I found myself a Burizor the other night and I was thinking about how I could go about using it. I did consider creating a Bowazon but I must admit I've had many failed builds and they didn't seem that interesting at the end of the day.
So looking for something different I thought I'd try making a Necromancer based around the Burizor and I realised there's potentially lots to work with.
I was thinking I'd go with (almost) 1 point in all the curses, 1 in clay golem, golem mastery and summon resistances, 1 in bone armour and 10-20 in bonewall.
Now I'm at loss at what I should try out the rest of my points in, I've been considering:
*Summonmancer for tanking and possible additional damage ~ let down by skeleton strength and lack of viability in "/players 8" scenarios.
*Poisonmancer for bring down mobs low enough to finish with a bow ~ let down by poison immunity and poison time durations.
*Corpse Explosion dominos ~ let down by explosion range and the fact the necromancer has to whittle monsters down to begin the chain reaction.
Now I realise this will probably be a dead end build, but I'm willing to take a break for something a little different.
Any thoughts, suggestions or opinions?
Building Bow Necromancer
-
Deadalready
- Posts: 903
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 4:37 am
- Contact:
Building Bow Necromancer
Warning: logic and sense is replaced by typos and errors after 11pm
Spoiler
, it has yet to return
-
AvatarOfLight
- Posts: 584
- Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2007 9:44 am
- Location: The Netherlands
- Contact:
Most of all, I don't really see the point making a bow necromancer. It would require a lot of dexterity, a stat a necromancer needs extremely little of. afaik the only really viable class for bows would be the amazon.
If you persist though, just for the heck of it, you should definitely put most of your points into either one of the golems types or the undead summons. This way, the monsters will be tanked and you are free to fire away at will. Once more, seriously though. I see little point
If you persist though, just for the heck of it, you should definitely put most of your points into either one of the golems types or the undead summons. This way, the monsters will be tanked and you are free to fire away at will. Once more, seriously though. I see little point
Sage plays a paladin,
because other classes would be frowned upon for laying their hands on a wounded companion
because other classes would be frowned upon for laying their hands on a wounded companion
@Deadalready: The Bowmancer is a difficult built to play, but many people think its a fun build. The so called "cookie-cutter" builds (ie the typical builds that everybody use) are cookie-cutter builds for a reason - they are easy to play and therefore popular - but a more experienced and skilled player can play almost any build.
I am not a necro player myself, but I would think you need Amp damage, Dim vision and minions to play Bowmancer. Most people seem to use Corpse explosion as well. You use your poison skills for damage, and it is also helpful to load up with poison charms. Some people also use Bone wall or Bone prison to keep the monsters in place.
However, a Buriza is not the optimal crossbow for a Bowmancer, it would probably be better to use a Demon Machine and make use of the exploding arrows. You also need Crushing blow and perhaps Open woulds. Should you decide against the Bowmancer build, use the Buriza for a Frostmaiden instead!
Good luck!
I am not a necro player myself, but I would think you need Amp damage, Dim vision and minions to play Bowmancer. Most people seem to use Corpse explosion as well. You use your poison skills for damage, and it is also helpful to load up with poison charms. Some people also use Bone wall or Bone prison to keep the monsters in place.
However, a Buriza is not the optimal crossbow for a Bowmancer, it would probably be better to use a Demon Machine and make use of the exploding arrows. You also need Crushing blow and perhaps Open woulds. Should you decide against the Bowmancer build, use the Buriza for a Frostmaiden instead!
Good luck!
"There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the latter ignorance." - Hippocrates
Moderator of Planescape: Torment, Diablo I & II and Dungeon Siege forums
-
Deadalready
- Posts: 903
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 4:37 am
- Contact:
I've been researching and have come across some very interesting builds similar. Now the Bowmancer seems to suffer from attack rating problems, which sounds quite problematic.
Similar though fun sounding bow builds:
- Sorceress
Using enchant and synergies, most using frozen orb as a backup skill. I'd probably go with blizzard due to damage though. Unsure as to killing power, possibly more power than a bowasin.
- Paladin
Using holy shock and synergies, most of the points are left over with nothing to add to. Possibly the highest damage of all the variant bow builds (I dare say more powerful than a frostmaiden too). Problems with physical+lightning immunes.
