I found myself bored with the tradition fighter or barbarian or possible ranger tank in 3.5. I've always liked the druid animal companion idea, but wished to have the player's character get stronger for brief spurts while the companion could be present.
towards that aim I've made up 20 levels of progression for the class, and it's nearly done, just need some finishing touches of balance work.
this is an overview I'll gladly post the exact progression but i thought that may be unneeded if i expanded on the features i thought had the most potential to be too strong.
The class uses the rogue BA progression, and has good fort and will saves.
uses a d6 for life, and gets 4+int modifier for skills.
It focuses heavily on charisma for class features. Your minion is only present for a number of rounds equal to your class level + cha modifier. this is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier, and is a spell like ability.
The minion selected comes from the summon monster and summon nature's ally lists, and they pick from those lists based on their alignment.
good characters pick from the summon monsters list, and can only pick monsters of good alignment.
Neutral characters (good/evil axis) can pick from the nature's ally list, but must select animals or elementals, no fey.
Evil characters pick from the evil monsters on the summon monster lists.
They only get to have one active minion, the spell level they get to pick from is based on their current class level in the Soul summoner class. at first level is 1st level, at 3rd level it goes to rank 2, at 5th it increases to rank 3, etc.
level/2 +1 specifically for what rank they have, they lose the previous ranks, and never have the option to summon multiple lower rank monsters with the higher rank spell.
At first level summoning their minion is a full round action, with attacks of opportunity available. as they increase in level they can summon their minion faster, have the summon duration last longer (somewhat exponentially)
and gain a portion of the stat scores of their summon for themselves. the portions at 20th level make the average soul summoner have a chance to hit equal to BA + class bonuses = 20, but only 3 attacks, due to rogue progression. This is a nod towards their minion being also able to land blows.
The average minion at 20th level (9th level summons) grants about a +5-6 to constitution of the character (they get half of the modifier of the monster added to their score, like their summon has +4, they get +2 to their score or modifier increase of +1), which assuming average die rolls puts the soul summoner near a fighter's life, generally lower than a fighters though.
There is the capability for spellcasting for this class in mind but extremely limited. The Minion is counted as being the caster, but uses your charisma score and class level to determine if the spell can be cast and what the dc is. meaning, the minion uses a standard action, not the character.
it has spells in levels 0 to 6
and at 20th level can cast 3 of each.
on the list is;
0
purify food and drink
Detect poison
1
Bless
endure elements
2
Barkskin
shield other
3
Heroism
haste
4
freedom of movement
Dismissal
5
Righteous Might
Wall of stone
6
Planar binding
Stone to flesh
how exactly over powered is this at the moment? I feel like its too strong, but I like all the ideas here and I'm too close to the idea to view it objectively.
if i'm underestimating its strength then there is a non combat based class ability i'd add, namely the character gets a bonus to bluff/diplomacy/intimidate at a rate of 1/4 of their class levels in the summoner class.
Homebrew 3.5 tank class
What's your idea of "balanced"? Is it intended to compete with Fighters? Then it's way too powerful. (But that says something about the Fighter, rather.)
Do you want it to be able compete with melee Druids and their companions? Then it's weak.
Overall, I like the idea. However, I'd work in some mechanic to increase their damage. Right now, they only have Power Attack. The monsters they can summon don't do much damage. They're mostly useful for the spell-like abilities.
An idea that springs to mind is to grant them a bonus on damage rolls equal to their CHA mod, as long as they flank with their summon. Later on, you can double it. Reason I'm stressing damage is that you need to be important enough to be a target.
Secondly, I'd add some utility spells to the list and some Battlefield Control, since that's an important part of tanking.
Do you want it to be able compete with melee Druids and their companions? Then it's weak.
Overall, I like the idea. However, I'd work in some mechanic to increase their damage. Right now, they only have Power Attack. The monsters they can summon don't do much damage. They're mostly useful for the spell-like abilities.
An idea that springs to mind is to grant them a bonus on damage rolls equal to their CHA mod, as long as they flank with their summon. Later on, you can double it. Reason I'm stressing damage is that you need to be important enough to be a target.
Secondly, I'd add some utility spells to the list and some Battlefield Control, since that's an important part of tanking.
the spells were intended to be perks, hence why there are so few on the list, and so few casts per day.
I agree as far as damage goes, but consider how much the character's damage increases when the str stat is increased. This class gets bonuses to str that are sizable, to bring its effective chance to hit as high as a fighters. that same strength compares to damage the fighter gets through weapon specialization.
