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I've played the game with a mage primalist now, and recommended a similar build to a friend. He's now bragging about how easy the game is, and he doesn't believe me when I say it's just the build that makes it so smooth.

I wonder if anyone else has noticed this. I've various builds so far. None of the others them remotely close to the ease of use of a primalist mage. I find this a pity, because its really making it hard for me to enjoy exploring the other spell trees.

These spells and spell combo's work so well that I find it hard to find alternatives for them in other trees:

Grease > Fireball > Earthquake > Inferno

Petrify > Shatter

Cone of Cold

The only things that really interest me in other trees (after much testing) are:

Crushing Prison
(Mass) Paralysis
Hexes
Haste
Healing Spells

All of which are still obtainable in a primalist build, or by taking other characters with you (Morrigan, Wynne).

Has anyone come up with a mage build that works very well and that does not primarily involve primalist spells? I would really like to try something else and see it work.. I can't get any radically different mage builds to work equally well

It just seems focusing mostly on one of the other trees never gives me the sort of 'oomph' I need to burn down most things before they make contact with my group.

I never go for power builds, I tend to go for more roleplaying builds. With mages, I've found a necromantic build works quite well, but I'm not sure how it compares with a primal build.

The spell combo I like is the virulent walking bomb combined with any kind of spell that inhibits movement, so that as many targets as possible are effected - and the best part is that there is no friendly fire from the bomb. Combine this with the spell that replenishes mana from corpses and you never run out of mana either.

You can always try playing a melee oriented Arcane Warrior. The class has THE best defense (armor and defense) in the game. I've soloed the High Dragon fight with mine.

If you really want to be a spell-flinger, then I'd still suggest taking Arcane Warrior for the ability to wear armor.

As for the spells you mentioned:

The Crushing Prison line is the best one out there, since every spell is useful. I think that at least one mage should have the line maxed out and all mages should have Mind Blast.

While I'm all for Miasma (it's a must have for Arcane Warriors), Mass Paralysis is a waste. It's duration is way too short to accomplish anything.

The hex tree is very iffy, it all depends on you. Note that the first two hexes do stack. Misdirection Hex and Death Hex are very powerful, yes, but are usually resisted when you need them most (boss fights).

I don't think the Haste tree is worth it, but then again, it's up to you. The first ability is great for characters that lack attack (Cunning Rogues or Archers). The second ability is useless. The third ability improves your defense, but I'd rather stick with a glyph and help my allies too. Haste increases your damage and improves your movement/attack speeds while lowering your attack. Since it drains one mana per second, you can easily offset that cost with equipment, thus keeping it up indefinitely. The problems I have with this spell are these: it makes low attack characters hit even less and if you have Shimmering Shield (the BEST defense spell) active, Haste will turn off REALLY fast.

I'd get the first one, but then again, I'm not sure how good the other spells are.

The thing about the Primal school is that is where almost all of your damage spells are. Really, a melee Arcane Warrior would probably be your best bet.

The Crushing Prison line is one of the best indeed, as CP can be an "I WIN" spell sometimes and Force Field can be exploited to no end.

I'm personally a fan of the Horror/Sleep/Walking Nightmare line, mostly just because it makes larger battles simpler. It'll take out most minions, and Sleep + Horror deals massive spirit damage to a target (and even Elites usually fall asleep).

I've mostly played spirit mages as main characters, and I can't stress enough how wonderful Crusion Prision can be, however it is mostly for yellow con enemeis and sometimes the orange con.
It is a great spell and one of my favorite - not so much because of the powerlevel, but because of the crowd-control+damage aspect.

Also the Mana Clash spell in the Spirit line is a pure wonderful spell as you can completely erradicate enemy mages with it.

Outside this - I do not find many interesting aspects of the spirit line. The force field is nice enough both offensive and defensive, but it is a "once in a while" spell and the animate dead is okay for that additional taunter but not terrible useful.

I think Force Field is a great spell. I occasionally use it to save a dying party member (though you can it as exploit by casting on a taunting warrior, but don't do that, it makes the game too easy. The beauty of this spell is that it is NEVER resisted, thus I usually cast it on the orange boss, or on a spellcaster of the group, which buys me time to clear the rest of the not-so-threatening enemies and focus on the main threat.

Crenshinibon wrote:I think Force Field is a great spell. I occasionally use it to save a dying party member (though you can it as exploit by casting on a taunting warrior, but don't do that, it makes the game too easy. The beauty of this spell is that it is NEVER resisted, thus I usually cast it on the orange boss, or on a spellcaster of the group, which buys me time to clear the rest of the not-so-threatening enemies and focus on the main threat.

That's essentially how I use it. I avoid the exploit too, and I actually hope they might balance the spell by reducing the subject of a Force Field's threat to zero, to avoid said exploit.

It's great CC to use on bosses, though if you can use CP on the boss, the damage AND CC is obviously preferable.

I was looking at the numbers for the Walking Bomb and the Virtulent Walking Bomb spells and apparently, each one does as much as Crushing Prison, when cast with a four member party. While it doesn't restrict movement, the Virulent Walking Bomb has a shorter cooldown, has area of effect damage and spreads to other enemies.

