out of curiostiy...whats so great bout the DS?

[Fierce]

[QUOTE=GRAUS]Now when i think about it same stuff happens in other games as well: Baldurs gate 2, sure, kill and steal and pillage and you will gain more money but you wont be able to buy almost any stuff because all the merchants will take overprice because of your reputation. It seems like the developers have an little plan of their own: Telling you that 'The Dark Side' wont lead to anything good.[/QUOTE]

Isn't it true what they are trying to tell you? Because it depends on how you understand word "good" - good for you, or good for evrybody. You see, killing and robbing evrybody you meet may be good for you, but others won't be very happy about it.

[QUOTE=Graus]There are two kinds of Jedi/Sith:

*Sith are weak because they fail to follow the teachings of the order.
*Jedi are weak because they can't accept their gift and use it fully.[/QUOTE]

Well, I think it is the problem with responsibility. They sacrifice their need for using their full powers for the cause of others, as those without it would surely be jealous of it, and it would lead to constant fights. Even though they limit their potential, they are seen as an threat, they are distrusted and considered freaks. Of course, they could enslave those, who they were troubling them, but in that case they couldn't be considered Jedi no more.

[QUOtE=Graus]*Sith are weak because they have civilwars the whole time.
*Jedi are weak because the allow the weak to rule them, they don't allow the 'strong' to be their leader.[/QUOTE]

Yes....the whole strenght stuff. Let's see....how do you understand the word "strong leader"? Someone strong physicaly, with huge command over Force? Master swordsman? Someone who doesn't care for people he is ruling as long they obey him? Or, maybe someone who can't fight like Prince of Persia, is weaker with the Force, is undecisive, because he tries to make decisions best for his people? True strong leaders, experienced, wise, strong-willed don't happen too often, and even more rare they come to rule. I understand you mean strong leaders like Sith\Dark Jedi do, because it is them who always use this argument. But they got a little problem with their leaders, as it's often that the leader becomes the one which backstabs best, the one's that shouldn't be ever let to rule.

[QUOTE=Graus]I don't like to play DS because it's 'different' from how i would act in real life. I like to play DS because it's how i would like to act in real life, does that make me a sadist?[/QUOTE]

Well....yes....if you want to harm other's, but you don't do it just because you are affraid of consequnces, then you are...(I'm not saying that you are, because I know you, but I just respond to the argument you gave)

[QUOTE=Gaus]Properly, but you woulden't have to worry about me in real life, not because my conscience would tell me it's wrong, but instead because the punishment that would be laid uppon me if i would break the law. In video games such as Kotor your allowed to do anything without any real consequence and thats why it's appealing for me to play DS.[/QUOTE]

Again, I disagree. What if you would kill or rob me or someone I know? I would certainly had to worry about you.

[QUOTE=Graus]The fighting style, i would describe the fighting style of the jedi as the 'Samurais', discipline, swift-perfect-movements, control. A person who has control under the whole fight and doesn't allow he's emotion to get into the way, he may get cut in the face but he will remain calm. The Sith on the other side would be more like a berserking warrior, rage, heavy-strikes-with-less-aim. A person who fueles the whole fight with emotions and rage, when this person gets cut in the face he will 'roar' (how dramatic!) in rage and try to crush he's enemys skull.[/QUOTE]

Well, you got the point. Both styles got their disadvantages, for example - when you depend on you instincts and emotions, it's easier to make a mistake, one swift too much that will cost you your head. On the other hand, Jedi can be overthtrown with lots of strikes.

[QUOTE=Graus]PS: This are mostly random thoughts being drawn up by the 'philosophical debate' (everything is philosophical because everything conserns life).

PS2: My post may be alot of random thought but atleast do i hope 'you' know understand; 'Whats so great about the Dark Side'.[/QUOTE]

I DO understand why it SEEMS great to you. And don't think I'm judging you now. It's just an theoretical debate.