The minion is there for flanking benefits, shield other, and add an attack or two so this class gets a similar number of attacks per round as a fighter, though its a worthless ability if the minion can't hit the opponent.
I think the ability to shape the battlefield with wall of stone to be quite handy (at higher levels), not to mention that this tank consists of two characters, tactically i can simply be in teh way if an opponent can't just bull rush me out of the way.
I agree as far as damage goes, but consider how much the character's damage increases when the str stat is increased. This class gets bonuses to str that are sizable, to bring its effective chance to hit as high as a fighters. that same strength compares to damage the fighter gets through weapon specialization.
The minion is there for flanking benefits, shield other, and add an attack or two so this class gets a similar number of attacks per round as a fighter, though its a worthless ability if the minion can't hit the opponent.
I think the ability to shape the battlefield with wall of stone to be quite handy (at higher levels), not to mention that this tank consists of two characters, tactically i can simply be in teh way if an opponent can't just bull rush me out of the way.
here is the current class progression, with descriptions, just to clarify.
Weapon and Armor Proficiencies
A Soul Summoner has proficiency with all simple light and one handed weapons, the long sword, Battle Axe, and the longbow and composite longbow. A Summoner also has light and medium armor proficiencies, and light shields.
Class Abilities
Summon: a soul summoner has discovered the talent of summoning a single creature to protect and serve. This ability is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier. Upon first entering the class, the type of creature summoned is chosen for that spell level. Upon gaining levels enough to change ranks, you may pick a new creature. The summon spell may only be used to summon one creature, from the current rank.
The Summon spell like ability is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier.
The spell increases from rank one of the summon through the ranks, as the character gains levels in the class. For example at third level the soul summoner gains access to rank two of summon monster/nature's ally. Of note is when a Soul summoner does change ranks, he loses the previous rank, and must pick a favored Summon on the new list.
While a creature is Summoned, the character gains access to the Soul Summoner Spell List.
Max spell level follows the formula of max level = current level / 3 rounded down.
spells per day is based upon only the progression listed here. A Soul Summoner gains no benefit from charisma to gain extra spells per day. Charisma simply allows a Summoner to command their minion to cast a spell of that level, and determine DC. A spell cast by a minion takes a standard action of the minion, and a free action of the Summoner. The Minion provokes attacks of opportunity as usual for spell casting.
If a Summoner wishes, they may take a feat instead of their usual feat every 3rd level to grant his minion access to a conjuration spell from the wizard list, that does not deal damage, or summon a creature. The spell level of the chosen spell must be at least one level lower than the current minion's max spell level. This demonstrates the study in which your summoner can undergo to learn how to augment your Minion's capabilities for your benefit.
The spell is considered to be cast by the summoned creature at your direction, even if it did not have the required ability score to cast it, this is because it uses your charisma score instead of its own. If your charisma score is not high enough to command the minion to cast the spell, then it cannot use a charisma score that is high enough. Therefore you do not qualify for feats/prestige class requirements that have a caster level or the ability to cast a spell of a certain level. The creature is given the ability to cast these spells for you, by the Soul Summoner class.
Only one creature can be under the control of the Soul summoner, uses of Summon may be used to refresh to duration of your summoned minion, but any other spells cast from another class that summon creatures will end this effect, and end the duration of the Summon spell like ability.
Summon Monster/Nature's ally (list based on alignment)
Monsters summon-able are on alignment requirements.
Good = summon monster : celestial/good summons on the list
Evil = summon monster : fiendish summons on the list
Neutral = summon nature's ally : Any Magical Beast, or Elemental on the list
Upon successfully Summoning your Minion, you gain the benefit of the spell Tongues, but it only applies when speaking to your minion.
A Summoner may not call a creature of an alignment opposed to their own. A neutral Summoner must call an animal or an elemental minion.
Spell DC to dismiss the summon is equal to 10 + rank of the summon + cha modifier + misc modifiers like ability focus.
A Summon minion follows the rules as stated by the summon monster/nature's ally spell, which means the minion cannot use a teleport style ability nor use any form of planar travel. Additionally they may not use any spell like abilities that can't be used at will. The Summon spell like ability has no charisma requirement to cast it.
2nd level Skilled Summoner: Duration of summon increases by a number of rounds equal to cha modifier (so level + 2 * cha modifier for duration)
3rd level Summoner's bond(requires skilled summoners) When you summon a creature, you gain benefits for yourself.
passive : +2 to charisma for duration of spell (does increase the duration of the current Summon post cast) While Summon is active your move speed is increased by 10 ft.
you also gain these benefits based on alignment.
