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After doing the quest with the werewolves (Enemy of my Enemy??) I got to thinking about these hulking brutes. How powerful are they compared to vampires and why do they have such a hate for vampires. Do they gain in power as they age ect?

All in all they got me quite curiouse as they sure seem rather unbeatable, at least in a standup fight.

i think they're invulnerable because we dont have silver bullets in the game .. or a silver-bladed katana

rennox,

Werewolves ( garou as they prefer tobe known) are the defenders of gaia they see Vamps as the creatures of the wyrm ( gaia's hated enemy)

garou tend to be physically harder than Vamps ( but no way near the level the 'Demon' doggy is in bloodlines)

Have a look on the white wolf website Just google white wolf)for more info on garou

hoope this helps let me know if you wnat some more ;-)

Kirche

ps werewolves are not invulnerable to normal weapons - but silver does aggravated damage to them as sunlight and fire does to Vamps

Do they stay in "Werewolf" form 24/7 , or do they change back to human?
From what i remember from fairy tales ,they only change on full moons, right?
I'd love to see a werewolf-themed game.
The werewolf in bloodlines is so tough, because you are not supposed to kill him
in combat.

*slight spoiler ahead.*
You are either supposed to outwait him, or kill him with a trap.

They are free to change from man to full wolf, and any of the stages in-between at will.

A werewolf the apocolypse PC game would be good, if it was as decently written and full of intrigue as bloodlines. The Garou have clans with varying relations just as is the case in the world of the kindred, as well as many wyrm enemies, it could be done very well.

Fair Point well made, a pc game could be good - if they put in plenty of plot not *grows claws* PLOT!!!!!

Kirche

The "safe gaia" theme doesn't sound very appealing to me.
I'd like to see a werewolf captured (the hero) and dragged into a city for further examinations. The game would be about escaping and silencing any witnesses.

And if it was combined with some *real* fighting system instead of a skill based one, i would be a happy gamer

Going back to the werewolf in the game i remember there was one in Vampire redemption ,too. Both had in common, that there was zero dialouge and both looked a little bit out of place. After reading all those warning about werewolves while loading areas, i was a bit dissapointed that there was only one short encounter with one.

I was a little irratated by how the Werewolf seemd to have unlimited Rage to burn to keep up with my level 4 Celerity.

Another thing the werewolves started a fire to trap the Vampires, but its not like they are immune to the stuff. They are just as susceptiable as a human to flames. Also I doubt any werewolf would set fire to a forested area like that, its a total insult to Gaia and all that noise. (Major loss of reknown too, for those who know about that )

I could probably continue to pick apart the werewolf for awhile but I won't because I have really enjoyed this game.

Me again! Here to spoil your imagination with game related facts! Tadah!