[mr_sir]

after finally completing kotor2 as ls (i usually get bored early on as ls lol cos i never like my character i created) i actually think ls is the more fun and has a better story line in kotor2. in kotor 1 i prefer ds though. i really enjoyed playing as a ls consular/master, more than consular/sith lord, as its a more rounded game - with ds sith lord you barely even need a lightsaber for example. i hated trying a ls guardian kind of character though but thats prob more to do with the fact that in rpgs i tend to go for the more magic type characters out of personal preference.

[capojobe]

DS Powers and Lightside action

You dont have to be darkside to get force lightning or storm. I hate the dark side because it's just...mean and too easy and ignorant. I mean it's awsome to look at it from the bad ass point of view but i think the jedi is meant to do good even if it's alot of talk and conversation before action. Yoda and Obiwan talk alot but in the end they are the ones that could kick anyone's ass. In all truth i believe the Jedi have a policy about passion and love and anger just like the military, dont ask dont tell, Obiwan used his anger to kill Maul in episode 1 and without that he would never have sliced him in two so fast and with so much force. Using both dark and light let you expand on the force more, lets you diminish the bounds, on the game's points though, you can be light side and still use the darkside's horror and tuning characters on each other. In my game i use what i love, persuasion, but still im light. I have strenght and wisdom and all that, but constitution for implants and persuasion are high always. So all in all, you can use powers for any side, i dont like being too good or too evil, i collect some bounties and others i pay some off. P.S. worst part of KOTOR II is the lightsaber creation. I think if they just gave him/her a light saber from the begining or finding it even later on or somewhere, it would be awsome, or even if making it was easier, but i can't belive how much of a pain it was. I just can't wait for KOTOR 3, it's going to be amazing. I want a revan like or even revan as a character. A comeback of Revan, if you were light would be....gosh...wow. If you were dark, ...wow. I dont know i just know that they need this game more than Clerks 2.

[FighterTundra]

I don't like LS because the jedi council is too holding back in wars, i think that if revan didn't help the republic in the mandalorian wars, the mandalorians would have ruled the entire galaxy, and later they would easily overthrow the jedi with their numbers.

I dont like DS because i hate being cruel to everyone and all the betrayals in the DS of the force.

So i like neutral the most, but neutral has a disadvantage; it is damned hard to grow stronger. for example you can't get a prestige class in gameplay, and in the story, there is no-one to train you or something. so i think in kotOR III there must be some kind of neutral group/council that acts they think is the best for them and and others. no betrayals, in wars immediatly help the side they think is acting the best (somekind of mercenaries, but they don't fight and help for credits, but for balance in the force and the galaxy). I think that no-one should rule the galaxy, because that takes alot of problems with it.

[Fierce]

I'm sorry, but this kind of thinking is pretty naive. First, no one in charge - evrybody's in charge. In other word's - anarchy. Second, if you are neutral - you don't side with anyone, so no one really knows if to trust you or not. In that case, guess who dark siders will attack first to ensure no one will try to stop them? Of course, if you'll get lucky they'll try to pull you on their side first and attack you if you'd refuse. Third, calling those who don't agree with either side in case of Force trained people is a bit unsuited. Jolee Bindo for example - he was a Light Sider, a Jedi, and just the fact he didn't agreed with the Jedi Council doesn't change who he really was. I don't know about Kreia, but I think she was just selfish, trying to sacrifice evryone and evrything to accomplish her goals. It takes A LOT of expercience to understand what consequnces will bring your choices, so I guess neutral would be reserved for one's like Kreia and Bindo.

I get tired of people saying "neutral way is so cool". All lies. People who consider themselves neutral people may have an illusion of them being alright to themselves, but I think you *need* to specify yourself. "I don't like to be too good". Why? I can understand if you don't wan't to be too bad, but too good? Especially in a game....you have NO real responsibilities in artificial world of KotOR, so what keep's you from choosing a side?