Good alignment +2 con for duration of spell
Neutral Alignment +2 dex for duration of spell
Evil +2 str for duration of spell
these bonuses count as Minion bonuses depending on alignment.(so that class based features will stack with all other benefits, but are of a specific type)
4th level Augment summoning (+4 to str and con for summoned creatures) doesn't need prerequisites
4th level Minion's Minor Influence: you gain a bonus to bluff, diplomacy and intimidate equal to ¼ of your class levels of summoner.
8th level Imperative summoning (requires skilled summoner) a creature summoned gets 1 move action for free, usable once per summon duration
9th level Minion's Influence: your bonus from the influence class ability increases to 1/3 of your levels in the summoner class.
1oth level Rapid summons(requires skilled summoner): quickens a summon spell from full round to standard action
10th level Minion's Focus
You gain +1 to hit and damage rolls level/10 (rounded down) against a target successfully struck by your minion.
10th level Soul Boost: At tenth level a Summoner takes on minor aspects of their Summoned minion.
Any strength, dexterity and constitution modifier the Minion has, the Summoner gains as a bonus to his stats, however the bonuses are one quarter as strong as what the Minion has. If a minion has str 26 or +8 modifier the Summoner gets +2 to his stat or +1 modifier. This is a supernatural ability in effect only during a Summons effect, and counts as a Minion bonus to attributes.
You take on appearance of a celestial/animal/elemental/demon/devil while the Summon ability is active. This appearance grants no other bonuses other than being an indicator of your alignment.
12th level Extend summoning : A Summoner's control increases, and the Summon ability's duration is now doubled.
19th level Minion's Greater Influence: your bonus to bluff, diplomacy and intimidate increases to ½ your class level(rounded down)
20th level Perfect Summoning
A Summoner has reached the Epitome of summoning and can now cast his Summon ability as a free action, and the minion gains an additional +4 to strength and constitution.
20th level Complete Soul
The Summoner's Bond with his Summoned Minion has become so strong as to grant the summoner half of the modifier bonus in strength dexterity and constitution of his minion. In addition the Summoner's nature changes from being humanoid, to becoming an outsider type of the type his minion is. Example of bonuses a minion with a 28 strength score for a modifier of +8, the Summoner gains +4 to Str as a result.
Good minions change their summoner to a celestial (outsider with the good type)
Evil minions change their Summoner to a Devil/Demon type (outsider with the evil type)
Animal Minions change their Summoner to a Corporeal Spirit(Outsider with the native type)
Elemental minions change their Summoner to an Elemental(Outsider with the same elemental type as their minion)
You no longer take aging penalties and will continue to accrue bonuses as your character ages. You will still die of old age based upon your original race.
Spell List levels 0 to 6
0
purify food and drink
Detect poison
1
Bless
endure elements
2
Barkskin
shield other
3
Heroism
haste
4
freedom of movement
Dismissal
5
Righteous Might
Wall of stone
6
Planar binding
Stone to flesh
Weapon and Armor Proficiencies
A Soul Summoner has proficiency with all simple light and one handed weapons, the long sword, Battle Axe, and the longbow and composite longbow. A Summoner also has light and medium armor proficiencies, and light shields.
Class Abilities
Summon: a soul summoner has discovered the talent of summoning a single creature to protect and serve. This ability is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier. Upon first entering the class, the type of creature summoned is chosen for that spell level. Upon gaining levels enough to change ranks, you may pick a new creature. The summon spell may only be used to summon one creature, from the current rank.
The Summon spell like ability is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier.
The spell increases from rank one of the summon through the ranks, as the character gains levels in the class. For example at third level the soul summoner gains access to rank two of summon monster/nature's ally. Of note is when a Soul summoner does change ranks, he loses the previous rank, and must pick a favored Summon on the new list.
While a creature is Summoned, the character gains access to the Soul Summoner Spell List.
Max spell level follows the formula of max level = current level / 3 rounded down.
spells per day is based upon only the progression listed here. A Soul Summoner gains no benefit from charisma to gain extra spells per day. Charisma simply allows a Summoner to command their minion to cast a spell of that level, and determine DC. A spell cast by a minion takes a standard action of the minion, and a free action of the Summoner. The Minion provokes attacks of opportunity as usual for spell casting.
