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Hello to everyone. I've checked some of the threads about builds and it's rly giving me a headache so I thought I'd do one more.

I've played this game like to act4 or so very long long time ago as a paladin and got some divine champion lvls aswell but it was rly long time ago and I recall that I just chose feats randomly and the character was really crappy.

Now I've installed the game again (no expanssions) and I was wondering like what is the best way to go regarding feats etc. I am thinking of making a melee fighter type of character. I would want to use a 2-handed weapon. Ive alredy looked at most of the skills and all of them feel like they do almost nothing like I don't want to think about crafting too much nor bothering with traps etc. and who needs diplomacy, bluff, intimidate type of skills, if there's an option to fight instead then I will not need those "people skills".

I've red something about fighter/berserkker/weponmaster being a good build but a divine champion or some paladin build that gained damage from charisma got me interrested aswell. Also are archers really that bad in the game?

So far ive played abit on a fighter, rogue and paladin thru the first act. I deffinetly don't wanna play a rogue type and I might consider the paladin type if they got some kickass stuff up the sleeve.

What would you recomend for me to play thru the champaing first time gusy?

Luhtonen wrote:Hello to everyone. I've checked some of the threads about builds and it's rly giving me a headache so I thought I'd do one more.

I've played this game like to act4 or so very long long time ago as a paladin and got some divine champion lvls aswell but it was rly long time ago and I recall that I just chose feats randomly and the character was really crappy.

Now I've installed the game again (no expanssions) and I was wondering like what is the best way to go regarding feats etc. I am thinking of making a melee fighter type of character. I would want to use a 2-handed weapon. Ive alredy looked at most of the skills and all of them feel like they do almost nothing like I don't want to think about crafting too much nor bothering with traps etc. and who needs diplomacy, bluff, intimidate type of skills, if there's an option to fight instead then I will not need those "people skills".

I've red something about fighter/berserkker/weponmaster being a good build but a divine champion or some paladin build that gained damage from charisma got me interrested aswell. Also are archers really that bad in the game?

So far ive played abit on a fighter, rogue and paladin thru the first act. I deffinetly don't wanna play a rogue type and I might consider the paladin type if they got some kickass stuff up the sleeve.

What would you recomend for me to play thru the champaing first time gusy?

Most of the better multi-class builds require the expansion campaigns, both MOTB and SOZ.

Archers can be pretty good as well, but it depends heavily on the build.

I just did this one for you:

http://nwn2db.com/build.php?id=79871&version=1


As far as archers go - it's a strong build.

From what I remember you won't need "Mighty" on a bow for the strength damage to carry through on your attacks. This means that all that strength damage adds to your damage each attack. It makes an archer *much* more powerful.

I've also maximized the basic skills you'll need in the campaign.

One final perk of this build is "knockdown" (6th level) in case any opponent gets close to you.

Perform skill is there for your Bardic inspiration of Courage which gives you +1 attack and +1 damage.

so would you recomend going full fighter or paladin then maybe?

EDIT: ok i see you add some stuff, thanks. So bows get damage from strength aswell as dex?
EDIT: Ok so like if im going to play an archer ain't all the enemies gonna run towards me cos atleast that's what I've red about it (I remember reading about it somewere, I swear, I think...)

Luhtonen wrote:so would you recomend going full fighter or paladin then maybe?

EDIT: ok i see you add some stuff, thanks. So bows get damage from strength aswell as dex?
EDIT: Ok so like if im going to play an archer ain't all the enemies gonna run towards me cos atleast that's what I've red about it (I remember reading about it somewere, I swear, I think...)

You would need to make sure that the Strength bonus was operating without the need for "mighty" in the bow description (..or compound bows).

Enemy attack operation is:

1st run toward someone attacking them.
2nd if not being attacked, generally toward the closest member of your party.

Basically try not to let this character attack anyone until your tank (Khelgar) has already started beating on somone. The exception would be enemy mages or other opponents with mage-like ability (like Slyph's and their mental attack). HOWEVER, read further to see that even these maneuvers aren't necessary.

Like most melee builds, the weak-point will be will-saves. Make sure you build-out your companions for crafting. Read through this guide:

Thieves-Guild.Net - Your Portal to everything Neverwinter!

The " Medallion of Thought: Immunity to mind-affecting spells and effects, +5 to Diplomacy and Bluff" is the one item I'd recommend ASAP for this build (..and "ASAP" is just past chapter 2 before you can craft it). It's listed under the spoiler recipes list for amulets.

This build's high attack numbers and high damage allow it to kill very quickly most opponents that it targets. (..more so than about any other build I can think of).

Additionally this build can wear full-plate armor AND has an additional +2 to AC from the RDD class (but can't cast any spells reliably, not that you'll have many to cast), and can still fling a few fireballs in-between resting periods (at level 10 from the RDD class).

Note: Mithral Full-Plate will net you +11 AC with your Dexterity bonus. IF you enhance your Dexterity with gloves (or boots) by +2 then Mithral Chain Shirt will net you +10 AC with your Dexterity bonus (by level 8), AND allow you to cast spells without failure. Frankly though I don't think you'll need to be casting any spells, so I'd recommend Mithral Full Plate.

