GameBanshee Forums

I've just loaded this build on to this site:

NWN2 Character Builder

Simply search through the alphabetical listing for "Damned Soul" if you are interested.

EDIT: Here it is:

http://nwn2db.com/build.php?id=623&version=1

I think it offers some interest over more standardized builds. Like most of my melee builds, it utilizes Stealth at some point in the build to more effectively deal with magic casters and other difficult opponents. Unlike most other builds the Stealth function is primarily derived from magical Invisibility. :mischief:

At later character levels damage is huge and attack numbers are only good.

Of all my builds it *looks* the "coolest" - typically with Hellfire Blast left on for aesthetics only.

Note that it contains the full skills listing via the "show skill level breakdown" link under the Skill Points and Skill Selection box.

quoted from description:

"Significantly better than the Favored Soul, primarily due to 2 factors"

Damage reduction is not as high as a Favored Soul.

This build is not as good as a Favored Soul with respect to classical melee spell-buffs, nor does .....


it's so different from the fave soul, in every aspect but the name with pun (or supposed pun), that it's hard to figure out the reasons of this comparison, or is it actually even the motivation for the build itself??


secondly, did you play it (at least thru the oc) or is it just a speculative exercise, like many others ofc?

(just curious)

baron667 wrote:quoted from description:

"Significantly better than the Favored Soul, primarily due to 2 factors"

Damage reduction is not as high as a Favored Soul.

This build is not as good as a Favored Soul with respect to classical melee spell-buffs, nor does .....


it's so different from the fave soul, in every aspect but the name with pun (or supposed pun), that it's hard to figure out the reasons of this comparison, or is it actually even the motivation for the build itself??


secondly, did you play it (at least thru the oc) or is it just a speculative exercise, like many others ofc?

(just curious)

I've tested it extensively at *all* levels against a wide variety of opponents. IMO it is ready for a module, and *can* be ready for a particular campaign depending on how its modified for dialogue skills.


To your other concerns:

1. Damage Reduction for a Favored Soul doesn't happen until level 20.. IF you start of campaign at level 20, then sure - the Favored Soul is better in this respect.

HOWEVER, IF want to play through the build life for this character then let me assure you that 6/cold iron by level 13 is *excellent* as is 3/cold iron by level 6.

2. Spells buffs for improving attacks and damage are largely "pipe-dreams" in normal game play. You just don't have a lot of time to cast them all, nor is the time/dedication required to actually plan out all battles before they begin realistic for most game-play. For those occasional end-game battles with Divine Power at the ready - yes, a Favored Soul *may* have an advantage for a particular module.

3. The motivation was for a more non-buff melee build that also included some magical perks - especially magical perks that enhanced melee ability. In this respect it really *is* an "Anti-Favored Soul".

Favored Souls have:

1. Modest melee ability without buffs.
2. Good to excellent melee ability with buffs.
3. Good protective magic.
4. Poor offensive magic (when factoring saves and penetration).
5. Innate Damage Reduction (but only at the last level).

At it's best this makes the Favored Soul designed for:

Buffed: One-on-one melee prowess,
Magic: killing mobs (at higher spell casting levels).

It's pretty much the epitome of a Spell-Sword IMO.

This build has many of the same features but has a different emphasis on those features.

1. Good melee abilities without buffs.
2. Good melee ability with buffs (but with *different* types of "buffs").
3. Good protective magic (but with a very different manner to achieve that protection).
4. Modest offensive magic (only intended for use in limited circumstances).
5. Innate Damage Reduction (but at varying levels with the price for that ultimately ending-up as 3/cold iron less than the Favored Soul).

The Damned Soul at it's best is:

Non-buffed: melee against single and multiple opponents.
Magic: achieving a "first attack" advantage.


Significant points of contrast are:

1. Melee "buffs".

Favored Soul ='s Divine Power, Divine Favor, limited Haste use, etc..
Damned Soul ='s Hellfire Shield minimum 5D6 damage, max. 10D6 per attack by opponent, no attack required by Damned Soul. greater/unlimited Haste use.

2. Protective Magic:

Favored Soul ='s Deathward, Spell Resistance, Damage Reduction spells, Divine Shield, Energy Immunity, etc.
Damned Soul ='s Deathless Frenzy, Entropic Shield, Fire and Acid resistance, and the benefit of Stealth via Invisibility+Hide+Move Silently.

3. Offensive Magic:

Favored Soul ='s Harm, Implosion, Earthquake, etc. Saves are critical here.
Damned Soul ='s Hellfire Blast. Saves are meaningless here.


Does that provide you with a better picture?

BTW, you can also easily test this build in something like Vordan's Hero Creator (in the battle cave) and see what you think about it's use for any given module. And again, IF you intend to rely on this character for dialogue skills then seriously consider some of the suggested alterations.

Scottg wrote:I've tested it extensively at *all* levels against a wide variety of opponents. IMO it is ready for a module, and *can* be ready for a particular campaign depending on how its modified for dialogue skills.


To your other concerns:

1. Damage Reduction for a Favored Soul doesn't happen until level 20.. IF you start of campaign at level 20, then sure - the Favored Soul is better in this respect.

HOWEVER, IF want to play through the build life for this character then let me assure you that 6/cold iron by level 13 is *excellent* as is 3/cold iron by level 6.

2. Spells buffs for improving attacks and damage are largely "pipe-dreams" in normal game play. You just don't have a lot of time to cast them all, nor is the time/dedication required to actually plan out all battles before they begin realistic for most game-play. For those occasional end-game battles with Divine Power at the ready - yes, a Favored Soul *may* have an advantage for a particular module.

3. The motivation was for a more non-buff melee build that also included some magical perks - especially magical perks that enhanced melee ability. In this respect it really *is* an "Anti-Favored Soul".

