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Spoilers Ahoy

Thanks again. I've decided to save Firkraag for Chapter 6 (gotta have something left to do later on).

Yes, I'd been saving the protn from magic scroll for this one. The plan will be to duff up Kangy then scoot round to the Twisted Rune before the spell runs out. Cackle.

Any ideas on what the non-prof penalty for paladins (Keldorn) is? I couldn't find it with a search, honest. I'm guessing -2 or -3 (from recollections of 1st edition D&D rules!) which would mean a giant strength potion will more than counter it.

[QUOTE=boo's daddy]Thanks again. I've decided to save Firkraag for Chapter 6 (gotta have something left to do later on).

Yes, I'd been saving the protn from magic scroll for this one. The plan will be to duff up Kangy then scoot round to the Twisted Rune before the spell runs out. Cackle.

Any ideas on what the non-prof penalty for paladins (Keldorn) is? I couldn't find it with a search, honest. I'm guessing -2 or -3 (from recollections of 1st edition D&D rules!) which would mean a giant strength potion will more than counter it.[/QUOTE]

I believe you can see this info on the right side of the screen when distributing the prof points.

Imp MoD is perfect for Kangaxx. Not sure if it can damage him, but it definately kills him outright. Imp haste the wielder and go for it.

Mace of Disruption counts as +5 for what it can hit even though it only has +1 or +2 THAC0 bonus. If I remember correctly Flame Tongue does not work, even though the description says it should. This may have been fixed in a patch at some point, but I remember trying this and getting the "Weapon Ineffective" message.

Kangaxx Spoilers

Thanks once again for all the suggestions. I don't have the improved Mace of Disruption, having gone for the honest option in the illithium quest, though I do like the idea of Aerie, with Spell Immunity and one of those cleric-be-tank spells, pounding his bony arse into the dust with it. That would be class.

However, I went for it last night with Keldorn wielding the Flame Tongue. I hadn't fully appreciated what a solid performer the paladin is. I forgot to cast the Protection from Magic spell during Kangaxx's first incarnation (D'oh!), but Keldorn just stood there and all the symbols, banshee wails etc just bounced off him, like water off a duck's back. Only ADHW did any damage, and a quick gulp of extra-healing kept him healthy.

The other thing I hadn't bargained for was Kangaxx's numerous magical defences during his first incarnation. True Sight is one of Keldorn's greatest assets, of course, but Aerie and Nalia used up all their breaches to take down Kangaxx's combat protections. Doesn't bode well for my trip to the Twisted Rune.

No time to worry about that now, though. The Flame Tongue did indeed hurt the monster and pretty soon his demi-lich skull was rising from the corpse gloating about how we'd now see his true power. This time I remembered to fire off Protection from Magic (thank Bhaal it's ranged!) and pretty soon it was all over. That was a short reign of terror.

But not before a final, Keystone Cops style comedy chase around the tomb. Kangaxx panicked and fled from Keldorn's righteous pounding. He fled towards my party! I had visions of him charging right in amongst us, recovering his composure then imprisoning the lot of us!

Picture the scene: party of five being chased around the tomb by a panicking Kangaxx, in turn being chased by Keldorn shouting "stand still and be righteously pounded, undead filth!".

All in all, an entertaining episode, and in the end it didn't feel too cheesy using the Scroll to counter Imprisonment. It's a grand game to be sure.

PS - in the end I noticed that Keldorn has two pips in Long Sword, so non-prof wasn't an issue.

Off to the Twisted Rune!

Hehe... nice ending

Good luck for the Twisted Rune!

[QUOTE=boo's daddy]The Flame Tongue did indeed hurt the monster and pretty soon his demi-lich skull was rising from the corpse gloating about how we'd now see his true power.[/QUOTE]
Interesting. I could never get that to work.

[QUOTE=SP101]Hehe... nice ending

Good luck for the Twisted Rune![/QUOTE]

Hey! Don't forget to get yourself Shield of Balduran! With this shield you will never fear beholders. (In fact this shield makes the game A LOT easyer. This overpower should be removed by a patch or something)

Odd. I've got ToB and no mods installed; maybe there's a bug somewhere.

EDIT: Cross-post with kams.
Thanks; also known as the Shield of Cheese. I believe it's only available in the collector's edition. Anyhoo, I would shun such an over-ripe brie on principle

SPOILERS

We buffed with Death Ward, Chaotic Commands and Resist Fear before entering. Keldorn still had his Protection from Magic, so once inside we summoned some pets (skeletons and an air elemental), and huddled in the entrace while Keldorn strode into the room, slightly disappointed that "Knock Knock!" wasn't one of the dialogue options.

After the short chat with Shangalar (sounds like a dodgy 70s boy band), I noted that various punters were materialising so Keldorn headed back towards the entrance while Nalia fired a Cloudkill into the room as our calling card.

This turned out to be a good move, as the lich re-materialised right in our midst, with a human just beyond the doorway and a beholder to the left of the entrance. Keldorn was standing right in the middle of the doorway, so he attracted most of the magical attacks and Jaheira was able to fire an Insect Plague at the beholder.

Meanwhile, the lich was causing problems. With multiple magical defences, our solitary Breach scroll was soon wasted, as was Keldorn's last remaining True Sight. In the end, we just hacked away until his second Mislead was dead and Protection from Magical Weapons had run out. We had our usual fright from ADHW and Sunfire, and he did me the favour of Mazing my main character (who had been flailing about in his customary ineffective manner) which kept him out of harm's way for a bit. Soon my Fire Elemental and Keldorn were tearing great lumps out of him and he was a goner. By this time, so were the beholder and the other dude by the door.

