yet more weapon/class testing fights

two · Post by **two** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 8:05 am

MEEEEE CONFUUUUSED..........

Why don't any of these tests include SOUL REAVER?

It seems, from the description, that a cumulative +2 to THACO (per hit, no save) could be supremely useful.

Give a maxed-out fighter (with respect to AC)the 2-handed sword along with improved haste for at least 6 attacks a round. That is a +12 penalty to THACO after ONE round. I don't think even an Kensai will hit the figher's AC of -11 with a penality of +12. After a second round, of course, it's absurd: a +24 Penality to THAC0. End of battle.

I can't tell if this works "through" Stoneskin/Ironskin and don't have the game up and running to test it. If so, it is the ultimate Kensai/Mage killer.

The big question is if the fighter has the hitpoints to withstand 2 rounds of bashing from another fighter until the THACO bonuses make him immune to being hit.

Interesting? Or just duh, old hat? I can't test it myself or I would... perhaps Soul Reaver is buggy and does not work like its description?

Anyone tested this sword in the past?

Kovi · Post by **Kovi** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 8:16 am

I agree, the testing is not complete, especially if we look at the PC vs. PC aspect. (Level) drains, instant death, dispel magic could have a serious effect. And this raises the usability of some two handed swords, which were genereally a little bit underrated.

Nighthawk · Post by **Nighthawk** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 9:05 am

Originally posted by two:
Why don't any of these tests include SOUL REAVER?

It seems, from the description, that a cumulative +2 to THACO (per hit, no save) could be supremely useful.

When I tested it out, Soul Reaver was tied with Impaler as the most effective dueling TWO-HANDED weapon in the game (I was using fighters so Carsomyr wasn't tested). If the fight lasted long enough, the one wielding Soul Reaver would win when the opponent became utterly incapable of hitting back.

However, against FoA it comes up short, and especially against the FoA/Crom Faeyr dual. The Soul Reaver wielder's attacks per round quickly become 1 and generally the wielder will die before the opponents Thac0 gets bad enough to compensate.

As far as hitting AC -11. A level 19 Kensai with FoA/Crom Faeyr has a Thac0 of 1 base - 6 bonus - 11 Str - 3 weapon (+5,-2 offhand, +3 main hand) = -18. Even with +12 added to that he'll still hit AC -11 on a roll of 5 or better. A non-Kensai would be hitting on 11 or better.

If the wielder of Soul Reaver was also wearing the Ring of Free action that might change the results.

[ 04-20-2001: Message edited by: Nighthawk ]

KensaiRyu · Post by **KensaiRyu** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 1:02 pm

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and especially against the FoA/Carsomyr dual.
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Nighthawk is that a typo? If you could dual wield that combo most anything evil would really get beat...
I guess you mean using the flail till you get the slow affect then switching to carsomyr.
I agree more testing needs to be done however I just dont have the time anymore, maybe someone else could boot up shadowkeeper and try some new tests?
Also as I said earlier (somewhere) FOA is my favorite because how many enemies are wearing a ring of free action?
[ 04-20-2001: Message edited by: KensaiRyu ]

[ 04-20-2001: Message edited by: KensaiRyu ]

Nighthawk · Post by **Nighthawk** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 1:05 pm

Woops...corrected above.

Nighthawk · Post by **Nighthawk** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 1:37 pm

I do wonder whether Soul Reaver's effect would work through 4xAoF or Stoneskin. It might turn out to be an excellent weapon in dual classed fighter/spellcaster battles.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 2:42 pm

any more tests HINT HINT

two · Post by **two** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 3:53 pm

Originally posted by Nighthawk:
I do wonder whether Soul Reaver's effect would work through 4xAoF or Stoneskin. It might turn out to be an excellent weapon in dual classed fighter/spellcaster battles.

Me too (curious). And it would make, confusingly, a fighter with stoneskin weilding Soul Reaver really gnarly, as he could withstand enough hits (via stoneskin) to get his opponents THACO ridiculously high.

How would a fighter with Soul Reaver+Ring of Free Action do vs. typical CF/FOA combo? I suspect it would be close; if the fighter can last 2 rounds, Crom will start to miss. HOw many rounds does it take CF/FOA to kill a fighter with 150 hp's? Like, 1 1/2? or 3? Just curious.

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Fri Apr 20, 2001 4:23 pm

If I recall correctly the effects of Soul Reaver is checked for Magic Resistance which is pretty crappy. When fighting Firkraag it seemed as if it didn't effect his thac0 on all hits. However I guess that is not an issue in player vs player but it made me decide against the sword.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Sat Apr 21, 2001 10:23 am

Tests plz my charector plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

KensaiRyu · Post by **KensaiRyu** » Sat Apr 21, 2001 2:44 pm

Ok poor craig has been left out in the dry so long with his character, I will boot up shadowkeeper and test him for ya, however I am off to work now, so when I Get home in the morning (Work 3rd shift) I will test him for ya craig against numerous opponents.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Sun Apr 22, 2001 12:07 pm

Originally posted by KensaiRyu:
Ok poor craig has been left out in the dry so long with his character, I will boot up shadowkeeper and test him for ya, however I am off to work now, so when I Get home in the morning (Work 3rd shift) I will test him for ya craig against numerous opponents.

