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what do you guys think is the best hybrid fighter as in scout/gaurdian or scoundrel gaurdian. i like the scoundrel's luck skill cause +6 def is VERY nice. however, i have seen many talk about scout gaurdian's what do you guys think?

25 veiws and no answers?

Since the game is actually a pretty easy one, and it's an RPG (though some would actually argue), the best course is to play in a way that you feel like playing at the moment. For example, I'm passing the game for the third time, and I'm playing a Dark Side soldier(8)/consular character, and I have both droids in my party whenever I can.

The soldier/consular choice I made because I wanted to try a Consular for the extended force abilities and their sheer amount, but I still have to have a character able to hold his own in melee (hence the soldier at first). It's not the best of combos but it's very enjoyable.

As far as the scout/guardian combo is concerned, you just have to think about the way you play. The first two times I played a soldier/guardian and I didn't give it much thought, but the scout is actually more fitting for me as the guardian starting class, because I always take Flurry and always take Implants (the scout gets flurry at level 1, and can max out Implants on his/her own at level 8, saving you four feats in total). That's one extra feat until lvl 8 (because the scout normally gets three less than the soldier up to that point), not a big deal, but hey, you asked.

It's a very good combo in theory, the scout/guardian one, and I'm definitely going to try it out next time. The only question you have to really ask yourself is how far you want to take the scout, level 4 (Implant 2 + Uncanny Dodge 1) or level 8 (Implant 3 + Uncanny Dodge 2). In the first case scenario you get more force powers as a Guardian, but for me it doesn't matter anyhow, the only ones I use are Master Speed, Heal and Force Wave if I'm a lightside guardian, my party takes care of the rest. So I'll be going scout(8)/guardian(12), but your choice is your own

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you really don't need it in KOTOR...


...but the best combination is the Scoundrel (6/7) / Guardian with...

- max STR

- master critical
- dual-wielding
- implants (for STR)

- force wave
- heal

- light exoskeleton
- baragwin assault blade
- short lightsaber (with high BBD)

...the rest is up to you


but be warned KOTOR could get very boring...

...cause you will kill almost everything in one round !!!


(it's an absolut deadly combination of critical hit - stun - sneak attack)

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There are no strength implants... and you could probably do better using robes instead of armour and with master speed.

ok i think i have decided 5/15 scout/gaurdian simply b/c they get implants and flurry to start..... however i havebt got to very late game yet.... what is the best implant?

Originally posted by Armisael
There are no strength implants... and you could probably do better using robes instead of armour and with master speed.

sorry you're right - there are so many great STR-enhancing items that I was a little confused - but if you take all these - the +5 DEX implant will also be very helpful !!

master speed is great - but with this character you won't need it in most battles

AFAIK you can't kill (melee) more than 1 enemy per round

and on the other hand - the time you need to cast master speed the 1st enemy is already dead !!!

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No guarantee you'll be able to kill an enemy with only two hits, though. Also the likelihood of getting a critical increases significantly with double the attacks.

is getting lvl 3 implant worth it?

Only reason I'd take it would be if I was going for a defensive build... but if you have feats to spare you can get it.

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if you want to use implants (recommended) - go for level 3 !

you can get +5 DEX or +4 CON or weapon spec. for all weapons beside lightsabres


btw. I would only take one active feat (you only can use one at a time)

- for scoundrels use critical hit

- for scouts use flurry


...you should have enough free feats this way !

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Originally posted by Armisael
No guarantee you'll be able to kill an enemy with only two hits, though. Also the likelihood of getting a critical increases significantly with double the attacks.

no guarantee but a very high chance:

baragwin assault blade: 19-20 natural critical range

with master critical: 13-14 critical range

with keen (upgrade): 11-12 critical range

...and for most enemies you have to roll 10-20 for a hit - so every hit is critical !

if STR is high enough almost every critical hit will stun the enemy !

...and with the enemy stunned all following attacks get a 3or4D6 sneak bonus!




this gives you following damage calculation


main hand B.A.Blade:

1st hit: 6-36 + 10-16 (STR bonus) x2 (critical): damage ~ 32-104

2nd hit: 32-104 + 4-24 sneak



2nd hand small lightsabre (solari+ upari+ MOF):

1st hit: 2-12 + 2-16 + 10-16 (STR bonus) x2 (critical): damage ~ 28-88 + 4-24 sneak


alltogether (32+104+32+104+4+24+28+88+4+24) /2 = 222 damage per round !


not so many enemies with 200+ HP in KOTOR !

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With a strength bonus of +16 you'll be hitting most enemies on any roll higher than a one, and if you were only landing on rolls higher than 10, then master speed would become even more essential, as you'd only be hitting with every second attack anyway.

Not quite sure where you're getting that third attack from, but remember that you're only attacking twice per round with two weapons and critical strike. Aside from that, you don't know which attack will score the critical, or if either will at all.

Let's assume for the moment that you have a +16 strength bonus, that you're fighting a darksider, that your first hit will stun 100% of the time, and that you'll get one critical per round regardless of the fact that your offhand weapon's threat range is not 11-20. Mathematically, you could have an average of either 126 damage per round (44-104 + 20-42 + 4-24) or 120 damage per round (22-52 + 40-84 + 4-24), depending on whether your main or off-hand scores the crit. It's worth also accounting for the worst case scenario, because we're using critical strike, which is always an unknown quantity -- if you get no critical at all, your average damage plummets to 89 per round (22-52 + 20-42 + 4-24).