[mr_sir]

its pretty easy to be in the neutral kind of area as far as alignment goes in kotor games (you just do a mix of ds and ls depending on what you feel like doing) but this is not the same thing as really being neutral. if you were really neutral, you would not fight the sith or the jedi. you would just stay in the middle and let them get on with it while you do your own thing. so its actually impossible to be neutral in these games as you have to choose a side eventually, even if your alignment doesn't show that you have

[darth humac]

i find nothing of the dark side alluring. I tried it once and it left me feeling guilty, and this is just a video game.

[eskilla]

Well, I play DS and while I don't kill every mother and her child *unsubtly points people to her thread on the R in RPG* I most certainly play darkside. Not all DS-ness is about killing the innocent. When faced with either morality or credits, I go unabashedly towards the latter. I like power, and seek it out.

Personally, I see DS in star wars games as being the alternative to a self-repressing, self-depriving closet emo.

Sometimes I do play light in other games (not fable though!!). Heck, I freakin' cried when Prince Arthas goes EVIL AS SIN and kills his best friends in Warcraft 3.

[RBitG]

Your a man (?) after my own heart. I would do most things for power, but that harldy includes slaughtering people on the streets.

Let's leave things about Arthas to the [url="http://www.gamebanshee.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=68"]Warcraft[/url] forum. It could use the activity, and I believe there might be a thread on Arthas there already. - Hill-Shatar[/color]

[Darth Nero]

when i go dark side i try to have more of an influence strategy. i want to have the most power at the end of the game. killing everybody only makes your good party members turn against you when you can always have them seeing your side of things instead. i will switch back and forth every so often. i probably do like either being darkside or grey though. the light side is always a bunch of petty find this person and save me from my own problems sort of thing. i like to keep the gamer rolling.

[Fre$h]

Daaaaark Siiiiiiiiiiide!!!!!

To be honest, I always play it ds all the way. It's the only way to go, in my opinion. Why the hell would I want to waste time running around kissing the asses of a bunch of whiney a.i. characters?? Seems like a perfectly good time to kill, & reap any benefits available. I've played ls a few times through each game, & I prefer ds. I go as dark as possible, when the black smoke, & flames surround you, that's when I feel the most comfortable. Plus, you kick ass at 10 times the rate you can when you're a "holy roller." I don't dig being friendly for no reason. All I really wanted at the last stage of Rakata Prime on KOTOR1, was to kill Carth! God, I hate Carth!!! Why wouldn't they let you fight him?! All you get, is to see his lame ass run off into the dunes. At least they let you kill Juhani, Jolee, & Mission though. That was pretty cool, 'cause those characters are crazy annoying. The darkside has the most pull, for me. You can go fully darkside without alienating your entire crew, as well. Of course, some of them like to play "holier than thou," but they'll either get over it, or toe the line. No room for discussion on mine. Word up.

[DesR85]

Frankly, nothing much

To me, in my opinion, there's nothing much to gain out of being dark side and as others on this forum have said before, you won't learn much of the story by playing from the viewpoint of a dark sider whereas playing the path of a light sider, you'll be able to learn more of the game's background and be able to enjoy it more.

Furthermore, it feels more gratifying playing as a good person rather than an evil one, though Force Powers on the light side are more to buffing powers whereas the dark side are geared to combat type powers. Btw, I played KOTOR only once as LS male and I don't feel like playing it over again due to the time it takes to complete the game. Same goes to KOTOR 2.

[Darth Jadis]

Um if you play DarkSide correctly You can learn anything you need to about the game. Yes yes its always more gratifying helping people that want you to do charity for them right? Especially when they are A.I. Characters. In my opinion some of the people deserved to die. Of course as we all know the ds powers or more directly powerful, but thats not to say ls powers are not powerful either.

With that said I agree with eskilla in the sense that I dont make the game become a bloodbath... But I do seek Higher power.

And yeah in KOTOR II a Dark Guardian/Consular will PWNZ Your behind... Thats pretty damn gratifying.

