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I have started a no-reloads game in which the absolute minimum of people die, and in which non of my party kill anyone. A bit like a former game of mine where I achieved the objective of not killing anyone, but this time I won't be getting anyone else to do the killing unless it is absolutely necessary.
I have started a game with three characters who I intend to take through to ToB, if they survive that is.
They are:
Stealthsword a Halfling Fighter/Thief: Str 17 Dex 19 Con 18 Int 9 Wis 8 Cha 18
Grimwald Magus Elven Fighter/Mage: Str 18 Dex 19 Con 17 Int 18 Wis 5 Cha 8
Wanderer Half Elf Ranger/Cleric: Str 13 Dex 18 Con 18 Int 10 Wis 18 Cha 18

The question is: Who gets the Tomes?

The gauntlets of ogre power will buff up wanderer.
The ring of human influence will go to Grimwald
The gauntlets of Dexterity will go to temporary party members.
The important question lies in where the extra Wisdom, Constitution and Strength should go.
I was planning to give the extra Wisdom and Constitution to Wanderer.
Dexterity to Stealthsword obviously
Charisma to Wanderer or Stealthsword.
Intelligence to Grimwald.
But where to put the Strength?
You may wonder why they all have high dexterity when I could give one of them the Gauntlets of Dexterity. My reasoning is that I want them to wear gauntlets for strength and weapons expertise.
Despite the high dexterity my characters are quite clumsy and will probably end up dropping their equipment at the beginning of SoA if you know what I mean.


Can anyone tell me why when I try to hide spoilers, it works at the office, but not at home?

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The game itself started quite easily, after all, they all have good stats.
However due to not getting much experience from killing people, I am finding it very difficult indeed. I put all my points for my thief in pickpocketing, as without the Cloak of Algernon, I believe that I would have an impossible task.
I pickpocketted him and then went up to the Friendly Inn, picking up a diamond, and two extremely useful rings on the way. At the Inn I was able to get the ring for Joia by charming the Hobgoblin and then pickpocketting him. I had to charm him more than once as the pickpocket failed twice!
I avoided a nasty character at the entrance to the Inn by leading him to one entrance of the temple and exiting through the other, hidden of course.
In the Inn I was given six extremely useful potions upstairs and when Khalid and Jaheira temporarily joined me I acquired some potions from them too together with some other items which I neglected to buy due to my middle name being Scrooge.
I then headed south intending to charm a certain ogre so that I could pickpocket his belt. Unfortunately the pickpocket didn't work. It didn't fail, and it didn't say "No valid items" either. It just failed to work, obviously some kind of bug.
I therefore left him and headed south to where the ogrillions are. I charmed and pickpocketted one of them. As luck would have it, it was the one carrying the letter. I then did the same to a Hobgoblin wearing some boots that I wanted. Then headed off in the direction of Brage and helped him.
So far no deaths at all! Knew that I couldn't help the archaeologist without killing, nor could I help Melicamp or deal with Bassilus without killing.
In Nashkel I picked up the pearl and good armour, sold the pearl and sold Brage's sword.
Left two party members there and completed the mines alone.
I made friends with Mulhaney and as a result he was killed by his earstwhile allies. He killed all but two of the others in there, so I didn't kill anyone. It might have been possible to have avoided some of the deaths, but it is a no-reloads game. Went to rejoin my party and claim my reward.
Further details later.

The strength tome is best spent on the fighter/mage to get 19, the others will still have to rely on potions,spells or items, even with one bonus strength more or less.

But I wouldn't bother about the tomes too much, chances are high that your party won't survive long enough.

kmonster wrote:The strength tome is best spent on the fighter/mage to get 19, the others will still have to rely on potions,spells or items, even with one bonus strength more or less.

But I wouldn't bother about the tomes too much, chances are high that your party won't survive long enough.

You were right. Not enough experience to go round. I arrived at baldur's gate with my fighter/thief being at levels 3 and 3 and the other two being at levels 2 and 2. At Durlag's Tower I had to go round the traps as I couldn't disable them! In the end got blasted by traps at Candlekeep. End of story. If I try it again I think that I will put all my poits on dealing with traps and just enrol Deder's help to get hold of the cloak and boots of stealth. The tomes might have helped a bit, but as you say, not much.

Trying a no-killing no-reloads game I am wondering what the best party would be. Obviously a party of three is too large. A thief of some kind is essential. I think that perhaps I should do without the mage and just enrol Quale at Baldur's Gate. I could of course go for the fighter/mage/thief option and go solo. What do others think has the best chance of sucess?

I would definitely go for the F/M/T solo option, being a theif aloows you to pick traps/locks and just running pass enemies with Hide. Being a fighter allows for more hit points and armor and being a mage lets you cast charms/hold/confuse/defensive spells to avoid having to kill people, it will help a great deal. Also, sinvce you only have one char, you will probably get sufficient exp to clear the game. I'd go with that

Squee wrote:I would definitely go for the F/M/T solo option, being a theif aloows you to pick traps/locks and just running pass enemies with Hide. Being a fighter allows for more hit points and armor and being a mage lets you cast charms/hold/confuse/defensive spells to avoid having to kill people, it will help a great deal. Also, sinvce you only have one char, you will probably get sufficient exp to clear the game. I'd go with that

Thanks for advice. However, I have already restarted game as it was at the start last time. However, I left my cleric/ranger and fighter/mage behind in candlekeep. It will be interesting to see if they are still there when I return.
Fighter/thief is doing exceedingly well.

SPOILERS

Am still having difficulty in hiding text as below when I use this forum at home. Has anyone got an explanation as to why that is?



