1 - 60 in one Playthrough

[sultanselim]

Is this possible?

I mean after unlocking 50-60, can you start a game and go from 1 to 60 in the same playthrough?

I am guessing it might be possible...

In my 2nd try, I finished the game on hardcore on 52th lvl.

Lvl 52 needs 278,000xp, and I guess I was ~ 300,000 when I finished it.
And I even skipped ~5-6 assignments.

You might think it is impossible, but I guess even if I can't do 60, I can do 58 or 59.

Because the implemented xp gain system is somewhat weird.

There are two things to consider.
Level based XP gain and multiplication in consecutive XP gains.

As you all know, you gain xp according to your lvl. Locks-codex etc all increase by lvl.
Also as the enemy lvls go higher with your lvl, you get more xp on kills.

I couldn't calculate the formulae of lvl dependency, but I guess it might be something like a*lvl+b on locks-codex.

So, even if the xp needed for a level increases by each level, xp gain increases too. But not enough to compensate this.

My guess is, in a playthrough if you get 300k exp starting with a lvl 1 char, and if you play every detail exactly the same in another playthrough with a lvl50 char, you might get 500k.

This is one aspect. But it doesn't help.

The important issue is, multiplied xp in consecutive xp gains.

I don't know if anyone recognized this, or is this because of a weird issue with my game installation, but the XP gain is as such:

If you get experience in short consecutive (following one another) intervals, the XP gets multiplied.

Example:
5 geth, each gives 100 xp.
If you kill them 1 by 1, but take long to kill them, you again get 5x100.
If you kill them all together at the same time (with a grenade etc.), you get 5x100=500.

But, if you reduce their health to a low value, and chain-kill them, you get 100+200+300+400+500 = 1500 xp

Here "chain kill" means, killing another in the next 3 or 4 seconds after killing one.

And this is not limited with kills only.

It includes nearly every exp gain. I mean, if you kill a geth in 3secs after opening a lock, you get 2x xp.

For example lock gives 30, and geth gives 100 xp.
If there are 2 locks, and you open them fastly and kill 2 geths fastly, you get 30 + 60 + 300 + 400.
Which is ~3 times more the actual xp you'd gain.

This works best on colossus etc. high xp mobs.

You are in a mako and there is 1 colossus and 5 geths.
Attack colossus first. Reduce his hp to a low value. Than hit others a few times so they all come near dead status.

Then get out of the mako and chain kill geths, than the colossus.

Now, you'd gain 6 times the normal xp of the colossus. (Not to mention mako-on foot difference).

This way, you get 2000xp on a colossus, which gives 200xp while killed in a mako.

The problem is... I am not sure if this is the game property or an issue with my installation. (Because I messed with the config files).

Can anyone confirm the above?

Just try this. When you enter the game, there are 2 codex side by side.
If you click them with 4+ sec intervals, you get 11 + 11.
But if you click one, and fastly click another, you get 11 + 22.

If I am correct, and this is a game property, than I'll try opening a soldier with singularity on casual difficulty, and try hitting 60 in one playthrough by chain killing - chain xp gaining everywhere.

Let's see...

[sultanselim]

Ok, I tried to confirm this myself, but it seems I was wrong at one point...

If you take the xp in very short intervals, computer combines them together, and writes that number on the screen, but you don't get that xp.

Example: After each kill the screen flashes "50 xp", "100 xp", "150 xp", "200 xp". And when I think I might've gotten 500 xp, I find it to be 200...

But there's still an issue here I think...

Because I am perfectly sure that I explored everywhere and used the checklist to complete all assignments with my first char, and got to 50 at Saren.

I didn't make so much exploration and skipped ~6-7 quests including the Cerberus Chain, but I got to 52 with my second char...

This might be related with the high xp, high lvl enemy...
Because I changed the order I followed and didn't touch any planet before finished Virmire.

That way I lost a few Citadel and Followup quests, but at the end, I was lvl 40+ when I started the planets, so I got higher xp from there.

In reality this should make a difference, but I guess it does.

I guess the xp calculation for quests, kills & locks etc. are different.

So, using the best combination might yield higher xp results.

I mean, if the main quest xp is constant, you should do them first, and do killings later. Or if all quests are lvl dependent, you should leave the highest xp quests to the last... Etc. etc.

Seems a bit complex, but I'll try to solve the xp mechanics...

[Kipi]

You have good points on there, but I have to disagree that the order which you do things affects that much on level you ended. This is because right after I left citadel I did most of the "side quests", I think didn't do only couple and those collecting quests. Then I did Feros etc. then tried to finish rest of the side quests I had. Then Virmire, then back to citadel to end couple of quests that ends in Citadel, then straight to Ilios. When I met Saren, I was level 53, and there was four quests I didn't finish (the second keeper scan, Cerberus chain where you destroy the bases, two collecting quests).

Even though I got up to level 53, I doubt that even though I had done everything I had in my journal I would have ended up to level 60. It's possible that I missed something, and perhaps the difficulty level affects to exp?