Werewolves. Yep, chosen warriors of Gaia. Anyone who did the "Gone Fish'n" mission (hey! It ryhms!) Will have met a Rokea as well, the guardians of the ocean. The earth takes people (or wolves) and gives them the ability to change into five forms (Man, Mostly Man, Wolfman, Huge wolf, Wolf... Hommid, Glabro, Chrnios.. The form we see in the game... Hispo and Lupus), the ability to speak and interact with all the earths spirits, and the Rage and Hate Gaia feels for all the destruction wrought to her very body, the earth. They are religious fanatics, none to bright as a rule, destructive, angry... And pretty much losing the war to save the earth, which only makes them stupider and angrier. PERFECT computer game material (Hulk smash!.. Gains 3 xp!)
Why do they hate vampires? Well, the Wyrm.. The acient spirit of balance that was sent insane and has started to eat Gaia from the inside out, embodys many things. A few of those are Death and Lies. Now, vampires are both dead, and full of constant schems and lies... Not only that, they make OTHER people dead, and force them to play their games of schemes and lies. This makes them the enemy! Of course, Vampires have NO idea about the werewolves wierd hippy-with-an-attitde religion, and just figure the Lupines must be totaly bat s$%* nuts. A fair call when one might cut through a crowd of people to tear a single vampire apart.
They are quite hardcore. They are deisgned ONLY for combat.. However, vampires are designed only for smarts! While a starting level Brujah and a starting level garou would have a TOUGH fight on their hands, the garou would eventualy come out on top with a little luck and some tactics. However, once vampires being to develope discplines like Presence, Auspex, Dominate, Animalism, Thurmaturgy, Obtenerbration, Obfuscate and so on, a smart vampire will over come entier packs of garou alone. So why don't they?? Heres the thing.
In the city they do. No garou, if they are smart, goes hunting vampires in the city. There are ghouls and obidenient, well amred mortals everywhere, and acient vampires with the power to snuff out the life of even a garou with a single thought.. However, vampires that wander around in the woods can find them selves harrowed by the sounds of howls and running feet for hours, then silence... Then suddenly and without warning an entier pack of werewolves will emerge from the spirit world right next to them, tear them instantly to shreds and vanish back into the spirit world in the space of 3 seconds.
No, garou do not get stronger as they age. Unlike vampires, garou are mortal, when they are 75, they have to pee into a bag and have hip operations just like everyone else... Thou their powerful healing ability does tend to fend this off more. However, the more they conqure, they more the other garou and the spirits recognise them as mighty warriors.. And reward them with Rank. (yes, very D&D-esque this isn't it? You killed three goblins and gained a rank) The higher the rank of the garou, the more deadly the training they recive, the more powerful the abilites the spirits will teach them become, and they are given acess to acient occult items of the werewolves known as Fetishes, which can be anything from a sword that could cut through stone, to a key ring that can always point towards fresh food and water.
So, yeah. Werewolves are almost unstopable if you decide to face them one on one with you crow bar and some potence... But look them in the eye with some dominate and say "Roll over and play dead fido" and hey presto, you have one deadly, angry, embrassed pet!
Invunerable to normal weapons? No, far from it, 3 men with fully automatic machine guns stand a fine chance of bringging down a werewolf permently if they can get one good shot in each. However, most people don't realise how quickly they can heal, like vampires. Sure you put it down, but unless you move over and each empty another clip into it while it's laying there, it'll be RIGHT back up again in a few seconds. Werewolves are very resliant, for sure, but a blow to the back of the head with a taxi wielded by a vampire whos used his blood to put his physicals at 10's is going to hell just as quickly as anyone else would.
Ohhh! One last thing. Spending rage doesn't allow you to travle faster.. Ie: keep up with Mr Celerity 4. It's strictly a combat device, allowing for a flurry of blows with hateful passion. You can't, say, spend rage to smoke a joint, type on a computer and read a book all in one action... So if Mr Wolf is keeping up with you, and you want to rationalise it in your mind as to how he could mannage it, Speed Of Thought or other such spirit taught gifts could make it possable for as long as he needed. Heck, maybe Halt The Cowards Flight.. Were you going as fast as you thought??

Well Sorry, in the LARP game I was in you could burn rage to keep up with someones Celerity. Must have been a house rule. And that would be Ms. Celerity 4

Eep! *tips his hat, blushing* Sorry Miss.

Remember folks, theres nobody MORE deserving of politeness then someone with Celerity 4!

Yeah, in the larp game I played in I'm pretty sure their rage gave them extra actions, to do with in a similar way to celerity, had about 2 encounters with them with my sabbat character and we always lost at least 1, mainly due to their ludicrous powers of 'roll over' you will now fall to the ground for 3 rounds, have fun, and crazy 3 agg daggers. Near the end my Lasombra was *almost* on a par with one of them in a straight up physical fight though so I would say they can be beaten, and even easier to just dread gaze them and watch them flee in terror
I would say that silver weapons are a must, as it's the only type of damage they can't regenerate if I remember correctly and I'm almost sure they can soak all but silver too?

[QUOTE=Alonia]Another thing the werewolves started a fire to trap the Vampires, but its not like they are immune to the stuff.[/QUOTE]

The werewolves didn't set the fire; 'someone' set the fire to chase the werewolves OUT of the forest, and towards you. My bet is that it was LaCroix, because he seems to have a knack for sending you on suicide missions and withholding information.
Cas

[QUOTE=Distorted_Boy]The werewolves didn't set the fire; 'someone' set the fire to chase the werewolves OUT of the forest, and towards you. My bet is that it was LaCroix, because he seems to have a knack for sending you on suicide missions and withholding information.
Cas[/QUOTE]

SPOILER:

Lacroix claims its the Kuei-jin, since they wanted to stop the Cam-Anarch alliance.

Here its is, Werewolfs are immortal enemies of vampires. there should be a game that is about the werewolf vs vampire war over territory and survival. that would be cool.

If they would be immortal, i'd prefer to play a Werewolf.
You are stronger, faster than any other human and you recover from pub-brawls quick *and* you are immortal. But the best thing is of course, you can still enjoy beer,long drinks, ****tails, ladies and all that jazz.
So all you game makers listen up! There is a market for werewolf games !