Keldorn's Protection from Magic had run out as well by now, so he was a bit more cautious as he ventured anti-clockwise round the room. Eeek - Vampire! Run away! This time it was Jaheira and Aerie's turn to step up to the plate. It turned out Jaheira couldn't harm it, but both of them had NPP, so she just took the hits until Aerie landed a killer blow with the Mace of Disruption. Nice.

There was only one left - the mage, who did some fancy dancing with Time Stop and Gate, but we gave her the runaround then filled her full of crossbow bolts.

Cheese rating: moderate chedddar from Protection from Magic, whiff of stilton from loitering in the doorway knowing that the other two won't enter the fray. However, I feel this is more than compensated for by not resting after Kangaxx, nor reloading, and then duffing up the pit fiend just for kicks.

In summary, I was a little bit disappointed in that the combat wasn't as hard as I'd expected, probably not as difficult as the Guarded Compound. Maybe I took them on too early in the game. I can see how this group were probably part of a bigger plot line that was dropped; their hideout would have made a fantastic stronghold for an evil character.

So here's a question: with so much action going on, I didn't notice how much XP I was accruing for the various kills. However, when the mage went down, I couldn't help but notice I got a paltry 4000XP. 4000! For killing someone with 9th Level spells!! Surely some mistake there??

To hell exp!
You now got the Staff of the Magi! This is the only thing that counts!

The difficulty of the encounter was said to be one of the reasons the thing was taken out of the game. I suspect in any case that if it had been included in the final release, it would have been severely toned down.

Kam's right, by the way: the Staff is worth the hassle.

Don't mean to sound ungrateful, the staff is indeed a thing of beauty. No doubt I'll enjoy it until the next time I get hit by Fear and toss it on one side

Keldorn is one of my favorites especially once properly equipped. Get him the Carsomyr, the dex gaunts and a str belt and he's a monster. His 2x dispel is great for mage killing. The downside is he doesn't get along with Viconia or Edwin so he usually fits into the "good only" parties I create.

All pallies start with a bonus of 2 to their saving throws and when you are wielding the Carsomyr with 50% MR, spells just bounce right off you. Seeing Keldorn in action is what inspired me to start a Cavalier No dispel or true sight with a Cavvy but still a solid and fun character.

Try the Improved Twisted Rune in the Tactics mod. One of the most fun fights I've ever had. Wait till you see Layene actually use the Staff of the Magi

Thanks for the suggestions. Indeed, given that the Jaheira romance is approaching its climax (if you'll pardon the expression), I may well do the Windspear Hills before going to Spellhold. He's already got the Dex gauntlets, then we'd give him the Girdle of (Frost?) Giant Strength from Underdark, plus Carsomyr he would indeed be a monster.

Mods aren't an option for me, sadly, as I'm not aware of any that have been written for the Mac version. I've heard mixed reviews of the Tactics mod though: some people seem to think that it forces you to use cheese, for example.

However, it seems that I might have the infamous Dermin bug happening (he didn't appear outside the Rune, having had the last conversation with Jaheira during the battle; she certainly picks her time for a heart to heart chat), so it looks like I might have to faff about with console to progress the romance.

'Tis true that you do not get very much exp from the others, but Shangalar alone is worth 50k, and he's the only one that's any challenge down there.

... which reminds me of something I noticed during my last run through the game. Shangalar gave 50k, Firkraag 65k (I think) and Bodhi like what, 95k? While Shangalar needed a couple of reloads, Bodhi died before I noticed she were in the same room. Don't remember if there's a lot of creatures that gives more xp than Bodhi, but if she were farmable... gawd. That much xp is just ridiculous.

[QUOTE=boo's daddy]
Mods aren't an option for me, sadly, as I'm not aware of any that have been written for the Mac version. I've heard mixed reviews of the Tactics mod though: some people seem to think that it forces you to use cheese, for example.
[/QUOTE]

That's a bummer about no mods written for the Mac. As for the Tactics mod forcing you to use cheese, I strongly disagree and I'm glad I played through it to witness for myself. In fact it removes a lot of the cheesy tactics like the Shield of Cheese, Cloudkilling Firkraag while he just stands there, etc.

The people that cry cheese are probably the ones that want to cruise through this game and solo Torgal, Twisted Rune, Kangaxx at 8-9th level for the FoA, SotM and Ring of Gaxx. Well, now you have to wait a bit

I didn't use one ounce of cheese in any of Tactics batles. Some of the fights force you to dig deep into those spells you never used before and sometimes force you to get a few levels first. For instance Improved Torgal was impossible for me until Nalia hit 10th lvl and got lower resistance for slow to land. Maevar forced me to get a few more levels and toys, especially free pet toys like the Staff of Air, etc. Twisted Rune I had to wait till I got back from Underdark to win.

You won't like every improved battle but remember you can pick and choose which Tactics battles to install. Twisted Rune at the very least is worth it. Final Irenicus will give you a worthy final battle and the Improved Kangaxx is guarded by some pretty nasty folkes.

Oh, that sounds like something I could use. Where can I get it?

On second thoughts, prolly around here somewhere. I'll just go look around, I've never catched any mods before, dno why. Might as well try some out, the Tactics mod sounded especially interesting.

There are three fairly well-known mods that increase the battle difficulty. The most famous one is Tactics (Weimer, available here), the less famous ones are Improved Battles (here) and CoM Encounters (here).

Then there are some other mod's that add a few encounter, like the Apack mod, Ascension and Improved Oasis.

I use them all.

Whey, I found a lot of nifty mods over there, for example one with sub-races, I've always wanted that one...