Crenshinibon wrote:I was looking at the numbers for the Walking Bomb and the Virtulent Walking Bomb spells and apparently, each one does as much as Crushing Prison, when cast with a four member party. While it doesn't restrict movement, the Virulent Walking Bomb has a shorter cooldown, has area of effect damage and spreads to other enemies.

And potentially wipes your party out along with it.
Those "bomb" spells are great towards a line of casters, but the enemies are rarely grouped and stationary enough nicely that I'll count it as great utility.
If then a well aimed fireball or similar is preferable in my (spell)book ( :laugh: )
I normally only use them for extra damage on difficult mobs in between other damage spells or when the enemy lines up nicely for me.

The bomb spells work very well with an unresisted Eathquake spell however, because it keeps them grouped up.

But most of the time, I prefer other damage spells over those.

I myself am trying to avoid the Primal tree for the most part. Currently at level 10, my mage is a Spirit Healer. Next specialization will be Arcane Warrior, probably. In pink are spells that I have not yet taken, but plan to. As of right now the build goes:

Mage
Arcane Bolt

Spirit Healer
Group Heal -> Revival -> Lifeward -> Cleansing Aura

Arcane Warrior
Combat Magic -> Aura of Might -> Shimmering Shield -> Fade Shroud

Primal
Winter's Grasp -> Frost Weapons -> Cone of Cold
Lightening

Creation
Heal

Spirit
Mind Blast

Entropy
Weakness -> Paralyze -> Miasma
Disorient -> Nightmare -> Sleep
Drain Life -> Death Magic

Anything points remaining (I've yet to establish how many more I have) will probably be sunk into the Mind Blast tree, seeing as how everyone hails Crushing Prison.

Non-Primal suggestions:

Drain Life + Hex (the secondary Hex as well, but that's it)

The Runes, particularly paralysis (especially when used with repulsion for a good wide-area paralysis effect).

Walking Bomb - depending on the games difficulty setting. The virulent version isn't necessary. It's a matter of paralyzing the field, setting the secondary hex on target "B" that will be away from but still influence (with the Hex field) for your primary target "A" who is closest to most of your opponents. (..usually Morrigan for the secondary Hex.) Then hit target "A" with the bomb, and kill target "A" as quickly as possible to damage all the other opponents. It doesn't always out-right kill everything, but it does damage them enough so that "clean-up" is pretty easy.

Sleep + Horror.

Runic Paralysis combo + Death Cloud.

Having two forms of "crowd control" i.e. sleep and the runic paralysis combo is exceedingly useful. Particularly sleep first, to setup your paralysis combo after picking on one or two targets. Again, use that hex field on the opponent LEAST likely to be damaged but still in the radius area of other opponents.

For really tough opponents the regular Hex (1st level), Drain Life, Paralysis Rune (1st level only), Walking Bomb, Crushing Prison, and Force Field, and Telekinetic weapons are all excellent. Force Field can take difficult "yellow" opponents out of the fight and allow you to concentrate on both easier targets and the really tough "red" targets. It's particularly useful if you have *2* casters capable of casting Force Field (you and Morrigan presumably).

Force Field and Crushing Prison are the ONLY 2 paralysis type spells that don't rely on a physical resistance check. They are *mental*. Force field however won't work on any "red" opponents that I'm aware of. Additionally, note that Walking Bomb's damage is *spirit* based, NOT nature as described in the spell description.

Hex + Crushing Prison + Walking Bomb + Drain Life for tough opponents not immune to mental effects.

The rest of the Drain Life line is also quite useful. (..particularly the runic paralysis combo + Death Cloud.)

Spell Lines to avoid:

The Debilitation line: Weakness, paralysis, miasma, mass paralysis. Miasma is only OK, and isn't worth 3 spells.
The Death line: Walking Bomb's line EXCEPT for Walking Bomb.
The Hexes line, for spells 3 & 4. (..duration is a problem with them.)
The Summoning line (..Stinging Swarm is a good spell, but that's pretty much it there, and it isn't worth 4 spells to get it.)
The Anti-Magic line.

It should be mentioned that as of the 1.02 patch released today, a number of the builds we've been talking about (Cone of Cold and Crushing Prison for spells, and the usefulness of Shimmering Shield, to name a few) have been fixed/nerfed in the patch.

How useful they may still be, I'm not sure, since I don't currently have the game installed.

With this patch, Shimmering Shield may have become a quick protective spell, especially since it makes you near immune to everything while draining an astounding ten mana per second. However, keep in mind that it is incredibly cheap to create ninety nine lesser lyrium potions.

As for other spells, I don't think the usefulness changed much.

I have a tiny question.

how balanced is the shapeshifter? are the spells it offer good or im better off picking another especialization?

ps: found the advice on this thread very useful im usualy shy around spellcasting at first HAHAH

Nightmare wrote:It should be mentioned that as of the 1.02 patch released today, a number of the builds we've been talking about (Cone of Cold and Crushing Prison for spells, and the usefulness of Shimmering Shield, to name a few) have been fixed/nerfed in the patch.

How useful they may still be, I'm not sure, since I don't currently have the game installed.

Force Field last significantly shorter now
And so does Crushing Prison.

But they're still very useful spells in their own right.