- Assassin
Using Venom and Shadow master. Pretty good sounding build with Burst of Speed making breakpoints much easier to achieve. Also has the advantage of summons to distract, I've also yet to see a poison and physical immune too. Possibly a problem damage wise though.
All of these builds so far rely greatly on elemental damage so leaching is a problem.
Anyone care to comment on these? I'm now leaning towards a Bowasin or a Enchantbow. Looking at the damage tables though I'm thinking I might not get very far. +504-649 fire damage for 60 point investment as a Sorc while the Assassin only deals +505-525 with 20 points into venom.
Similar though fun sounding bow builds:
- Sorceress
Using enchant and synergies, most using frozen orb as a backup skill. I'd probably go with blizzard due to damage though. Unsure as to killing power, possibly more power than a bowasin.
- Paladin
Using holy shock and synergies, most of the points are left over with nothing to add to. Possibly the highest damage of all the variant bow builds (I dare say more powerful than a frostmaiden too). Problems with physical+lightning immunes.
- Assassin
Using Venom and Shadow master. Pretty good sounding build with Burst of Speed making breakpoints much easier to achieve. Also has the advantage of summons to distract, I've also yet to see a poison and physical immune too. Possibly a problem damage wise though.
All of these builds so far rely greatly on elemental damage so leaching is a problem.
Anyone care to comment on these? I'm now leaning towards a Bowasin or a Enchantbow. Looking at the damage tables though I'm thinking I might not get very far. +504-649 fire damage for 60 point investment as a Sorc while the Assassin only deals +505-525 with 20 points into venom.
Warning: logic and sense is replaced by typos and errors after 11pm
Spoiler
, it has yet to return
I have played numerous ranged enchantresses, And it's definitely a viable build. Especially so with Frozen Orb. I would choose frozen orb over blizzard because with the low spell damage you will be doing it will hurt a lot that blizzard is unpredictable.
I do recommend the daemon machine for any ranged enchantress though. That crossbow is amazing, and quite easy to find as well.
Last recommendation is to use teleport a lot. And get a good Merc that benefits from your enchant.
I have not played any of the other builds you suggest, But I'm somewhat interested in the assassin, so should you choose that one I would be happy to hear about your results.
I do recommend the daemon machine for any ranged enchantress though. That crossbow is amazing, and quite easy to find as well.
Last recommendation is to use teleport a lot. And get a good Merc that benefits from your enchant.
I have not played any of the other builds you suggest, But I'm somewhat interested in the assassin, so should you choose that one I would be happy to hear about your results.
While others climb the mountains High, beneath the tree I love to lie
And watch the snails go whizzing by, It's foolish but it's fun
And watch the snails go whizzing by, It's foolish but it's fun
Have you ever heard of the faith bow? It gives off an aura that increase the damage, and chance to hit of your skeletons. It also increases attack speed, which is more useful for your revives with crushing blow.AvatarOfLight wrote:Most of all, I don't really see the point making a bow necromancer.
I was under the assumption that the majority of necromancers invested into dex for max block. The small bonus to life you would get from putting those stat points into vitality is insignificant to having 75% chance to block.AvatarOfLight wrote:It would require a lot of dexterity, a stat a necromancer needs extremely little of.
It depends, plenty of classes like the barb use bows for pvp and it works well for them. For pvm, amazons make the best use of the bow. Sorceresses do really well with the Demon Machine also in pvm. I imagine the right necro build could make use of the Demon machine. Dim Vision would equal pwnage.AvatarOfLight wrote:afaik the only really viable class for bows would be the amazon.
You shouldn't put any points into any of the golem types. It's not at all worth it, and no experienced player can make use of golems on hell mode for anything other than tanking. Only put points into Golem mastery for life.AvatarOfLight wrote:you should definitely put most of your points into either one of the golems types or the undead summons. This way, the monsters will be tanked and you are free to fire away at will. Once more, seriously though. I see little point
I would vote for the enchantbow if you use the Demon Machine. If you use the Buriza, I would suggest the Bowasin. You might want to think about dealing damage with traps and slowing enemies with the Buriza.
Always remember you're unique ... just like everyone else.