If a Summoner wishes, they may take a feat instead of their usual feat every 3rd level to grant his minion access to a conjuration spell from the wizard list, that does not deal damage, or summon a creature. The spell level of the chosen spell must be at least one level lower than the current minion's max spell level. This demonstrates the study in which your summoner can undergo to learn how to augment your Minion's capabilities for your benefit.
The spell is considered to be cast by the summoned creature at your direction, even if it did not have the required ability score to cast it, this is because it uses your charisma score instead of its own. If your charisma score is not high enough to command the minion to cast the spell, then it cannot use a charisma score that is high enough. Therefore you do not qualify for feats/prestige class requirements that have a caster level or the ability to cast a spell of a certain level. The creature is given the ability to cast these spells for you, by the Soul Summoner class.
Only one creature can be under the control of the Soul summoner, uses of Summon may be used to refresh to duration of your summoned minion, but any other spells cast from another class that summon creatures will end this effect, and end the duration of the Summon spell like ability.
Summon Monster/Nature's ally (list based on alignment)
Monsters summon-able are on alignment requirements.
Good = summon monster : celestial/good summons on the list
Evil = summon monster : fiendish summons on the list
Neutral = summon nature's ally : Any Magical Beast, or Elemental on the list
Upon successfully Summoning your Minion, you gain the benefit of the spell Tongues, but it only applies when speaking to your minion.
A Summoner may not call a creature of an alignment opposed to their own. A neutral Summoner must call an animal or an elemental minion.
Spell DC to dismiss the summon is equal to 10 + rank of the summon + cha modifier + misc modifiers like ability focus.
A Summon minion follows the rules as stated by the summon monster/nature's ally spell, which means the minion cannot use a teleport style ability nor use any form of planar travel. Additionally they may not use any spell like abilities that can't be used at will. The Summon spell like ability has no charisma requirement to cast it.
2nd level Skilled Summoner: Duration of summon increases by a number of rounds equal to cha modifier (so level + 2 * cha modifier for duration)
3rd level Summoner's bond(requires skilled summoners) When you summon a creature, you gain benefits for yourself.
passive : +2 to charisma for duration of spell (does increase the duration of the current Summon post cast) While Summon is active your move speed is increased by 10 ft.
you also gain these benefits based on alignment.
Good alignment +2 con for duration of spell
Neutral Alignment +2 dex for duration of spell
Evil +2 str for duration of spell
these bonuses count as Minion bonuses depending on alignment.(so that class based features will stack with all other benefits, but are of a specific type)
4th level Augment summoning (+4 to str and con for summoned creatures) doesn't need prerequisites
4th level Minion's Minor Influence: you gain a bonus to bluff, diplomacy and intimidate equal to ¼ of your class levels of summoner.
8th level Imperative summoning (requires skilled summoner) a creature summoned gets 1 move action for free, usable once per summon duration
9th level Minion's Influence: your bonus from the influence class ability increases to 1/3 of your levels in the summoner class.
1oth level Rapid summons(requires skilled summoner): quickens a summon spell from full round to standard action
10th level Minion's Focus
You gain +1 to hit and damage rolls level/10 (rounded down) against a target successfully struck by your minion.
10th level Soul Boost: At tenth level a Summoner takes on minor aspects of their Summoned minion.
Any strength, dexterity and constitution modifier the Minion has, the Summoner gains as a bonus to his stats, however the bonuses are one quarter as strong as what the Minion has. If a minion has str 26 or +8 modifier the Summoner gets +2 to his stat or +1 modifier. This is a supernatural ability in effect only during a Summons effect, and counts as a Minion bonus to attributes.
You take on appearance of a celestial/animal/elemental/demon/devil while the Summon ability is active. This appearance grants no other bonuses other than being an indicator of your alignment.
12th level Extend summoning : A Summoner's control increases, and the Summon ability's duration is now doubled.
19th level Minion's Greater Influence: your bonus to bluff, diplomacy and intimidate increases to ½ your class level(rounded down)
20th level Perfect Summoning
A Summoner has reached the Epitome of summoning and can now cast his Summon ability as a free action, and the minion gains an additional +4 to strength and constitution.
20th level Complete Soul
The Summoner's Bond with his Summoned Minion has become so strong as to grant the summoner half of the modifier bonus in strength dexterity and constitution of his minion. In addition the Summoner's nature changes from being humanoid, to becoming an outsider type of the type his minion is. Example of bonuses a minion with a 28 strength score for a modifier of +8, the Summoner gains +4 to Str as a result.
