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A strange thing with the Christians' theory of what RPGs really are.

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Mr Sleep
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Post by Mr Sleep »

Originally posted by fable:
<STRONG>Inseparable in life? There are quite a few fundamentalists and Protestants who would argue (vehemently) that the body and the soul are resurrected together after death, which leads to the interesting point of what souls eat and where they evacuate to keep the body functioning post-mortem; or assuming it doesn't function, why the body is necessary after death.</STRONG>
There is an interesting idea that states we in our spiritual form will be whisked away to a form of limbo until the time of apocolypse, at this point all the bad in the world will have been washed away, and then the Earth will be plump for the return of the non (spammers ;) :) ) sinners.

Any opinions?
I'd have to get drunk every night and talk about virility...And those Pink elephants I'd see.
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Post by Weasel »

Originally posted by Mr Sleep:
<STRONG>the Earth will be plump for the return of the non (spammers ;) :) ) sinners.

Any opinions?</STRONG>
Bull hokey. :D Just because I spam doesn't mean I'm DOOM-ed :D LMAO Doom-ed.
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Post by Mr Sleep »

Originally posted by Weasel:
<STRONG>Buck Satan to be correct. :eek: </STRONG>
ROFLMAO! :D

Are you trying to attone for some spamming? :) :D Sacrifice yourself at the alter of Buck Satan (in other wrods pay him large check :) :D )
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Post by Weasel »

Originally posted by Mr Sleep:
<STRONG>ROFLMAO! :D

Are you trying to attone for some spamming? :) :D Sacrifice yourself at the alter of Buck Satan (in other wrods pay him large check :) :D )</STRONG>

I will chant 10 Hail Bucks and click 5 banner ads. :D :D
"Vile and evil, yes. But, That's Weasel" From BS's book, MD 20/20: Fine Wines of Rocky Flop.
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Mr Sleep
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Post by Mr Sleep »

Just my general POV and ranting (of course :) ):

I have been told that once you have declared yourself to be a Christian and have submited thyself to God then you can never fall out of that sphere and once you have accepted jesus as your saviour then you are forever saved.

Opinions?

Also what is the obsession with Jesus dying on the cross, now i understand it was a large sacrifice but many people have had to make a similar sacrifice since, and how does one man dying on a slab of wood constitute the removing of our sins forever?

Is there anyone on GB who believes in pre-destination, if so i apologise for my earlier comments.
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Post by Brink »

So this is where the spammers are hiding....

Heya pops ;) :)
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Mr Sleep
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Post by Mr Sleep »

Originally posted by Weasel:
<STRONG>
I will chant 10 Hail Bucks and click 5 banner ads. :D :D </STRONG>
15 Hail bucks and 10 banner adds will probably suffice :) :D
I'd have to get drunk every night and talk about virility...And those Pink elephants I'd see.
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Post by Vehemence »

Originally posted by Weasel:
<STRONG>
I will chant 10 Hail Bucks and click 5 banner ads. :D :D </STRONG>
LMAO :D Ahhh... the banner clicks... they burn... they burn...! :D
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Post by Mr Sleep »

I was bored so i typed this up, not necessarily entirely relevant to this thread but i thought it was :cool: none the less.

The Woman: What are time and space but clay for the hand that holds the cosmic balance? This age is moulded – that one squeezed from existence. All is flux. Lords of law and chaos struggle in eternal battle and neither ever completely wins or loses. The balance tilts this way and that. Time upon Time the hand destroys its creations and begins anew. And the Earth is ever changing. The Eternal War is the only constant in earth’s many histories, taking a multitude of forms and names.

Man: And the men who are involved in this struggle? Can they ever truly realise the true nature of their strivings?

Woman: Rarely.

Man: And will the world at length be granted rest from this state of flux?

Woman: We shall never know for we shall never come face to face with the One who guides the Hand.

Man: But surely some things are constant…

Woman: Even the meandering river of time can be damned or rechanelled at the will of the cosmic hand. We are as uncertain of the shape of the future as we are of the validity of our reported history. Perhaps we only exist for this instant of time? Perhaps we are immortal and will exist forever? Nothing is known for certain, all knowledge is illusion, all is flux.

Man: not if we resist. Legends speak of a men who forced chaos into shape by effort of will

Woman: Perhaps there are such men. But they go directly against the will of the One who formed them.