HER shes a her Plz imoplement this

KensaiRyu · Post by **KensaiRyu** » Sun Apr 22, 2001 4:48 pm

Newest Battles:Craigs Character Vs Human Kensai
Using weapons craig listed for first battle. Note that Kensai is using swords made for dicing, so as to make battle more even, if weapons with drain/haste/slow/additional damage/etc.. are used battle becomes more of a strategy battle. Ie using FOA against someone with ring of free action, Using Dragons Breath against someone with 100% resis to fire cold acid etc...

STATISTICS:
Craig Lvl 13/16 Halfling Fighter/Thief
2+ in longsword, Katana,Sword and shield, and sling.
17 str
19 dex
18const
10int
10wis
12chr

EQUIPPED:
Amul Spell warding
Boots Of Avoidance
Blade of Roses
Fortress shield +3
ShadowDragon Scale
Dragon Helm
Ring of Rengeneration
Cloak of Sewers
Bracers of Blinding strike
Gircle of Piercing
VS
Human lvl 19 Kenasi
STATISTICS:

5+in Longsword, 3+ in 2 hand weapon style
Dual wielding Blade of Roses/Namarra
all stats 18
Girdle frost giant str
Cloak of sewers
ring of gaxx
Ring prot +2
Boots of speed

BATTLE STATISTICS:

F/T Hide in shadows, Backstab Kensai to start fight, game paused, kensai Kai activated, craig bracers activated game unpaused start timer.
Times recorded in seconds and 1/10 of seconds.

1.)25.27 F/T died, avg dmg F/T=15.25, avg dmg K=23, backstab 31dmg
2.)26.10 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 12, avg dmg K=23,backstab 27dmg
3.)19.02 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 21, avg dmg K=23,backstab 46dmg
4.)21.30 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 15.6, avg dmg K=23,backstab 39dmg
5.)19.44 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 11.01, avg dmg K=23,backstab 27dmg

The main factor in this battle, besides the fact that F/T was not maxed for melee was the low str. Most hits from the F/T were in the area of 7-11 dmg, the avg looks higher only because of the backstab.So for the next battle all factors are same except F/T equipped with girdle of Frost giant Str instead of girdle of piercing.

1.)26.20 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 24, avg dmg K=23,backstab 48dmg
2.)25.50 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 22.4, avg dmg K=23,backstab 56dmg
3.)21.33 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 16.125, avg dmg K=23,backstab 30 dmg
4.)26.41 K died, avg dmg F/T= 19, avg dmg K=23, backstab 85dmg
5.)22.07 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 21.15, avg dmg K=23, backstab 56 dmg

The dmg from the F/T went up to 12-17 Vs previous 7-11, and because of this fights were alot closer, with Kensai usually getting near death from all the hits landed at Improv haste, However even with the F/T's -8
Ac, kensai never missed except on crit miss, and was hitting at 4 attacks/rnd thanks to boots of speed.

BATTLE STATISTICS:

For next Fight F/T is Maxed for Melee With following items added: 2 rings of Gaxx, Boots of speed, Helm Balduran, and Sentenial +4 Ac im proved from -8 to -14. Also Bracers of blinding strike changed for Gauntlet of weapon skill, as Ring of Gaxx also grants improv haste.
F/T Hide in shadows, Backstab Kensai to start fight, game paused, kensai Kai activated, craig Improv haste activated game unpaused start timer.
Times recorded in seconds and 1/10 of seconds.

1.)18.03 K died, avg dmg F/T= 18.5, avg dmg K=21.5, backstab 52 dmg
2.)24.39 K died, avg dmg F/T= 17.5, avg dmg K=23, backstab 37 dmg
3.)7.43 K died, avg dmg F/T= 30.8, avg dmg K=23, backstab 96 dmg
4.)19.25 K died, avg dmg F/T= 16.5, avg dmg K=23, backstab 41 dmg
5.)19.55 F/T died, avg dmg F/T= 18.75, avg dmg K=23, backstab 52 dmg

The ability of the F/T to backstab was the deciding factor in these battles, as the Kensai was trying to catch up from losing large number of HP at start of fight, Also because of improv haste on F/T, sometimes Kai was unable to activate Kai, due to spell casting failure from being hit. The one time the F/T lost, the kensai was within 7 hp of dying. Now maybe if the fighter/thief fought a Kensai/thief...of course then who would backstab first?

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Mon Apr 23, 2001 5:11 am

i never nw she would be beaten

it had to happen try vs bard(me use equipment you changed) and bard vs F/M/T

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Tue Apr 24, 2001 12:36 pm

O u busy

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Tue May 29, 2001 12:53 pm

schwing schwing

dimon37 · Post by **dimon37** » Tue May 29, 2001 1:50 pm

in the battle F/T vs Kensai, why didn't kensay activated ring of gaxx for improved haste? It seems that would seriously shift yourresults.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Tue May 29, 2001 1:55 pm

Double post

[ 05-29-2001: Message edited by: craig ]

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Tue May 29, 2001 1:55 pm

Cos i paid him £50

KensaiRyu · Post by **KensaiRyu** » Tue May 29, 2001 2:06 pm

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in the battle F/T vs Kensai, why didn't kensay activated ring of gaxx for improved haste? It seems that would seriously shift yourresults.
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Craig did pay me 50 thats why...

No actually I dont why It wasnt used... Maybe I was tired. If any one else wants to take over doing the comparison's be my guest, I dont have enough time working on all the mods.