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Build Help
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:12 am
by Armored Revenger
I just got NWN Diamond Edition and I've recently beaten the original campaign with a pure paladin but I understand that SoU and HotU are better played with a new character. I was wondering if this build plan is worth it.
First things first though is there a way to export my build data or am I gonna have to type out all 40 levels of this thing xD.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:27 am
by GawainBS
You'll have to type it out, I'm afraid. There's a recent thread by Claudius discussing pros & cons of different builds for SoU and HotU. Perhaps you can get some ideas from that?
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:27 am
by Armored Revenger
Paladin (1)/Fighter(1)/Cleric (38)
Strength: 15 (20)
Dexterity: 10
Constitution: 10
Wisdom: 16 (30)
Intelligence: 14
Charisma: 10 (21+) [Boosted by equipment such as Amulet of Turning and Nymph Cloak. Also planning on using Empowered Eagle's Splendor to increase it further.]
Notes: The level in Paladin is mostly to make Paladin-specific gear (Such as the Holy Avenger) usable and Immunity to disease isn't bad in my opinion. Likewise the level in Fighter is only for the bonus feat.
Skills Notes: When I get into my cleric levels I will simply raise Concentration, Lore and Spellcraft as high as possible and leave Persuade at 10. I would also put points into Tumble so I can get it to 5 asap then alternate raising Tumble and Discipline (IE. Tumble 6 then Discipline 6 then Tumble 7 then Discipline 7 etc.). Finally the level in Ride is just for Role-playing purposes haha.
PS: would roughly 21 Charisma make Divine Might and Divine Shield worth it? If not what can I trade for them? I'm looking at Knockdown and Improved Knockdown.
PSS: Looks like I can't get Divine Might and Divine Shield because of my lack of Charisma haha. I'll still take suggestion as to what to get as my only current choices are Knockdown and Improved Knockdown.
Level Plan
1: Paladin (Power Attack and Weapon Focus: Longsword) [4 Concentration, 4 Discipline, 4 Lore, 4 Persuade 1 Ride]
2: Fighter (Cleave) [5 Concentration, 5 Discipline, 5 Lore]
3: Cleric (Blind-Fight, Domain: Good, Domain: Sun)
4: Cleric Strength +1
5: Cleric
6: Cleric (Extend Spell)
7: Cleric
8: Cleric Wisdom +1
9: Cleric (Empower Spell)
10: Cleric
11: Cleric
12: Cleric Wisdom +1 (Improved Critical (Longsword))
13: Cleric
14: Cleric
15: Cleric (Knockdown)
16: Cleric Wisdom +1
17: Cleric
18: Cleric (Improved Knockdown)
19: Cleric
20: Cleric Wisdom +1
21: Cleric (Epic Weapon Focus (Longsword))
22: Cleric
23: Epic Cleric
24: Epic Cleric Strength +1 (Epic Prowess)
25: Epic Cleric (Armor Skin)
26: Epic Cleric
27: Epic Cleric (Great Cleave)
28: Epic Cleric Wisdom +1 (Great Wisdom I)
29: Epic Cleric
30: Epic Cleric (Great Strength I)
31: Epic Cleric (Great Wisdom II)
32: Epic Cleric Wisdom +1
33: Epic Cleric (Great Strength II)
34: Epic Cleric (Great Wisdom III)
35: Epic Cleric
36: Epic Cleric Wisdom +1 (Great Strength III)
37: Epic Cleric (Great Wisdom IV)
38: Epic Cleric
39: Epic Cleric (Great Wisdom V)
40: Epic Cleric Wisdom +1 (Great Wisdom VI)
Skills End Result: Concentration 43, Discipline 20, Lore 43, Persuade 10, Ride 1, Spellcraft 43, Tumble 20
Spell List:
Cantrips: Light x6
Level 1: Protection From Evil x2, Divine Favor x7
Level 2: Extended Bless, Extended Shield of Faith, Extended Divine Favor x7
Level 3: Prayer x4, Magic Vestment x2, Darkfire x2
Level 4: Empowered Bull's Strength, Empowered Owl's Wisdom, Empowered Eagles Splendor, Empowered Endurance, Extended Negative Energy Protection, Death Ward, Great Magic Weapon
Level 5: Extended Freedom of Movement, Extended Divine Power x7
Level 6: Extended Spell Resistance, Extended True Seeing, Extended Battletide, Harm x2, Heal x2
Level 7: Extended Great Sanctuary, Greater Restoration x2, Word of Faith x2, Sunbeam
Level 8: Empowered Blade Barrier x3, Mass Heal x2, Firestorm (Empowered Undeath to Death sounds good too)
Level 9: Storm of Vengeance x3, Implosion x3
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:07 am
by GawainBS
It looks like you want to use your spells to buff up yourself instead of using them to attack the enemy.