The Chronicle of the Black Sword (abridged) – Phoenix in obsidian (Michael Moorc0ck)
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Post by Weasel »

I will add this test..


How do you rate??

(1)I've written and published my own gaming materials.

(2)There is no life outside the role of the die. I know all of piddly rules of (chosen game). _MY_ own warped rules scare the rest of the players.

(3)I've got my weekly sessions set up and a character that I know better than I know myself.

(4)Role-Playing? That's just something to do to kill a Saturday afternoon

(5)Gosh, what an utter waste of time!

(6)Role-Players are instruments of pure evil.

(7)I work for T$R.

(8)I thought life WAS role-playing?
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Post by fable »

Hey, guys, this topic thread looks like it was intended seriously. Let's honor the wishes of the person who started it. ;)
Gruntboy writes:
How can God be perfect if he made this dump pile of a planet?
If you've already read my religious opinions before, you know that the idea of me stepping in for a Judeo-Christian's reply is kind of laughable. That said, let me offer up a simulation:

A developer creates a program with sentient bits of code. They don't know his (or her) purpose, but they argue incessantly as if they do. They claim their environment stinks, even though they can't understand the reason for the program, and their part(s) in it. In fact, they themselves, operating autonomously, have made certain changes to the environment--and one another--that has really degraded the surroundings.

But again, that may be part of the program--or it may not. Though they pride themselves upon all sorts of mental and physical tools they've designed, they still don't understand the "why" of anything even when they grasp the "how," and many of them have learned to ignore the why question altogether, believing that how solves all their needs.

They've developed many theories about the programmer. Given that many have built up these theories about the creator from their own fears and desires, they envision a programmer who creates code for their specific enjoyment, at their behest, and erases code when they frown at it. The notion of a programmer who has an interest in them, but no greater an interest than in any other program or code he's running, is enough to scare the subroutines out of them, and they refuse to consider it.

Jumping back away from this fiction, I prefer to reserve judgment about most of the why's in this argument, believing that none of it is logically knowable, and damn little can be explained outside of an intuited, non-causal series of systems which hardly help matters.
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Mr Sleep
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Post by Mr Sleep »

You forgot this one Weasel

(9) Role playing that's something i only do in the bedroom, and maybe on weekends

:) :D :D

I occasionally pass the time on a Saturday :(
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Mr Sleep
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Post by Mr Sleep »

@Fable you are right i will stop posting spam in this thread sorry :o

So what are you saying Fable, that we should stop attempting to figure out the eternal question? Maybe i am jumping to conclusions about your post.

BTW very :cool: analogy :)

[ 07-05-2001: Message edited by: Mr Sleep ]
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Post by fable »

@Sleep, I'm not recommending that we stop speculating. I'm only suggesting that we allow for the fact that every last one of us could very well be wrong.

And I don't mean the usual "Oh, I could be wrong, but..." stuff that gets thrown in right before somebody states something they unequivocably no is 125% right. ;) I mean, a genuine realiziation that they can't know many of the why's, and might possibly figure out a few, since they're considerably less universal than whatever they're contemplating.

Speculation is fine. I also believe that finding answers that suit our specific needs is great: I have my answers, at least, those few answers I can comprehend, and I am a fervent worshipper--just not a monotheist. But I guess I'm just hopeful that we won't conclude that whatever answer is good for any of us won't become the answer that automatically has to be good for all of us. Maybe each answer is somewhat different?
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Post by Mr Sleep »

That sounds like a fair judgement of the situation, but if my Christian teachings are correct on the current standing you would not get into Heaven. :( :) :D

I have no more knowledge to argue with you on this point you seem to know more about it than i do.

So i open a question to you, what is your opinion on the jehovas Witnesses feelings on having to work towards heaven, is this necessary to keep the people in order or is it a more human need/want?
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Post by fable »

Sleep writes:
That sounds like a fair judgement of the situation, but if my Christian teachings are correct on the current standing you would not get into Heaven.
Alas, yes. But as I posted elsewhere, I take comfort in Sam Clemens' (Mark Twain) comment, "Heaven for climate, hell for company." ;)

I have no more knowledge to argue with you on this point you seem to know more about it than i do.

Don't bet on it. I'm just another circling mote wondering what that big thing is in the center.

