How should I improve my Human F6/WM7?

BilaTheBloody · Post by **BilaTheBloody** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 3:27 pm

My character is Chaotic Good Human F6/WM7 specialising in longswords and I was wondering how best to go from there (I have both MotB and SoZ).

Want to keep him a melee character so was thinking of adding 2 FB levels to get supreme cleave but don't know what else after.

Any help would be appriciated.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 3:33 pm

FB5 for Improved Power Attack. If you have the Wisdom, some Cleric levels do wonder with those buffs.

Soontir Fel · Post by **Soontir Fel** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 3:53 pm

I dont think longsword is a cleaving weapon. Improved power attack may help with damage and let you cleave, but I think connecting more hits is a better way of getting more criticals, with dual wielding two longswords. You can continue with fighter and take Two Weapon Fighting feats, but you need some Dex for it.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 4:17 pm

Or Ranger levels, that way you don't need the DEX, and you get more skills, and you get spells, but you're restricted to light armour. (Or Mithral Medium.)

Claudius · Post by **Claudius** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 6:24 pm

Are you playing the SoZ campaign? Or MoTB?

For SoZ I would go to Fighter 8 and take Greater Weapon Focus Longsword. Then I would take a level of Swashbuckler believe it or not on a non-fighter feat level and take able learner if you haven't already. Swash is a full BAB class that will unlock the tumble skill. By level 17 if you pump it you can max tumble to 20 which is good for 2 AC. Only 1 Swash level.

Then take the rest fighter and pick up at least power attack and cleave, but great cleave is only worth it if you eventually get supreme cleave. At fighter 12 you can take Greater Weapon Specialization.

BilaTheBloody · Post by **BilaTheBloody** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:26 pm

I am starting from the OC and working my way through the entire game for reasons I can't quite remember now - possibly enjoyment...

I have neglected wisdom but have points in charisma so am now thinking about getting enough levels in Favoured Soul to become a Warpriest - unless there is a reason I shouldn't?

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 2:30 pm

Favoured Soul is just as good, but instead of Warpriest, go for the Kelemvorpriest Prestige Class. I forgot the name. It gives full BAB & full casting progression. Of course, how much use the higher level spells are to you, is determined by your base Charisma. (I.e.: It's no use to become a caster level 15 Favoured Soul if you don't have 17 CHA for 7th level spells.)

Claudius · Post by **Claudius** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 5:21 pm

Doomguide.

Theres an error in the manual. It is not high BAB. But it is full casting. It is also poor choice for a favored soul because the point is to have turn undead amped up. Paladin or Cleric.

You shouldn't be a favored soul at this point because your dieties weapon will duplicate your weapon focus longsword..well you still could do it but its kind of a waste.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 5:24 pm

What?? Not full BAB? But it should be. It is that way in PnP.
Forgot about the turning part.

darthelema0101 · Post by **darthelema0101** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 4:39 am

GawainBS wrote:What?? Not full BAB? But it should be. It is that way in PnP.
Forgot about the turning part.

Unfortunately, the creators of the game did not get their research right on a number of points in the game. Care to take it up with them?

Keen and improved critical are supposed to work together for a maximum of tripling the critical threat range instead of only one working to double that range and no improvement possible with a combination of the two.
Encounter Level calculations and XP grants are screwy.
Rapier is supposed to be considered light when dual-wielded although its actual size would preclude its use as such by height challenged characters.

Claudius · Post by **Claudius** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 4:48 am

Just curious...so the doomguide gets full BAB, casting, and turning plus some other bonuses...this is in PnP, I know its not implented in the video game (not the full BAB).