[sultanselim]

After a few more review, I am nearly sure that it's not possible to reach 60 by conventional means.

I'd say 54 is possible, and 55-56 is extreme.

And what effects xp gain most is Mako.
Killing everything in Mako and on foot makes ~4lvl differences at the end.

I am still curious about the order of things.
I'd say it should have a difference. But a minor difference.

[Kipi]

Just curious, but how does Mako affect the exp? Haven't noticed any difference there, but on the other hand haven't watched too closely the exp gain with Mako and without Mako.

And I would say that level 60 is possible, you just must find and do all the side quests. For example, I'm still unsure wether other party members have their own sidequests like Garrus has. Okay, Ashley and Lia has romance, as well as Alenko if you play female character, but does they have also their personal sidequest? And what about Wrex and Tali? I'm especially interested wether Tali has such, as the dialogue with her kinda indicates the possibility.

[sultanselim]

Just curious, but how does Mako affect the exp? Haven't noticed any difference there, but on the other hand haven't watched too closely the exp gain with Mako and without Mako.

And I would say that level 60 is possible, you just must find and do all the side quests. For example, I'm still unsure wether other party members have their own sidequests like Garrus has. Okay, Ashley and Lia has romance, as well as Alenko if you play female character, but does they have also their personal sidequest? And what about Wrex and Tali? I'm especially interested wether Tali has such, as the dialogue with her kinda indicates the possibility.

Well, Mako cuts xp down a lot. You get %40 xp with Mako.
Instead of 100, you get 40. Instead of 460, you get 180...

About the side quests etc. Wrex has Armor Quest, Tali has Geth quest, Garrus has Doctor quest. Liara's quest is her confrontation with Benezia in Noveria (also you can count rescuing her & romance). Ashley and Alenko have their quests in Virmire.

I still insist more than 55-56 won't be possible. Because I did any and all possible quests (with checklists), and I explored all the land in all the planets.

[Kipi]

Well, Mako cuts xp down a lot. You get %40 xp with Mako.
Instead of 100, you get 40. Instead of 460, you get 180...

I still insist more than 55-56 won't be possible. Because I did any and all possible quests (with checklists), and I explored all the land in all the planets.

Okay, here are some estimated calculations:
I ended up to level 53 last time. So I'm using this as starting point for calculations

The quests I didn't finish were The Cerberus -questline (the one where you destroy the bases, didn't find the last one as it wasn't in map), quest related to Hercules -system (can't remember what it was, but I think I was supposed to find something that I didn't), Scan the Keeper -quest's second part (rescanning them), Wrex's quest, Tali's quest, two collecting quests (the one with minerals and the other I can't remember) and the final stage of the Fan -quest (didn't meet him for recommendation to spectres). I think that finishing these quests would have resulted about 1-3 levels more, depending on the Wrex's and Tali's quests. Perhaps good estimation would be 2 levels more.

After finishing all the quests I would end up to around level 55, perhaps even to level 56.

Now, if I get only 40% of the exp from kills done with Mako, that would net quite punch of more exp, as I did a lot off killing with Mako. So, If I kill with Mako only when necessary (basically, Geth Colosses and Thresher Maws') I could easily get 2 to3 levels more.

At this point, easily level 57-59 is achieved.

Now, I know I didn't kill everything that would have possible. Several Thresher Maw's was left living, as at first I feared them, and when I wound out how to kill them I didn't bother going back to find all of them. Also, Threshers always guard something. Be it crashed bod, signal, or anything else falling under the "Anomalities" in the game map, discovering them and salvaging those always net you some exp. at least one level this way.

So, after that I would estimate level 58-60 achieved. And I was quite careful in the estimations, more likely going uner the real exp-gain than going over it. And I left away all the boxes, chests and containers you could unlock, which also results a bit exp every time.

So, I would say level 60 is quite possible, you just have to do, find and kill everything you can. So no wonder it's achievement of it's own

[sultanselim]

...

So, I would say level 60 is quite possible, you just have to do, find and kill everything you can. So no wonder it's achievement of it's own

I still say that shouldn't be possible. Explanation follows:

I made a lot of testing and recording.
Here's the XP Mechanics of the game:

(INT = Integer)

Every small Monster=Lock=Decryption=Codex => INT(2,3xChar_Level)
Every medium Monster (Shock Troopers etc)=> INT(2,3xChar_Levelx2,5)
Every Huge Monster (Turrets, Juggernauts etc.) => INT(2,3xChar_Levelx7,5)
Every Small Quest (Assignments etc) => INT(2,3xChar_Levelx10)
Every Medium Quest (Assignments etc) => INT(2,3xChar_Levelx15)
Every Huge Quest (Assignments etc) => INT(2,3xChar_Levelx20)

The Conclusion is:

All types of XP are linear with Character Level.

This means, the chosen path do not effect the game other than ~%1 I guess.

