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For the past several years it seems as though every game released provides players with "Achievements."
And.... people really seem to enjoy this.

OK, I suppose I can understand why people might want a certain amount of recognition in an MMO.. but in a single player game... I honestly fail to grasp the fascination.

In most cases there is not even any tangible benefit. If unlocking all of a game's Achievements nets you a discount on DLCs or some other content, then sure... I could see it.
However, this is not the case, the only gain granted by Achievements is some kind of online boosting right.

Please explain....

To me, it looks like one more way games are getting more and more "consolized". Recent rpg games have adapted many elements typical of the consoles : shaking screens, over-the-top visualia like each swing of the sword leaving a shining trail and stuff like that - things that were supposed to spice up the console game, which could be more indulgent when it came to overall effects and flashiness, but often lacked in story and had little roleplaying possibilities. Achievements were probably a different take on the old "level completed" routine, to give you something other than just hacking through... and once they were successful, they spread.

Or, to put it another way, the more people play games, the stupider the developers think the average gamer is. So they tell you "You Can Now Feel Proud" the same way sitcoms play a laugh track to say "This Is Where You Laugh."

I expect that the growing use, popularity, and acceptance of achievements in games is related to growing awareness of the Bartle Test of Gamer Psychology. Although still controversial, the test has been taken by enough people now (est. 700k) that estimations can be made about player populations.

In short, the test suggests that gamers, especially mmo players, fall into four distinct categories, with most players enjoying all four aspects but with one being strongly dominant. The four types of gamer psychology in Bartle are Achievers (players who collect points, equipment, etc. in order to measure success), Explorers (players who explore maps or lore for hidden information), Socialisers (players who want to interact with others), and Killers (players who want to compete directly with other players). The scoring creates a four letter code, similar to Myers-Briggs personality type, such as EASK.

There a really good, if slightly outdated, stats breakdown at Overall MUD stats . What you can see there, as well as some other pages, is that Achievement is not often the primary attribute, but it is also rare for it to be the last one. In other words, most players will gain enjoyment from following an achievement based path, even if it isn't the primary reason that they play the game.

So I expect that from a game design point of view, adding "achievements" is a low cost method of creating appeal for most gamers, compared to adding other types of content. Achievements don't replace the exploring, socialising, and killing, but they complement all three. Likewise, out of game achievements, as opposed to actual gold, equipment, etc., provide any easy way for players to track their "progress", and act as an out of game reminder of their in-game enjoyment.

It's sort of like giving levels to the old score system. Instead of only getting that sense of accomplishment at a new high score you now get it in stages. I don't really care about accomplishments myself, but I never cared about my scores in games either.

G'day DW!

Its definitely a console thing used primarily for bragging rights and whatnot. However there are developers out there who do use it to great effect, Bethesda for example worked their achievements out to encourage players to fully explore the side quests of Skyrim, whilst others ask you do things normally not associated with said games. A case point being Borderlands, a first person shooter which had an achievement called My Brother Is An Italian Plumber which you earned by killing an enemy by jumping on it. Well I thought it was funny...

The bragging thing normally comes in when an achievement can only be earned from finishing a game on its hardest difficulty or getting 100% completion. Its an alpha male thing no doubt in its pure geekiness

The achievements you talk about Tamerlane are pretty good achievements. It wouldn't be such a 'weirdness' for PC gamers if *all* the achievements were actually either genuine achievements or fun asides like those you mention. However, I think Dragon Wench means achievements as a whole.

It is somewhat odd to be playing a game and receive a sudden notification of an achievement by simply doing what needs to be done anyway in order to advance in the game. Clear out a dungeon, get a 'dungeon clearer' achievement. The dungeon is going to be cleared by all players as a matter of routine, there is no 'achievement' here. The achievement has no use for the game either, it's just a badge.

Badge collecting is cool. It's no different to hoarding anything else in a game, gold, gems, potions, swords etc. However, achievements are not really collectable because the game does not tell you how many there are nor how to get them, it just gives you them out the blue while you do something else.

If there was a specific list in the inventory which acted like a collection folder and completion of which required finding/doing things one wouldn't normally do (as some achievements do) then the appeal would be more obvious.

