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I have made a lawful good fighter whom I plan to dual class into a thief. However, I require an alignment change to do this. Does anyone know if the alignment change associated with the evil path with the tears in hell allows for a previously LG fighter to dual into a thief? Moreover, in TOB I believe it is possible to change the alignment back to LG. Has anyone tried this?

Do you really want to wait that long to dual? And why a lawful good Fighter if you plan to dual him/her to a Thief?

You could always use ShadowKeeper. That way, you could even stay lawful good as a Fighter/Theif if you wanna.

Do you need to change the alignment because of specifics in the thief's background, or are you having problems envisioning any thief as LG? I can easily see a thief or fighter with "thievish" characteristics who has "turned over a new leaf," so to speak, and uses their talents for an LG cause. If you need literary references, consider Frodo in LOTR: definitely LG. If you want to descend to comics, look at Pete Wisdom in Marvel Comics: a formerly pure neutral type who reformed into LG.

Thieves can't be Lawful Good, so I'd be surprised if the dual is normally allowed...

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Astafas:
[QB]Do you really want to wait that long to dual? And why a lawful good Fighter if you plan to dual him/her to a Thief?

At what level is it optimal to dual into a thief? I have grandmastery in katana and would like grandmastery in another weapon to take full advantage of dual weilding. Is this overkill?

You don't need grandmastery in the weapon you have in your off hand. You only get one attack with that weapon anyway. Of cource, you get a couple of extra plusses on to hit and damage, but really, don't need to go beyond specialized (2 points).
That way you need 4 weapon proficiency points plus the six you get from the start, which equals in a level 18 fighter which is already too late for a dual in my opinion.
If you have ToB, I would dual at 13th level which allows you grandmastery in one weapon and 3 dots in dualwield. I would dualwield two katanas if I were you, but if you really want to use another weapon (a hammer, per chance?) in you off hand, deal with the fact that you're THAC0 and damage suffers a little.

-Silvanerian

Somebody in this dialogue mentioned Frodo as an example of a lawful good theif. Frodo is not a theif. Just because he happens to be a halfling (hobbit) it doesn't mean he is a theif. I don't even think there is an accurate class for Frodo. Sorry to be so picky; I am a LOTR freak.

I think I heard anoweenie can get above specialized in weps due to the fact he is dualed early...

someone confirm this...

so if you dual at the right level, you can improve the starting fighter proficiencies, right?

Originally posted by UserUnfriendly:
<STRONG>I think I heard anoweenie can get above specialized in weps due to the fact he is dualed early...

someone confirm this...

so if you dual at the right level, you can improve the starting fighter proficiencies, right?</STRONG>

Confirmed! Has no importance when you dual for this.

@Lagrange:

Use the same kind of weapon in both hands (I recommmend Long Swords) and make sure to put *** into Dual Wielding. Go for at least Mastery (***) in your chosen weapon as this will give you +3 To Hit compared to the +1 for Specialized.

@UserUnfriendly:

Aerieweenie, Aerieweenie, Aerieweenie...

[ 10-06-2001: Message edited by: Astafas ]

Originally posted by Tom Bombadil:
<STRONG>Somebody in this dialogue mentioned Frodo as an example of a lawful good theif. Frodo is not a theif. Just because he happens to be a halfling (hobbit) it doesn't mean he is a theif. I don't even think there is an accurate class for Frodo. Sorry to be so picky; I am a LOTR freak.</STRONG>

Then Bilbo, if you want to be picky, in The Hobbit. S'okay?

Bilbo is definately not Lawful Good. Neutral or Chaotic Good I'd say.

Originally posted by Quitch:
<STRONG>Bilbo is definately not Lawful Good. Neutral or Chaotic Good I'd say.</STRONG>

Bilbo's actions, IMO, constitute that of someone who is lawful good.

And if Frodo isn't a thief, what according to AD&D rules would you call him?

The reality is, Frodo doesn't really fit well into any AD&D category. If I had to pick one, it would be a bard, because he was apparently quite adept at singing. After bard, I would say fighter, although I don't think he actually kille anything the entire book(s). And I think Bilbo was maybe lawful good in the beginning (but probably NG), and maybe turned Chaotic Good or maybe Chaotic Neutral by the LOTR (when the ring go t ahold of him)

According to AD&D, Frodo would be classless. Just like the average peasant isn't a level 1 adventurer either.

Maybe he gained a level of Thief or Fighter while traveling, though. His party members racked up a decent amount of XP for him, after all.

With the greatest reluctance, I am going to pound myself into oblivion (and out again) for pulling in another topic and spamming this thread. If you want to continue discussing Frodo, Bilbo, and alignments, let's do it over in SYM.