I'd take the minimum WIS required to cast lvl 9 spells, so 19. Perhaps 20. You're spreading your points too thin otherwise. Focus more on STR & CHA. Divine Might & Divine Shield are very good and fit in with your goal of fighting.
Swap Empower Spell for something else, like Toughness, especially with that low CON. I'd rather take 14 CON and 10 INT. As long as you can max Spellcraft, Persuade & Concentration, you're good. I can't recall ever needing Discipline as a skill, and Tumble is a crossclass skill, so it will need lots of points before being worth it. Moreover, with your heavy armour & shield, your Tumble checks will fail most of the time.
As for your spell selection: the direct damage spells tend to be poor choices. Storm of Vengeance does very poor damage.
Overal, it's a decent build, but it's lacking focus.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:22 am
by Armored Revenger
Storm of Vengeance is mostly for the stun. I found it fairly reliable but I'll try something else then.
If I'm gonna focus more on fighting then I might as well just skip out on cleric all together and just get 2 levels of fighter for even more feats and then the rest into paladin then. I'd have better AB by default and paladin buffs work well enough and I can save a ton of points by only putting my wisdom to 14. if I want a Strength based Paladin would 25 charisma be enough (mostly for great smiting)?
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:25 am
by GawainBS
The problem is that if you want enemies to reliably fail their saving throws, you really have to pump your casting stat (WIS, put everything in it) and take the (Greater) Spell Focus feats, and probably (Greater) Spell Penetration.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:38 am
by Armored Revenger
How does mounted combat work? D0 you need a high ride skill to make it worthwhile or is it just the feat that you need? (Just wondering because if I ever come across a module that uses horses I could trade it in for toughness because the AC bonus sounds good)
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:58 am
by GawainBS
I have no idea. You'll have to check the Prestige Resource Consortium manual.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:27 pm
by Armored Revenger
Fighter (2)/Paladin (38)
Strength: 16 (25)
Dexterity: 10
Constitution: 10
Wisdom: 14
Intelligence: 14
Charisma: 14 (20)
Notes: This is my completely revised build haha. It uses the levels of Fighter for feats and Paladin is the main class.
Skills Notes: I just upgrade Concentration, Discipline and Persuade. Would Concentration be important if I'm only using buffs and not really casting mid-fight? If not I'll put those points towards Persuade and Lore.
Level Plan
1: Paladin (Power Attack and Weapon Focus: Longsword)
2: Fighter (Cleave)
3: Paladin (Blind-Fight)
4: Paladin Strength +1
5: Paladin
6: Paladin (Great Cleave)
7: Paladin
8: Paladin Strength +1
9: Paladin (Improved Critical (Longsword))
10: Paladin
11: Paladin
12: Paladin Strength +1 (Divine Shield)
13: Paladin
14: Paladin
15: Paladin (Divine Might)
16: Paladin Strength +1
17: Paladin
18: Paladin (Extend Spell)
19: Paladin
20: Paladin Strength +1
21: Paladin (Extra Turning)
22: Epic Paladin
23: Epic Paladin
24: Epic Paladin Strength +1 (Extra Smiting, Epic Weapon Focus (Longsword)
25: Epic Paladin
26: Epic Paladin
27: Epic Paladin (Great Charisma I, Epic Prowess)
28: Epic Paladin Strength +1
29: Epic Paladin
30: Epic Paladin (Great Charisma II, Overwhelming Critical)
31: Epic Paladin
32: Epic Paladin Strength +1
33: Epic Paladin (Great Charisma III, Armor Skin)
34: Epic Paladin
35: Epic Paladin
36: Fighter (Devastating Critical, Great Charisma IV)
37: Epic Paladin (Epic Toughness I)
38: Epic Paladin
39: Epic Paladin (Toughness)
40: Epic Paladin Charisma +1 (Epic Toughness II)
Skills End Result: Discipline 42, Lore 43, Persuade 43, Ride 1
Spell List:
Level 1: Protection From Evil x2, Bless Weapon, Deafening Clang
Level 2: Bull's Strength, Eagle of Splendor, Extended Bless, Extended Divine Favor
Level 3: Extended Aura of Glory, Prayer, Greater Magic Weapon
Level 4: Freedom of Movement, Death Ward, Holy Weapon
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:45 pm
by GawainBS
Again: switch INT & CON. You don't need that many skillpoints, but you do need the HP. Also consider going Fighter 4, for Weapon Specialisation & later the Epic version.
