago)

how often do you get some points to put towards your weapon skills? couldn't i master one weapon then master another later on in the game?

DomTom · Post by **DomTom** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 3:24 am

Started playing with a fighter half orc male, 4 star in longswords and 2 star in shield + weapon. Max strength and constitution, 8 & 9 for charisma and intelligence respectivly.

however, i've messed up my game. while i was looking at the fixes and the tweaks, i installed the skip introduction tweak....not realising it would skip ALL scenes... is it too late to remove it now? will the game go back to normal if i remove it now or will i have to start...AGAIn

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 4:11 am

GawainBS wrote: Putting points in to weapons & weaponstyles occurs at the beginning, during character creation and every 3 levels after the first for warriors (Ranger, Fighter, Paladin, and their kits and multiclasses) and every 4 levels for other classes. Warriors can put up to 2 points in a style, as can multiclass fighters. Only "pure" fighters (and their kits) can put more than 2 points in a single weapon.
In my suggestion above, you would put points in the styles and weapon untill they were maxed, maybe before that one point to be proficient in another type of weapon.

Example: A Kensai. His first level grants him 4 points. At lvl 3 and lvl 6 he gets another, so at lvl 7, when you start SoA, you would have 6 points. Put three points in "Two Weapon Style/Dual Wield" (They're the same, not sure which name is used. If you now put a weapon in your main hand and one in your offhand ( = shieldhand), you suffer only a slight penalty to ThAC0. Put 2 points in longsword and one in warhammer. At level 9, put a point in short swords. At level 12, put the point in longswords, untill you get 5 points in it. Then work on shortswords or warhammers.

That's how many times you get an extra proficiency point.

I think you have to remove the skip introduction fix. If you just restart, it will still be there.

Yes, longswords get pretty good, especially in ToB. Also, you won't have to wait very long before you get a decent one.

DomTom · Post by **DomTom** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 11:03 am

well, iv been playing for several hours now. iv done a grand total of two quests lol

i found victonia, must say i expected much better, decided to take her into my party, but im not too fond of her yet especially seeing as shes slightly evil and my other party members are good. nether the less, i shall carry on with her as i understand shes the only one a half orc can have "romance" with? i want to see what the whole romance thing is about so ill have to keep her.

however, i do want to get keldorn in my party, who out of the following should i get rid of?

minsc, anomen, aerie, yoshimo, victonia.

(minsc is starting to annoy me( he is so thick in BG2), so is yoshimo, and anomen i dont really need seeing as i have victonia as a cleric)

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 11:11 am

I'd say ditch Anomen, since you'll have Aerie and Viconia as clerics.
You can have a romance with Aerie, Jaheira and Viconia, but not all at once.

DomTom · Post by **DomTom** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 11:31 am

i thought that was only possible if you were human, but that half orcs could only have victonia?

could someone tell me whether or not there is such a thing as a "best merchant", one where i can sell my stuff for most, and by as cheaply as possible. i know at the coronet the new owner gives me discounts...but is there anything better?

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:30 pm

Your race or class doesn't mean a thing in romances, only your sex.
I think the Coronet is best, yes. When trading, no matter where, always make the person with the highest CHA the leader and have him/her trade. Depending on the CHA, you may get a substantial discount.
(Some hints on getting high CHA, albeit temporarily: Wearing that ring, the Helm of Glory, the Sword of Roses, casting Friends).

DomTom · Post by **DomTom** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:28 pm

yes i use the ring, which i found early in the game (thank goodness! no one wanted to talk to me cos i had a CHA of 3)

DomTom · Post by **DomTom** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:37 pm

right victonia died while i was fighting mages in the sewers, but i cant find her equipment anywhere.... is it possible iv lost it for good?

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 2:16 pm

If you have ToB installed, use the "tab" key to highlight objects. The manual is a wonderful thing.

Crucis · Post by **Crucis** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 2:44 pm

GawainBS wrote:Your race ... doesn't mean a thing in romances, ...

I'm sorry, Gawain, but I don't think that that's true in the unmodded game. I don't remember the exact details, but I seem to recall that Viconia will not romance elves cuz she hates surface elves, but human, half-elves, and (?) halflings are ok for Viconia. And IIRC, no one will romance half-orcs.

fable · Post by **fable** » Sun Jun 24, 2007 2:47 pm

Crucis wrote:I'm sorry, Gawain, but I don't think that that's true in the unmodded game. I don't remember the exact details, but I seem to recall that Viconia will not romance elves cuz she hates surface elves, but human, half-elves, and (?) halflings are ok for Viconia. And IIRC, no one will romance half-orcs.

This is correct. Viconia will not establish a relationship with an elven PC.