I'd definitely go with master speed. Especially if you're planning on compensating your defense some with that level 3 implant. I'd also use a much more damaging lightsaber than that, but that's my prerogative.

Originally posted by Armisael
With a strength bonus of +16 you'll be hitting most enemies on any roll higher than a one, and if you were only landing on rolls higher than 10, then master speed would become even more essential, as you'd only be hitting with every second attack anyway.

Not quite sure where you're getting that third attack from, but remember that you're only attacking twice per round with two weapons and critical strike. Aside from that, you don't know which attack will score the critical, or if either will at all.

Let's assume for the moment that you have a +16 strength bonus, that you're fighting a darksider, that your first hit will stun 100% of the time, and that you'll get one critical per round regardless of the fact that your offhand weapon's threat range is not 11-20. Mathematically, you could have an average of either 126 damage per round (44-104 + 20-42 + 4-24) or 120 damage per round (22-52 + 40-84 + 4-24), depending on whether your main or off-hand scores the crit. It's worth also accounting for the worst case scenario, because we're using critical strike, which is always an unknown quantity -- if you get no critical at all, your average damage plummets to 89 per round (22-52 + 20-42 + 4-24).

I'd definitely go with master speed. Especially if you're planning on compensating your defense some with that level 3 implant. I'd also use a much more damaging lightsaber than that, but that's my prerogative.

AFAIK: in KOTOR you get 2 attacks per round from your main hand and one additional from dual-wielding - but I might be a little confused playing KOTOR, TOEE and IWD2 at the same time (cause fights in KOTOR are just to easy )

I always said masterspeed could be very useful - but the main advantage is against enemy-groups with high HP (but sad but true there aren't much in KOTOR - especially not in the early/mid-game).

...but if you get later in the game the chrystals to build a good BBD-lightsabre for your 2nd hand and have the +5 DEX implant - I would suggest to change to a robe (but this won't be before you get the last starmap!!!)

BTW I don't know a lightsabre combination that makes more damage then the B.A.blade (btw. the energy-only damage of the lightsabre could be quite useless against some enemies)

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You only get one attack with your main hand.

You can get a +3 dexterity implant as early as Kashyyyk, if you like.

Speed's usefulness is not limited to the late game. The extra attack will help you from the moment you get it; you can have knight speed on Dantooine, where it's especially useful against kath hounds and Mandalorians. Speed is always useful, straight up and down. You can get by without it, but having it around makes a meleer's life so much easier that not using it is tantamount to handicapping yourself.

As for lightsabers, get a double-bladed saber and stick in the Heart of the Guardian, an upari and a solari. 5-42 base damage. Probably the best crystal configuration for a non-critical build. With this build, I'd dump the short lightsaber and use a regular lightsaber with the same configuration for 5-38.

there is no real reason why you shouldn't have 11-12 with both hands, since a nextor crystal will do that for you, and if you are going for a critical build there is no real reason to get half the critical strikes. And master speed is indisputably better than going without it, as it essentially doubles your damage potential (for a critical build), maybe even more because two attacks might not hit but four certainly will. (dont forget the +4 defense to boot)
for a meeler it is the spell that has the highest damage yield so why not use it? if your argument is less armor rating then its redundant because you will be killing so quickly you wont be taking damage anyway. There really isnt much to loose.

The thing with the nextor is that it doesn't confer keenness when you're using either of the two Yavin colour crystals -- it's a question of whether you're better off having a slightly greater threat range, or having a higher average damage with both regular hits and criticals otherwise. Your offhand only ever attacks once per round, though, if I'm not mistaken, so it's not really that big a deal when you're getting four attacks per round out of course.

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with a good light armor you get a very high AC with the melee scoundrel / guardian...


on my 1st planet dantooine I the high AC (30+) was really useful

...not being hit by anything is better then one extra attack !

...and I didn't even thought about changing this configuration on Kashyyk, Tatooine and Manaan cause it was just terribly easy...

...but you might be right that it would be even more easy with speed instead of armor...

on the leviathan I tried master speed - it works also great...


btw. what a silly discussion for such an easy game !


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Easy or not, it's an RPG, and for me the fun of an RPG is building my character...

With a little effort, you can get your AC much higher with only robes than you can wearing armour. Click here if you want to learn more.

Originally posted by Armisael
Easy or not, it's an RPG, and for me the fun of an RPG is building my character...

With a little effort, you can get your AC much higher with only robes than you can wearing armour. Click here if you want to learn more.

...I know...

..and I understand the RPG factor - but this is just the weakest point of KOTOR...

...you really don't need maxed out characters...


e.g. I killed (unbuffed before battle and on highest difficult level) Malak in both leviathan encounters in 4 rounds - 1st immunity, 2nd speed - 3rd master critcal and - 4th after the 2nd of 4 hits Malak was dead and the game intercepted declaring him still alive...

Calo, Darth Brandon and all the others didn't even scratch me...

so for what do I need anymore - where is the fun in maxing a character that is stand-off totally uber-powered ?

...if there would be at least one challenging battle for testing your maxed-out character...


back to AC:

yes you can max beyond AC 50 (for a few seconds)...

...but for what reason should I buff me up with several spells and potions when I won't be hit with AC 35 ???

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