Since you got the PrC, consider using Practised Spellcaster (Paladin). It boosts your caster level by 4. Your caster level for Paladin spells is half your Paladin level.
Extend Spell is less useful, since you have fewer spell levels.
Greater Magic Weapon is useless: you'll always find better Longswords. I always felt that Bless & Divine Favour lasted long enough with extending. The bonus from Protection From Evil won't stack with Rings of Protection, which provide better bonuses. Bless Weapon quickly becomes obsolete. Deafening Clang is a good choice.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:40 pm
by Armored Revenger
What's PRC? xD.
Whoops that's a mistake. My int should be at 10 not 14. The reason I extend Divine Favor is because it only last 1 turn no matter what. I'll just use more of it then. Here's another edited build you've been a great help. Thanks.
Fighter (4)/Paladin (36)
Strength: 16 (25)
Dexterity: 10
Constitution: 10
Wisdom: 14
Intelligence: 10
Charisma: 14 (20)
Level Plan
1: Paladin (Power Attack and Weapon Focus: Longsword)
2: Fighter (Cleave)
3: Paladin (Blind-Fight)
4: Fighter Strength +1 (Great Cleave)
5: Fighter
6: Paladin (Divine Shield)
7: Paladin
8: Paladin Strength +1
9: Paladin (Improved Critical (Longsword))
10: Paladin
11: Paladin
12: Paladin Strength +1 (Divine Might)
13: Paladin
14: Paladin
15: Paladin (Extra Turning)
16: Paladin Strength +1
17: Paladin
18: Paladin (Extra Smiting)
19: Paladin
20: Paladin Strength +1
21: Paladin (Epic Weapon Focus (Longsword))
22: Paladin
23: Paladin
24: Fighter Strength +1 (Weapon Specialization (Longsword), Epic Weapon Specialization (Longsword))
25: Epic Paladin
26: Epic Paladin
27: Epic Paladin (Great Charisma I, Epic Prowess)
28: Epic Paladin Strength +1
29: Epic Paladin
30: Epic Paladin (Great Charisma II, Overwhelming Critical)
31: Epic Paladin
32: Epic Paladin Strength +1
33: Epic Paladin (Great Charisma III, Armor Skin)
34: Epic Paladin
35: Epic Paladin
36: Fighter (Devastating Critical, Great Charisma IV)
37: Epic Paladin
38: Epic Paladin
39: Epic Paladin (Toughness, Epic Toughness)
40: Epic Paladin Charisma +1
Skills End Result: Discipline 42, Lore 43, Persuade 43, Ride 1
Spell List:
Level 1: Bless, Defeaning Clang, Divine Favor x2
Level 2: Bull's Strength, Eagle of Splendor, Aura of Glory x2
Level 3: Prayer x3
Level 4: Freedom of Movement, Death Ward, Holy Weapon
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:56 pm
by GawainBS
1 turn = 10 rounds = sufficient time to end most combats.
Consider starting with 15 STR & 12 CON. You now end with 25 STR, which is the same as 24.
I'd drop Great Cleave: the time you will kill more than one enemy per round are few. (And if you do, they are probably so weak it doesn't matter.) Practised Spellcaster?
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:03 pm
by Armored Revenger
Great Cleave and 25 Strength is for Devastating Critical actually. It's a prerequisite. Also I don't have Practiced Spellcaster because I have no idea what PRC actually is.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:08 pm
by GawainBS
You have the PRC installed, since you have the Ride skill. Or did it get added by some official expansion too? It is an unofficial expansion which adds tons of Prestige Classes, feats and spells to every mod you wish, including the OCs.
I forgot about the prerequisites.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:13 pm
by Armored Revenger
Ah I see I should look into that. Also Ride was added into the official expansions though it isn't actually used in any of them except in Wyvern Crown of Cormyr.
I currently have CEP. Would that have compatibility problems with PRC?
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:18 pm
by GawainBS
No, I used both CEP & PRC concurrently.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:21 pm
by Armored Revenger
Oh ok. Guess I'll just download PRC and that merger that seems to come with it.
Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:22 pm
by GawainBS
It might give errors, but just keep clicking "Yes" or "Ok". It always worked for me.
Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:39 pm
by Claudius
Here is a great resource for building
http://home.comcast.net/~worldofgreyhawk/buildsearch/
TyrTemplar has some solid builds for paladin.
Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 10:14 pm
by Armored Revenger
Thanks a lot for the help. Just to confirm a few things out of curiosity.
Would this build would work even with Greatswords? I'm thinking it will personally.
Also does Bless Weapon, Deafening Clang and Holy Avenger stack?