Used Deder for the initial pickpocketting of Algernon, the ogre with the letter, the boots of stealth and Joia's ring, then left him behind. 1st mines charmed Mulhaney whereupon he was set upon by his minions. To save some lives I made him use hands rather than his weapon. He then used a spell to make a magical weapon and ended up killing about four kobolds and a skeleton before I could stop him. They killed him. Still, better than last time. saved various pets, Brage and got the constitution Tome. Did the bandit camp without any deaths at all and proceeded to the next mines. Charmed Davacorn who was then killed by the guard. So far it has been easy, too easy in a way. However the one place that I think that I might get unstuck before the final battle is the ducal palace.

If I fail this time, I will use your advice and use a fighter/mage/thief as being able to summon monsters to surround Belt and the mage there would certainly make life easier. Not being able to control them is what makes that battle hard. They fight when they should keep out of harms way.

wise grimwald wrote:Thanks for advice. However, I have already restarted game as it was at the start last time. However, I left my cleric/ranger and fighter/mage behind in candlekeep. It will be interesting to see if they are still there when I return.

I would guess not, because I thought I read somewhere around here that the Chapter 6 Candlekeep is a separate map from the Prologue Candlekeep.

You might have had a better chance seeing your dudes again, if you had ditched them dudes in the Candlekeep Inn. Not sure if the Prologue/Chapter 6 Inn maps are separate or not.

Regarding your Hiding Text issue between your home & work PC: maybe it's related to having different color schemes or whatever in your "Appearance" Display Properties? Different video cards, maybe?

I'm diggin' hearin' about your no-killin' adventurin'. Keep up the good work!

CFM wrote:I would guess not, because I thought I read somewhere around here that the Chapter 6 Candlekeep is a separate map from the Prologue Candlekeep.

You might have had a better chance seeing your dudes again, if you had ditched them dudes in the Candlekeep Inn. Not sure if the Prologue/Chapter 6 Inn maps are separate or not.

Regarding your Hiding Text issue between your home & work PC: maybe it's related to having different color schemes or whatever in your "Appearance" Display Properties? Different video cards, maybe?

I'm diggin' hearin' about your no-killin' adventurin'. Keep up the good work!

I actually did leave them in the Inn. However, I suspect that the Inn maps are also separate. The gem upstairs changes to one of lower value and the customers there also change. I guessed that what you said about candlekkep was the case as I once left some potions in the chest (where you find the book) to pick up when I returned. They weren't there! Now at Baldur's Gate. Had to tell Scar that I couldn't cope with the doppelganger's otherwise I would have had to have killed them.

The party members that I left in Candlekeep Inn were indeed nowhere to be found when I returned. Nevertheless, I carried on. At the Ducal Palace, though Belt survived OK, the other one was killed. However, I managed to get through that battle without anyone in my party killing anyone.
I failed in the final battle. I was using an arrow of dispelling to get rid of the ptotections on Semaj. Result, death of Semaj. Unfortunately, unlike BG2, you don't know how many health points opponents have.

Does anyone know how many HP each of the characters has in the final battle? Is it a constant or a variable? I don't want something like that to happen again next time that I try it.

I am thinking of getting Xan to join me for the final battle, or maybe from the Ducal Palace onwards as he has spells that are not deadly, but which take opponents out of the battle.

Who do others think would be of most use at the end? I can get to the Ducal Palace with my fighter thief with no problem.

For the end battle take a party of 6 since the XP doesn't matter any more. At least you get some cannon fodder this way. Clerics like Tiax are probably the best choice, since they can heal,cast protection spells and summon undead armies which can't do serious damage but are excellent cannon fodder.

Other party members with wands of paralysation or wands of monster summoning might also be useful to keep enemies busy until charming succeeds.

kmonster wrote:For the end battle take a party of 6 since the XP doesn't matter any more. At least you get some cannon fodder this way. Clerics like Tiax are probably the best choice, since they can heal,cast protection spells and summon undead armies which can't do serious damage but are excellent cannon fodder.

Other party members with wands of paralysation or wands of monster summoning might also be useful to keep enemies busy until charming succeeds.

By accident I found a ridiculously easy way of killing Semaj.

SPOILER

Cast a scroll of magical protection on him and while he casts ineffectual spells, you can kill him at your leisure.

My main problem is not in killing but in not killing. I can kill savarok simply by backstabbing and running away repeatedly.

To get his own party to kill Savarok there are basically two methods. The first is charming his allies and get them to attack him. Tazok is so resistant to magic even with malaison cast on him, that it is impossible to charm him.
If you charm Semaj or Angello, Savarok kills them in a trice. In other words, it doesn't work.

So the only way that I can think of to defeat Savarok without killing him is to get Angello to kill him by accident with his explosive arrows when Savarok has been almost killed by my thief. The problem is that he runs out of them very quickly and then just fires his arrows of fire at my own characters. Therefore Savarok has to be almost dead when I lead him towards Angello.

That is how I defeated him in my first no-killing game. However it needed several reloads to do it! It is the no re-loads bit that is difficult as I cannot use the trial and error method of getting him to the point of death.

As I have pointed out in a previous thread, you can even kill Savarok accidently with your fists.

That is why I need to know Savarok's stats, in particular how many hit points he can take without killing him.

I think that it is in the vicinity of 100, but not exactly that. Another thought, does he regenerate? That could cause complications in timing things.

I have already failed once through killing him myself accidently and do not want to repeat the mistake.

I have decided not to try taking this character through to SoA as he is far too weak. Nevertheless he is more that adequate to beat Savarok.

So, please does anyone out there know Savarok's stats?