-
Deadalready
- Posts: 903
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 4:37 am
- Contact:
After mulling over it for a while I think I'll try making a Bowasin:
20 Venom
20 Shadowmaster
20 Death Sentry
20 Lightning sentry
5 Burst of Speed (left over points here)
Besides prerequisites this character completes at 83.
As far as equipment goes I'll probably use things I have on my mules:
Lavagout
Stealskull
Crafted Bloodbelt
Buriza socketed with Nef
Witchwild socketed with Nef
Resistance + leach rings and amulet
Skin of the Viper (or if I can find a Lem Treachery)
Well here goes nothing...
20 Venom
20 Shadowmaster
20 Death Sentry
20 Lightning sentry
5 Burst of Speed (left over points here)
Besides prerequisites this character completes at 83.
As far as equipment goes I'll probably use things I have on my mules:
Lavagout
Stealskull
Crafted Bloodbelt
Buriza socketed with Nef
Witchwild socketed with Nef
Resistance + leach rings and amulet
Skin of the Viper (or if I can find a Lem Treachery)
Well here goes nothing...
Warning: logic and sense is replaced by typos and errors after 11pm
Spoiler
, it has yet to return
-
Deadalready
- Posts: 903
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 4:37 am
- Contact:
I'm not sure whether to create a new reply or edit my previous reply - mods please modify as you see fit.
~
I'm started and leveled my Bowasin to level 51 and I've come to a few realisations.
*This class is extremely gear dependent. Most imporant is the build's dependancy on the bow used, piercing attack not a luxury but a necessity. My first bow with piercing was the Kuko Shaku and the wait till level 33 was agonising to say the least; waiting till level 30 for Death Sentry and Shadowmaster is pretty bad too. Once I got to level 33 I felt like I was able to eat the world alive, upgrading at level 41 to buriza certainly makes the skys blue.
Cleglaws Pincers are excellent choice for gloves, there are better but knockback and slow are hard to beat. At current though I'm wearing Firegout for it's enchant abilities, which seem to add about 100 or so damage. Also I'm equiping Guilime's Face for crushing blow and deadly strike. I'm considering my options and haven't really decided on items, more or less using items I have on mules. I'm looking at Tran Oul's Claws for it's poison damage but what lies ahead is still hard to see.
*The attack and run speed of the bowasin are without a doubt fun and tactically important. At current I have about (47+40+5) +92% run speed which makes repositioning much better. I do believe the breakpoint for Buriza is a level 5 Burst of Speed which doesn't seem that fast but allows me to pin uniques to walls.
*Poison has a short duration and is difficult to know when active, it certainly does well in bow form and especially noticable when piercing. Poison doesn't do as much damage as I hoped but the difference between poisoned attacks and unenchanted is just enough to remind of it's short duration. Speaking of damage I think I'm doing 1500 to 2300(?) at level 51, I'm maxed poison at this point so I'll probably notice problems in late nightmare and hell. Right now I'm killing most things in three shots with players 8 active, but again being normal it's no real indication of killing power.
*Death Sentry is pretty important for it's corpse explosion, otherwise the bowasin has little in the way of mass damage. The lightning damage from the traps is negliable because I've chosen to max Venom first, Shadow Master second and Death Sentry almost last ~ It's probably more important to max death sentry much earlier than I did so it's lightning damage is more useful. At this point it does mean my build is doing Poison (Venom), Cold (Buriza), Fire (Lavagout), Physical and lightning (Traps)!
Overall though I must say the first 32 levels were quite aweful to endure, I'm in the clear for now though ~ I've yet to start nightmare but do realise it's nightmare and hell which decide whether a build is vaiable or not. I'd say the build is moderately fun, running around at high speed is nice but it all seems rather... samey ~ not much different to any other bowazon or archer class.
If anyone else is trying this build please share what you've learnt.
I might try uploading a video to youtube to show a little bit of gameplay or a Baal run.
~
I'm started and leveled my Bowasin to level 51 and I've come to a few realisations.