So i open a question to you, what is your opinion on the jehovas Witnesses feelings on having to work towards heaven, is this necessary to keep the people in order or is it a more human need/want?

I don't know what you mean by "work towards heaven." Do they actually have to accomplish a series of goals to get there?

This gets into the whole "works vs faith" headache that Jews and Christians of various branches have been arguing for literally 1500 years or more. I don't have any answers, but I've known all-too-many fundamentalists that honestly believe they've purchased their "seats in heaven" with a heavy donation. And I'm quite serious about this, too. :rolleyes:
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Post by Mr Sleep »

Too my knowledge they think they have to constantly work at their faith to acheive redemption/attonment. Probably the same thing that has been argued for 1500 years :(

This is what gets me about religion in general, everyone argues their own little antiquated POV and can not accept another persons standing, we are supposed to love and respect each other, but if they have a different aspect to their religion then we hate them, does that make any sense.....

Ps this is well travelled ground i am sure. :)
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Post by fable »

@Sleep, I've actually heard that some Southern Baptists caused an uproar in Texas by trying to convert a Jewish kid, recently. We're talking about 8 years old. Some friends of him invited him along for a "camping trip" being held by the church, without any hint of religion. He came back crying, telling his folks that he and they were going to hell because they were Jews, and not baptized.

This did not sit well with many other local denominations.

The Bap's minister apologized for the boy's trauma, but claimed that it was a tenet of their faith that you're damned to hell if you aren't reborn in Christ, and that it was their duty to save as many souls as possible.

Kind of makes you feel warm all over, doesn't it?
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Post by The Outsider »

@fable: Charming. Now I know one of the reasons why the term "Southern Baptist" sends chills up my spine.

Responding to a couple of posters who mentioned the OT giving them the heebie-jeebies. I concur. Reading the text of Judeochristianity is a poor primer to living in what most of us would call a "moral" sense. There's a section in Samuel I believe that typifies the Demiurge for me. In it, Ezekiel, one of the big G's prophets, is wandering around. A couple of kids mock him for being bald. Promply, the old geezer summons up a couple of bears to maul 42 kids to death.
Not a healthy outlook.

Similarly, I have problems with the obsession with the crucifiction. Deicide does crop up in mythology, but more frequently as part of a creative myth (Hinduism and one or two of the Native American traditions offer the best examples). Okay, so the same principle holds, that JC's destruction is the creation of a whole new world (spiritual, not temporal), but the inclusion of humans as the agents of deicide is unique. Describing the possible effects of this aspect of Christianity would make for a fascinating paper, but I have strayed from my point.

The point I was going to make here was one that I think is stated in "The Restaurant at the End of the Universe"- that those who seek power are probably the least appropriate people to wield that power. Religion, as a moral guide, should strive to create peace. I think we can all agree on that. The religions that have aimed for a "dominant market share", to use modern parlance, are Christianity, Islam, Judaism, and Confucian ethics. If you read into them (caveat- I haven't read much of the Q'uran yet), you find attitudes throughout that most of us would find abhorrent, but they're the faiths that have worked to grow bigger.

Essentially, this is a formal application of the oft-heard lament, that "all of the b*st*rds get the girls".
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Post by GrimReaper »

Alright, I have to put in my two cents. i have been going to a Christian school since 1st grade (now in 11th) and I have drawn one conclusion about the Christian God. He cannot possibly exist. Why? Because no truly loving god that has and will exist forever would punish us for such a relitively small amount of time (100 years) with ETERNAL punishment of the ultimate torture. Think about it. It's like your child takes the 10 dollars you gave him for lunch and buys cigarettes. He took something you gave him that if used properly would have given him something good, and he used it for something bad. Now at this point would you give your child to someone who would torture him for the rest of his life (or longer?). I don't think so. You'd probably punish him, but not forever. To me, god is like the father that would hand his child over. He gives you a soul to use for good, but you use it for evil. Were he the loving father, he would punish you to teach you a lesson and then forgive you and move on. Especially since God is supposed to have more love and forgiveness for us, than we have for anyone, including our children and other family.

Other than that, has anyone here ever looked at some of the Jehovah's (sp?) Witness beliefs? I think that if I were at all religious that would definately be my religion of choice. It makes the most sense of any I have seen. Rather than eternal torture, you just die and cease to exist. You are not punished, but you would have been rewarded had you followed him.
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