Is the PnP version of Warpriest the same as the video game? Warpriest seems horrible class. 1/2 casting, Full BAB, no turn, requires 4th level spells. Some pretty 1x per day powers. tons of remove fear effects. War glory.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 6:04 am

@darthelema0101

Your points 1 & 3 are not true.
1. Keen & Improved Critical do explicitly not stack. See [url="http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/spellsHtoL.html#keen-edge"]here.[/url]
3. Rapier isn't considered light, never. It can be used in conjunction with Weapon Finesse, though, AND, as opposed in NWN2, can be used with Power Attack. The issue with small characters and weapons is a thing from D&D 3.0. Even then, there wasn't such a thing about a special rule with Rapiers & dualwielding.
In 3.5, every weapon simply scale with your size.

@Claudius
Warpriest is indeed a terrible class in PnP. It's so weak you have no mechanical reason to take it.
The BAB issue with Doomguide will probably make me switch my Paladin 4/ FavouredSoul 16/ Domguide 10 idea to Warpriest 10, though... Thanks for pointing this out!

BilaTheBloody · Post by **BilaTheBloody** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:48 pm

Am not going to take up either Warpriest or Doomguide now - want to keep my character completely melee.

What are good melee prestige classes - am still thinking of two levels of FB but also all five levels of NW9 if it is any good.

Are Blackguards any good too - what happens if you become neutral or good?

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:06 pm

Well, that's the catch with D&D: casters are better at melee than meleewarriors. This is less so in NWN2, but still.

If you want to stay melee, FB5 is very, very good, since you do more damage, especially if you use your weapon in two hands. Just equip a single longsword.

Blackguards loose their special abilities if they ever become neutral or good.

Divine Champion is a solid option.

If you take a single level of bard (or sorcerer), Dragon Discipline is very much worth it.

Claudius · Post by **Claudius** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 1:38 pm

I would go for 1 level of bard assuming you have favored class any, bard, or fighter...

Take able learner ASAP and start getting tumble to 20 hard points. Then take 4 levels of RDD which will give you natural armor and +4 STR. That STR is going to multiply on crits and it will also hurt crit resistant enemies like undead.
If you have extra skillpoints I would put them in UMD if you are going to MoTB..with enough in UMD you can pull some nice tricks including dodge boots, wands, scrolls, non-class or alignment items..

Then at the end take two more levels of fighter and grab Greater Weapon Focus.

If you play MoTB take 4 more levels of Fighter for Fighter 12 including Epic Weapon Focus, Epic Precision, Epic/Greater Weapon Specialization...and take 6 RDD levels to go for the full RDD!

EDIT: PS you will need 8 Lore to take RDD..start getting it on the bard and possibly the fighter levels. I would try and take Perform 3 at the Bard level because that skill will not be available except at bard levelups. If you have 8 CHA I am not sure if the Perform score is modified or unmodified but save before level up and make sure you can activate Inspiration of Courage (needs 3 perform).

@Gawain

With Divine Power in the campaigns there is no reason to take Warpriest. The only reason I can think of is you know divine power will be stripped by mordenkainen's disjunction and you want 26 BAB for 6 attacks...Or as in your build get to 21 casters levels without lowering BAB to 25 so you become impossible to greater dispel. I really don't play PVP so thats just my guesses by the way

Or if you are playing a campaign like SOZ and you know that you will have to fight a lot of trash monsters without buffs being called for.

I'm thinking of making a cleric or FS (probably cleric to take grey orc) RDD build through SoZ next. For my evil party. The RDD will add more damage per hit and all the AB penalties get lifted at the touch of a Divine Power. When not buffed you still at least damage/hit. In 20 levels if I start with 17 STR (easy for a grey orc) I can attain 30 STR by level 20. With Divine Power 36 STR and full BAB! Bard 1Cleric8Fighter1(towershield)RDD10 Strength domain and either War or Darkness in character for orc race.

BilaTheBloody · Post by **BilaTheBloody** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 3:14 pm

I am going to take the character all the way to SoZ and your idea sounds brilliant!

Am going to get a bard level then get RDD for 4 levels, get an additional two levels of fighter and then finish off the RDD.

Thanks for that!