(Which is due to round-ups, which are high in small numbers. i.e. 2,8 -> 2,0 so 40% loss at small numbers, 280,8 becomes 280 at the end, ~%0,5 loss at huge numbers. Which means, making quests at the beginning is more profitable than codex-lock-encryption).

Also, XP needed for next level doesn't increase linearly.

I calculated the required "small monster kill / level", and found out this:
From 1 to 15, it is same. 43,5 kill / level.
From 16 to 50, it increases mostly linearly, and becomes 152 kills for 49 to 50.
(at ~ 1,06 times increase at each level)

After 50, it increases geometrically, and becomes 1473 kills for 59 to 60.

So,
Up to 53, you need to kill 3970 small monsters.
From 53 to 60, you need to kill 4254 small monsters.

Which means, if you achieved 53 on a playthrough you won't be achieving 60 in two playthroughs...

The middle line is 53,5. If you achieved 53,5 on a single playthrough, playing the same way, you can see 60 in the 2nd playthrough.

Anyway, I am currently testing max achievable level by using any and all maps-walkthroughs-checklists etc. Will post the result here soon.

PS: Excuse me for my clumsy explanation skills.

[Kipi]

Just a question: Have you checked how much the difficult level affects to xp? I'm not at the same house with my XBox right now, so can't test it myself, but I think there could be at least some affection. Perhaps enough affection to make the level 60 possible?

Otherwise, very good analyse. I'm eager to wait your results and/or get my own testing running again.

[sultanselim]

Just a question: Have you checked how much the difficult level affects to xp? I'm not at the same house with my XBox right now, so can't test it myself, but I think there could be at least some affection. Perhaps enough affection to make the level 60 possible?

Otherwise, very good analyse. I'm eager to wait your results and/or get my own testing running again.

Difficulty doesn't affect XP. Tested a few times.

I am currently making a test run to achieve the highest level I can.
Playing on insanity with Soldier.

I killed everything on foot. Turrets, colossus, thresher maws etc.
I saved-loaded on quests and checked which way I get the most XP.
Checked Paragon - Renegade choices, and the total XP outcome.
i.e. killing everybody in UNC: Major Kyle gives more XP than convincing him to surrender.
Used monkey/Lorik glitches to get %100 paragon-renegade.
Therefore I also have access to both alignment planets/quests.

I used the planet maps on GBanshee to check every point.

Currently lvl 52.
Still 8 landable planets, Virmire and Ilos remains.

Let's see if I can make it to 57 or not. Although I am very doubtful about it.

Also there's a discrepancy in the XP mechanics of the first 5 levels I guess.
I started recording XP on lvl8, so I am not sure about the first 5 levels.
But I remember first codecs giving 11, not 2 as it should.
Also I remember the first kills in Eden Prime gave 13 at lvl2, not 4 as in the calculation.
Maybe in the first 5 levels you get the same XP regardless of lvl. Though I should check this.

[sultanselim]

Took me 30hrs, but I finished it.

Result:
56.7 (342,500 xp)
*Including the %5 xp bonus from the achievements*

58 assignments completed. (Without BringDownTheSky addon)
Only missed 2 background (spacer, colonist) assignments, which I couldn't complete anyhow.
Every resource, insignia etc. collected.
Missed only 4 codecs.
Killed everything on foot (thresher maws, turrets, colossi etc), checked every corner for locks etc...

I completed most of the quests in all possible ways. Then checked the XP gains, and chose the most XP path.

In most cases, choosing the bloody way gives more XP because of the kills.
UNC:Major Kyle *Biotic Cult*, UNC:Negotiation *Rogue Warlord*, UNC:Hostile Takeover *Helena Blake* etc are examples.

On double roads, traced back and cleared the second road etc.

Conclusion:
If you consider 1 small kill 1 XP unit, leveling 1 to 60 takes ~8222 kills.
I finished at 5085.
Surely I could've missed a few locks, or missed 4 codex.
But I guess only %1-3 higher than this can be accomplished.

Therefore, the whole game includes ~5200 kills of XP.
If someone goes after 60 achievement, then he'll have to complete 4111 kills per playthrough. Which makes, %80 of every possible XP.

Or more basically, he has to achieve lvl 54 in the first playthrough, and play the same way in the 2nd.

With this lvl 56.7 char, I'll need to play such as going 1-48 in a playthrough to achieve 60. Which is still a lot...

[Omnicron]

With this lvl 56.7 char, I'll need to play such as going 1-48 in a playthrough to achieve 60. Which is still a lot...

Just to clarify for people reading this, who like me, didnt know the following: When you finish the game with a character you can start your new game importing that character with all his xp, talent point, items, and money. Hence you start the game on the level you finished it.

Thanks for your discussion guys, it was very insightful

[bushwhacker2k]

Since you can import your old characters from beaten games it's kinda pointless to try to cram in one game but from my experience, No, it isn't possible to reach 60 in one playthrough unless you do some kind of infinite experience glitch.

I have done everything there is to do and not made it to 55.