Just having them as 'in the know' 'secrets' for gamers to boast about on-line doesn't really add anything to the game itself, and this is the aspect Dragon Wench was referring to, the act of just playing a game on your own in your spare time outside of the *new game rush* hype period during a game's first year of release.

Lemmus makes some really interesting points about the psychology behind gaming.

A related point is the sense of self-actualization. It relates back to Maslow's hierarchy of needs, the most basic of which are survival based, like food and shelter, but the most complex is the need for self worth. In normal life, we get this through meaningful contributions to organizations, friends and communities. Games have the potential to emulate these feelings of self-worth, and can be positive. For example, running a guild or making friends online. It can also be somewhat negative, replacing the drive to for achievement in society with achievements in games.

Which brings us to to those little pop ups that say good job. Each time we get one, a little part of our brain gets a happy feeling, which is slightly addictive.

Nothing wrong with it unless it starts to replace motivation in the real world.

Simple:
It appeals to the 'completiononist' and the OCD nature in me :laugh:

And it's fun to compete with friends about them

Xandax wrote:And it's fun to compete with friends about them

Compete.. and take advantage of.

I remember a story (I might have heard it here) about someone's colleague getting teased at work for having sex with someone of the same gender, but in Fable. They noticed through their Steam achievements or some such.

Bummer...

Tricky wrote:Compete.. and take advantage of.

I remember a story (I might have heard it here) about someone's colleague getting teased at work for having sex with someone of the same gender, but in Fable. They noticed through their Steam achievements or some such.

You say tomato, I say tomato .... oh wait - does not work well in writing :laugh:

dragon wench wrote:For the past several years it seems as though every game released provides players with "Achievements."
And.... people really seem to enjoy this.

OK, I suppose I can understand why people might want a certain amount of recognition in an MMO.. but in a single player game... I honestly fail to grasp the fascination.

In most cases there is not even any tangible benefit. If unlocking all of a game's Achievements nets you a discount on DLCs or some other content, then sure... I could see it.
However, this is not the case, the only gain granted by Achievements is some kind of online boosting right.

Please explain....

Players forgot how to RP and how to play RPGs just for the thrill of exploration and having fun. Developers put achievements in RPGs to make players explore content that is unnecessary to explore in a power-playthrough. By this they create a new, different kind of power-players: achievement hunters.

Something was definitely lost since Baldur's Gate. CRPGs, and the community that plays them, are forgetting what RPGs were originally about: simplicity, beauty, involving questlines, lovable NPCs who feel like real friends (who aren't complete douchebags or powerfemales), the thrill of exploration, and that feeling of fear when you meet the first skeleton in a tomb.

Nowadays, the trend is to give players more and more power, to make campaigns more and more epic (even Pen & Paper D&D is following this line), to make the NPCs you pick up the medieval equivalent of the Justice League, and to pay little budget and attention on parts of the game which powergamers will ignore anyway. Any exploration or discovery which you need not do or make to complete the game is neatly tied to an achievement so that there's a reward for doing this otherwise useless thing.

Players and designers forget that in the old days, the reward for trying new things was the fun of trying new things. And that low-level, classic scenarios (exploring a tomb with some undead, rescuing someone from an orc camp or just exploring the sewers) can be a lot more fun than giant, world-saving butchering sprees through armies of darkness.

I still view 'Achievements' as bragging rights as what the others had mentioned. Usually something I tend to ignore most of the time in games, similar to 'collectibles', unless said collectibles tend to boost a weapon's stats like extra damage and larger magazines as in the case of Max Payne 3 or some other older games I can't recall.

DesR85 wrote:I still view 'Achievements' as bragging rights as what the others had mentioned. Usually something I tend to ignore most of the time in games, similar to 'collectibles', unless said collectibles tend to boost a weapon's stats like extra damage and larger magazines as in the case of Max Payne 3 or some other older games I can't recall.

This. But achievements usually makes me feel bad especially on games that i get ALL of them because i sit there and think... "where has my life gone? , wasn't I 17 yesterday? and now im 24 about to be 25?"....but seriously i still continue to spend hours and hours a day as a routine playing games when i should be doing something else. Addiction factor...and achievements just feed it.