In reality this character is no worse defensively than most builds in a melee situation. It's not as good *offensively* as a multi-opponent melee build with all the cleaves however - because of the lack of cleaves (and only in those situations where there are multiple opponents all ganged-up on this character). On the other hand it does have extra attacks per round, and can also enhance this with Manyshot. (..Manyshot is particularly nice for killing enemy mage-types in one round right at the start of battle.)


I guess what I'm saying here is that it doesn't matter if a bunch of opponents gang-up on this character. The armor is as good or better than many melee builds.



Here are a few other OC only builds I've done for others:

Disarming Fighter | NWN2 Character Builder

Reaver, the right hand of Garagos | NWN2 Character Builder

Neither are "Paladins".. but they each have their own "perk".

The Paladin-type builds I've done all require other modules.

Here is a Paladin for the OC I just did:

Paladin | NWN2 Character Builder


This is to give you an idea of the difference from archer build.


It pretty much requires even ability scores for good saves all-round, and Charisma bonuses to saves and Divine Might/Divine Shield.

It's expressly designed for Shield use, where the archer isn't. Heavy Shield gives no penalty to attack and provides a +2 AC.. BUT you can enchant shield with additional AC.

It would wear full plate armor, but NOT Mithral Plate (there would be no advantage unless you had a Dexterity modifier on). This leaves the net +AC from armor to +9 (including the +1 from your Dexterity).

Add-in your shield of +2 AC and you have the same +11 basic armor of the archer wearing Mithral Full Plate.

The archer build has an additional +2 AC from the RDD class however, and one more +1 in AC bonus from Tumble than the paladin. The paladin has "Luck of Heros" feat for +1 AC.

The paladin build has additional AC up to +5 from enchanting a shield at it's highest level (in the OC). Additionally the Paladin can also "cast" Divine Shield for another +2 to +6 AC for a short period. (..to get +6 requires a +8 Nymph Cloak).

So at the highest levels the paladin can have as much as a +9 AC bonus beyond the archer - though usually no more than +3 better than the archer. (..actually we could further improve the AC by +2 for the paladin with a tower shield, BUT that incurs a -2 penalty to attack that isn't worth it IMO.)


Because the paladin needs lots of attributes it can't really concentrate fully on strength. To partially overcome this limitation I've selected the highest base damage weapon in the game - the greatsword at 2d6 (average 6). However to still use a shield requires on-handed operation via Monkey Grip. This unfortunately lowers attacks by -2. Worse, strength also is the bonus for attacks - and again, strength has been somewhat sacrificed in this build.

Archer:
12th level: BAB +10, Dexterity bonus +5, Longbow focus +1, Bardic Courage of Inspiration +1 = 17 for it's first AND second attacks with Improved Rapid Shot ON.

20th level: BAB +18, Dexterity bonus +5, Longbow focus +1, Bardic Courage of Inspiration +1, Arcane Archer bonus +5 = 30 for its first AND second attacks.

Paladin:
12the level:BAB +12, Strength bonus +4, Greatsword focus +1, Monkey Grip -2 = 15 for it's first attack only, 10 for it's second attack.

20th level: BAB +20, Strength bonus +5, Greatsword focus +1, Monkey Grip -2 = 24 for its first attack only, 19 for its second attack.

Note: NONE of the calculations include modifiers for either Strength or Dexterity - which practically speaking could be equal.


The higher the attack number the more often you'll hit, and the more often you'll score a critical hit for double damage.



As for damage, it's as much about damage per second as total damage. Here the archer has a significant advantage in that it requires virtually no time to start damaging an enemy. The paladin however must run to confront their enemy - often expending over a round in total for damage to *start* to occur.

Basic damage:

Archer level 20: Longbow averages 4, Strength damage +7, Bardic Inspiration +1, Longbow Specialization +2, Arcane Archer +5 = a net average of 19 per "hit" not including criticals or other sources of damage.

Paladin level 20: Greatsword averages 6, Strength damage +5, Greatsword Specialization +2 = 13.. THEN add-in Divine Might at an additional +6 with a Nymph cloak +8 which gets you to a net of 19 per hit, not including criticals or other sources of damage.

With criticals the higher attack numbers of the archer will allow for high chance of criticals (particularly because of the 2nd attack at the full attack number), this is despite the fact that the threat range of the paladin's attack is twice as good.


Enchantment damage: you cannot add more than +5 average of damage to the longbow with enchantments in the OC, whereas you can add +11 of average damage to the greatsword.

Finally the paladin has the opportunity for cleaves in a group fight.


One last thing that should be mentioned:

The paladin has MUCH better saves.

Still, the ability to kill quickly from a distance generally allows you to kill mage-types more quickly with the archer than if you had a paladin running toward them and *hoping* they don't fail a save.

thanks for all the info, was very insightfull reading.

I just updated the feat selection on the archer..

No more knockdown - it was requiring a melee weapon/hand to achieve it..