Dem LARP rules is crazy! BTW: "Roll over" is a rank 4-5 gift, I can't remember which... In other words, your storytellers were insane powermongers trying to kill you all! ARGH! RUN!
Ahem, but seriously. The reason rage isn't meant to let you move faster or do two things at once and such is because it's not meant to be blatantly supernatural, more a flurry of angry blows delbt with total hatred and acuracy be dammed! If you've ever seen someone REALLY angry start hitting a person, you'll know what I mean. It's a brutal display of wildly swingging fist(claws), legs(claws again) and screaming(howling and teeth), not a burst of unatural speed, or a magical slowing of time allowing you to plan and move and perform in ways unseen... Using rage to play a guitar faster would just result in you breaking your guitar, for example. Using it to read a book faster, would leave you with a torn book in which you skipped ahead to the sex scenes and fights! Yeah!!
Yeah, the LARP rules are always different thou. I'll admit ignorance to most Werewolf LARP rules, except I've seen the hand sign that signifies Chrinos and Lupus, and both make me laugh violently every time. It's hard to imagine someone as a mighty DireWolf when they have their hands on their head like two cute little ears, or a fearsome, terror enducing war machine when they just have their hands in the air and hooked like claws. Hysterical!
In other news, now, Garou can't soak silver except with a few choice spirit gifts, and yes, everything else they can soak easily (bar those few things which the books state as "Unsoakable").
Meanwhile, taking care of that werewolf enduced a fit of dancing from my Ventrue. I went right back to the nightclub and left him dancing for 20 Mins while I cooked some dinner in celebration... Then I drank blood till it came out my ears.

[QUOTE=pennypincher]Dem LARP rules is crazy! BTW: "Roll over" is a rank 4-5 gift, I can't remember which... In other words, your storytellers were insane powermongers trying to kill you all! ARGH! RUN!
Ahem, but seriously. The reason rage isn't meant to let you move faster or do two things at once and such is because it's not meant to be blatantly supernatural, more a flurry of angry blows delbt with total hatred and acuracy be dammed! If you've ever seen someone REALLY angry start hitting a person, you'll know what I mean. It's a brutal display of wildly swingging fist(claws), legs(claws again) and screaming(howling and teeth), not a burst of unatural speed, or a magical slowing of time allowing you to plan and move and perform in ways unseen... Using rage to play a guitar faster would just result in you breaking your guitar, for example. Using it to read a book faster, would leave you with a torn book in which you skipped ahead to the sex scenes and fights! Yeah!!
Yeah, the LARP rules are always different thou. I'll admit ignorance to most Werewolf LARP rules, except I've seen the hand sign that signifies Chrinos and Lupus, and both make me laugh violently every time. It's hard to imagine someone as a mighty DireWolf when they have their hands on their head like two cute little ears, or a fearsome, terror enducing war machine when they just have their hands in the air and hooked like claws. Hysterical!
In other news, now, Garou can't soak silver except with a few choice spirit gifts, and yes, everything else they can soak easily (bar those few things which the books state as "Unsoakable").
[/QUOTE]

I know our st was indeed quite a powergamer, I think he just went through the book going 'this looks like a mingy power, ask my powergaming friends who play werewolf lol. They were apparently the most powerful werewolves and are cunning packmember did decide to walk behind one and stab him in the back with a knife, so it was called for lol. I was surprised that they were only calling 32 traits though, it might seem ridiculous but once you start adding in potence/celerity my Lasombra could call upwards of 28, hence I was *almost* there, and he was only 11th gen, and they were the hardest.... So I refuse to believe werewolves are *that* bad alone, it's when there are more than 1 with their cheesy mingy powers....
LARP rules in general are quite crazy...once got jumped by 1 Lasombra, doing 3 lethal 4 times a round, took out me and my malk friend in the surprise round and the round we went oh dear, blow obfuscate/majesty. Thankfully with the new system they're basically just using the tabletop rules so that should be a bit better, despite having to roll a dice or another method of generating a 1-10.
Anyway I digress, I believe the most prudent method of dealing with werewolves is indeed, run, very very fast lol, and hope there aren't any mirrors around...

It appears that the Werewolf always keeps pace with the vampire ... no matter how much celerity you have. I was using a tremere so had no access to celerity and I think a dex of 3 ... and he was breathing down my neck constantly. So you are best off just saving your blood and running without celerity. I guess it had to be designed this way else it would be no challenge for the "hack and slash" doom fans who choose brujah with high physical stats and impossible for the more thought based clans like tremere whose mental stats are key to survive.

Draig

Considering that social disciplines such as presence and dominate are the most effective method of dealing with werewolves it's a bit pathetic that they don't allow these disciplines to give a different method of getting through rather than running.