Basically Im grey... But Id pick ds hands down to ls because of the benefit plan it offers

[lonewolf13]

I'm not much for playing ds. I find pointless slaugter to be, well, pointless. The game basically forces you to pick one extreme or the other. I find that trying to be "grey" only makes the game harder than neccesary.
Therefore, being ds means basically being another Palpatine.
I personally don't like even pretending to be that evil.
While I think some of the ls/ds decisions are too black and white, I'll stick to the ls.

[Damuna_Nova]

I *LOVE* playing it darkside, it's so amazingly wonderful.*Sigh*

Heh...I always play eil in games, but when it comes to MMORPGs I'm nice, I guess I just want to let off some steam against innocent NPCs.

[RBitG]

[QUOTE=lonewolf13] I find that trying to be "grey" only makes the game harder than neccesary.
Therefore, being ds means basically being another Palpatine.
[/QUOTE]

I have to disagree on this. I found that to maintain a neutral alignment, i only have to do waht i wanted, i didn't have to calculate out alignment points, because everybody wants to kill the horribly annoying, whiney NPC's every once-in-a-while.

[quote="Lonewolf]The game basically forces you to pick one extreme or the other.[/quote]

That is quite true"]want[/i].

[quote="lonewolf]I'm not much for playing ds. I find pointless slaugter to be"]

As to the "Pointless Slaughter" this is certainly not what playing DS is all about, it is about doing whatever you can to achieve higher power. For example: Often you will gain some experience points/rewards, for helping an NPC out, instead of just throwing it all to the wind, and killing him.

[lonewolf13]

[QUOTE=RBitG]I have to disagree on this. I found that to maintain a neutral alignment, i only have to do waht i wanted, i didn't have to calculate out alignment points, because everybody wants to kill the horribly annoying, whiney NPC's every once-in-a-while.[/QUOTE]
That's not what I meant. Staying neutral isn't the hard part. I was referring to how being neutral applies a handicap to your character. For example, a Jedi with light mastery and ls powers will be all but unstoppable by the time you get to the last few levels. The same is true of a Sith with dark mastery and ds powers.
And not killing whiney annoying characters in video games is good practice for dealing with all the whiney annoying people in real life.

[lonewolf13]

[QUOTE=RBitG]I have to disagree on this. I found that to maintain a neutral alignment, i only have to do waht i wanted, i didn't have to calculate out alignment points, because everybody wants to kill the horribly annoying, whiney NPC's every once-in-a-while.[/QUOTE]
That's not what I meant. Staying neutral isn't the hard part. I was referring to how being neutral applies a handicap to your character. For example, a Jedi with light mastery and ls powers will be all but unstoppable by the time you get to the last few levels. The same is true of a Sith with dark mastery and ds powers.
And not killing whiney annoying characters in video games is good practice for dealing with all the whiney annoying people in real life.

[RBitG]

[QUOTE=lonewolf13]That's not what I meant. Staying neutral isn't the hard part. I was referring to how being neutral applies a handicap to your character. For example, a Jedi with light mastery and ls powers will be all but unstoppable by the time you get to the last few levels. The same is true of a Sith with dark mastery and ds powers.
And not killing whiney annoying characters in video games is good practice for dealing with all the whiney annoying people in real life.[/QUOTE]

Yes, you're quit right, that is most unfortunate. At the end of the game, playing LSM or DSM, you have enough force points to be able to use opp. alignment powers anyway, so there really *is* no use in trying to remain neutral. If, perhaps, the more you leaned to one side, the fewer powers you could use of the opp. alignment and the more of yours, the alignment system would be much cooler, and significantly more consequential. For example, a DSM character can use all of the DS force powers, but only three of the light-side powers, whereas a Neutral character might be able to use most of them from each side. This would greatly improve gameplay in K3!

[lonewolf13]

Sorry about the double post. I was having connection problems last night.