*This class is extremely gear dependent. Most imporant is the build's dependancy on the bow used, piercing attack not a luxury but a necessity. My first bow with piercing was the Kuko Shaku and the wait till level 33 was agonising to say the least; waiting till level 30 for Death Sentry and Shadowmaster is pretty bad too. Once I got to level 33 I felt like I was able to eat the world alive, upgrading at level 41 to buriza certainly makes the skys blue.
Cleglaws Pincers are excellent choice for gloves, there are better but knockback and slow are hard to beat. At current though I'm wearing Firegout for it's enchant abilities, which seem to add about 100 or so damage. Also I'm equiping Guilime's Face for crushing blow and deadly strike. I'm considering my options and haven't really decided on items, more or less using items I have on mules. I'm looking at Tran Oul's Claws for it's poison damage but what lies ahead is still hard to see.
*The attack and run speed of the bowasin are without a doubt fun and tactically important. At current I have about (47+40+5) +92% run speed which makes repositioning much better. I do believe the breakpoint for Buriza is a level 5 Burst of Speed which doesn't seem that fast but allows me to pin uniques to walls.
*Poison has a short duration and is difficult to know when active, it certainly does well in bow form and especially noticable when piercing. Poison doesn't do as much damage as I hoped but the difference between poisoned attacks and unenchanted is just enough to remind of it's short duration. Speaking of damage I think I'm doing 1500 to 2300(?) at level 51, I'm maxed poison at this point so I'll probably notice problems in late nightmare and hell. Right now I'm killing most things in three shots with players 8 active, but again being normal it's no real indication of killing power.
*Death Sentry is pretty important for it's corpse explosion, otherwise the bowasin has little in the way of mass damage. The lightning damage from the traps is negliable because I've chosen to max Venom first, Shadow Master second and Death Sentry almost last ~ It's probably more important to max death sentry much earlier than I did so it's lightning damage is more useful. At this point it does mean my build is doing Poison (Venom), Cold (Buriza), Fire (Lavagout), Physical and lightning (Traps)!
Overall though I must say the first 32 levels were quite aweful to endure, I'm in the clear for now though ~ I've yet to start nightmare but do realise it's nightmare and hell which decide whether a build is vaiable or not. I'd say the build is moderately fun, running around at high speed is nice but it all seems rather... samey ~ not much different to any other bowazon or archer class.
If anyone else is trying this build please share what you've learnt.
I might try uploading a video to youtube to show a little bit of gameplay or a Baal run.
Warning: logic and sense is replaced by typos and errors after 11pm
Spoiler
, it has yet to return
My Bow Assassin finished normal at level 32.
I've just played /players1 through out, untwinked.
I started off not using the plugY stash, but gave up sometime in act 3. I needed more space for my runes and gems.
My equipment isn't hot. Numerous Countess runs finally netted me the runes to make an "edge" bow. The level 14 thorns aura has worked wonders with my shadow warrior, and now my barb hireling.
I'm not going to use Shadow Master. Since I'm playing hardcore, I'd like to now what my monion is going to cast next. 11 points in Shadow Warrior have beefed her up enough to survive most things, and I'm building up Death Sentry to compliment her casting. (prior to level 30, I was using cloak of shadows).
Hopefully this tactic means I don't have to put much into energy, and can boost my dexterity.
I'm a bit concerned about my % chance to hit, it's hovering around 50 - 60% on most normal monsters in act 1 nightmare. (I'm level 36). I've got 118 dex, so will be looking for boosts to AR.
I've just played /players1 through out, untwinked.
I started off not using the plugY stash, but gave up sometime in act 3. I needed more space for my runes and gems.
My equipment isn't hot. Numerous Countess runs finally netted me the runes to make an "edge" bow. The level 14 thorns aura has worked wonders with my shadow warrior, and now my barb hireling.
I'm not going to use Shadow Master. Since I'm playing hardcore, I'd like to now what my monion is going to cast next. 11 points in Shadow Warrior have beefed her up enough to survive most things, and I'm building up Death Sentry to compliment her casting. (prior to level 30, I was using cloak of shadows).
Hopefully this tactic means I don't have to put much into energy, and can boost my dexterity.
I'm a bit concerned about my % chance to hit, it's hovering around 50 - 60% on most normal monsters in act 1 nightmare. (I'm level 36). I've got 118 dex, so will be looking for boosts to AR.