Favored Souls have:

1. Modest melee ability without buffs.
2. Good to excellent melee ability with buffs.
3. Good protective magic.
4. Poor offensive magic (when factoring saves and penetration).
5. Innate Damage Reduction (but only at the last level).

At it's best this makes the Favored Soul designed for:

Buffed: One-on-one melee prowess,
Magic: killing mobs (at higher spell casting levels).

It's pretty much the epitome of a Spell-Sword IMO.

This build has many of the same features but has a different emphasis on those features.

1. Good melee abilities without buffs.
2. Good melee ability with buffs (but with *different* types of "buffs").
3. Good protective magic (but with a very different manner to achieve that protection).
4. Modest offensive magic (only intended for use in limited circumstances).
5. Innate Damage Reduction (but at varying levels with the price for that ultimately ending-up as 3/cold iron less than the Favored Soul).

The Damned Soul at it's best is:

Non-buffed: melee against single and multiple opponents.
Magic: achieving a "first attack" advantage.


Significant points of contrast are:

1. Melee "buffs".

Favored Soul ='s Divine Power, Divine Favor, limited Haste use, etc..
Damned Soul ='s Hellfire Shield minimum 5D6 damage, max. 10D6 per attack by opponent, no attack required by Damned Soul. greater/unlimited Haste use.

2. Protective Magic:

Favored Soul ='s Deathward, Spell Resistance, Damage Reduction spells, Divine Shield, Energy Immunity, etc.
Damned Soul ='s Deathless Frenzy, Entropic Shield, Fire and Acid resistance, and the benefit of Stealth via Invisibility+Hide+Move Silently.

3. Offensive Magic:

Favored Soul ='s Harm, Implosion, Earthquake, etc. Saves are critical here.
Damned Soul ='s Hellfire Blast. Saves are meaningless here.


Does that provide you with a better picture?

BTW, you can also easily test this build in something like Vordan's Hero Creator (in the battle cave) and see what you think about it's use for any given module. And again, IF you intend to rely on this character for dialogue skills then seriously consider some of the suggested alterations.

i get your points, good ones.
although they sometimes sound like mere speculation since many players, when wanting to roleplay a fave soul, would simply go for it instead of trying to conceive some kind of twisted half-warlock instead. (you guessed it: the concern was mainly role-playing vs. munchkinish chara building.)

thinking about what the motivation of fave soul is supposed to be (a sorcerous cleric for harsh old-timers like me - and pardon the class-related pseudo-pun), i might start one, but because i suspect the oc might turn out quite boring (for me) with such a chara, it might fit into a 3 or 4 member party of soz, for a slightly improved delight at managing him/her and his/her development.
still, my intent is far from powergaming.

(i mainly play my builds in the actual campaign(s) but that's my habit, so other means of testing, like yours, are not to be discouraged imo and might be even more "professional" - while drying out the pleasure of the story around it, if there's still any pleasure left, and that means it's not your 30th+ time around a certain campaign.)

cheers

baron667 wrote:i get your points, good ones.
although they sometimes sound like mere speculation since many players, when wanting to roleplay a fave soul, would simply go for it instead of trying to conceive some kind of twisted half-warlock instead. (you guessed it: the concern was mainly role-playing vs. munchkinish chara building.)

thinking about what the motivation of fave soul is supposed to be (a sorcerous cleric for harsh old-timers like me - and pardon the class-related pseudo-pun), i might start one, but because i suspect the oc might turn out quite boring (for me) with such a chara, it might fit into a 3 or 4 member party of soz, for a slightly improved delight at managing him/her and his/her development.
still, my intent is far from powergaming.

(i mainly play my builds in the actual campaign(s) but that's my habit, so other means of testing, like yours, are not to be discouraged imo and might be even more "professional" - while drying out the pleasure of the story around it, if there's still any pleasure left, and that means it's not your 30th+ time around a certain campaign.)

cheers

It's interesting that your concerns actually *prompted* this build. :laugh:

I also like continuity in the build, not necessarily that the character should behave the same at all points in the build, but rather a sense of seamlessness that suggests ONE CLASS.

IF you start using Eldritch Blast or Hellfire Blast any more than a rarity, ("rarity" ='s IF you need to *only* make either a ranged attack OR an attack against a melee immune opponent), then I think this build will loose its seamless character. This is after all the province of the Warlock class, and while the build incorporates several levels, the dominate purpose of the Warlock (and Hellfire) addition was to achieve:

Hellfire Shield with good damage, and
Invisibility, and
Additional (though modest) Damage Reduction.

The other stuff is additional, but again - not overpowered.

The penalty is a reduction in fighter feats (*5*), and BAB (*3*). IMO it's a *balanced* trade, especially when you consider that the additions have their own set of weaknesses/limitations.

Conceptually I also considered the juxtaposition of the Barbarian class but with some additional Magic: say perhaps a "Magical Barbarian". But it doesn't have the panache of "Damned Soul", and when you see the character's arms and eyes light-up - you get the impression of something altogether more menacing than the description of "Magical Barbarian".

I think it should "roll" well in any of the campaigns with modification for dialogue skills. For SOZ I'd probably drop the UMD in favor of Intimidate. Note that you do need to use additional (wearable) modifiers for Move Silently and Hide - lots of "sniffing" opponents in SOZ.

i was thinking this chara-building motivational scheme could also be called attempts at class-emulation, if you're trying to achieve something vaguely similar to or at least non too different from another class with means that do not take any role-playing features into consideration, but instead just mere technical speculation about what varied building brings. but otoh munchkinism is rooted deep in human nature and dnd-oriented people tend to develop it more than any other specimen. in this, it would be interesting to speculate on where further development (which does not necessarily imply it brings improvements) of our human race will bring us.