Good minions change their summoner to a celestial (outsider with the good type)
Evil minions change their Summoner to a Devil/Demon type (outsider with the evil type)
Animal Minions change their Summoner to a Corporeal Spirit(Outsider with the native type)
Elemental minions change their Summoner to an Elemental(Outsider with the same elemental type as their minion)
You no longer take aging penalties and will continue to accrue bonuses as your character ages. You will still die of old age based upon your original race.
Spell List levels 0 to 6
0
purify food and drink
Detect poison
1
Bless
endure elements
2
Barkskin
shield other
3
Heroism
haste
4
freedom of movement
Dismissal
5
Righteous Might
Wall of stone
6
Planar binding
Stone to flesh
The stat boosts from Summons are way too low to be considered "attention worthy" damage. Weapon Spec & Greater Weapon Spec aren't good baselines: they're much too weak.
I'd suggest to give the ability modifier of the Summon as a Competence bonus on stats.
And another suggestion: Let Augment Summon, Minion's Focus and the Improved Augment Summon only apply to the Favoured Summon, but let them still be able to summon others. Versatility is one of the things that makes Summoning viable. Or allow them to summon another creature from one rank lower.
I applaud the class, it seems fair and original.
I'd suggest to give the ability modifier of the Summon as a Competence bonus on stats.
And another suggestion: Let Augment Summon, Minion's Focus and the Improved Augment Summon only apply to the Favoured Summon, but let them still be able to summon others. Versatility is one of the things that makes Summoning viable. Or allow them to summon another creature from one rank lower.
I applaud the class, it seems fair and original.
good point on the viability front, perhaps as part of progression they learn to have the option of adding a 2nd minion, with only one active?
Good rule of thumb with me is that i try to start too weak and add strengths as needed. Its easy to get carried away.
i think i'll make minion's focus add to both of their chances to hit. as it stands the minion needs to roll a 15 or better at 20th level(due to being a cr11)
13 or better is reasonable odds with the dice in my eyes.
Hows the idea for the minion's cha modifier being a bonus on damage rolls, for only the summoner?
or should it be the summoner's? (higher levels i think most of the summons will have higher cha, but i haven't checked)
Good rule of thumb with me is that i try to start too weak and add strengths as needed. Its easy to get carried away.
i think i'll make minion's focus add to both of their chances to hit. as it stands the minion needs to roll a 15 or better at 20th level(due to being a cr11)
13 or better is reasonable odds with the dice in my eyes.
Hows the idea for the minion's cha modifier being a bonus on damage rolls, for only the summoner?
or should it be the summoner's? (higher levels i think most of the summons will have higher cha, but i haven't checked)
Having a second Minion is a step in a better direction, but I still think it giving them "free" access to the lower level tier of summons is a better idea: in combat, the lower level summons our virtually useless anyway, but outside of combat, they can be useful, for things like healing, scouting, transportation... They wouldn't overpower the class, but diversify it.
I'd go for the Summoner's CHA to damage, since a lot of the combat-summons have low CHA.
Another ability to toy with: some way of letting your Minion get some of your item's bonuses. Maybe something like the Ranger's Combat Style, with one option being that your Minion gets your weapon's Enhancements, and the other being Minion's Focus and CHA to damage.
I wouldn't know for sure which to pick, and that's always a good sign.
I'd go for the Summoner's CHA to damage, since a lot of the combat-summons have low CHA.
Another ability to toy with: some way of letting your Minion get some of your item's bonuses. Maybe something like the Ranger's Combat Style, with one option being that your Minion gets your weapon's Enhancements, and the other being Minion's Focus and CHA to damage.
I wouldn't know for sure which to pick, and that's always a good sign.
are there any summons on the summon monsters/nature's ally lists that can heal? certainly scouts are nifty. I'd say then that the class could summon 1 monster from the next lowest level, and have it active at the same time as the minion. another good idea would probably have monsters summoned from the lower level ranks to have a longer summon duration, ie conjure a mount for times when flying or such is needed. I will probably add the Mount spell to one of the spells on the list.
for higher level summons from the summon monster's list, the celestials and fiends tend to have enchanted weapons i thought, nothing gigantic, but present. Otherwise I'd probably say that the minion gains the benefit of the spell greater magic weapon/fang, with the summoner's class level for the determination of strength.
i'll probably drop the tongues effect, in favor of the telepathic bond that wizards share with their familiar, as some of the spells don't make sense as far as rules are concerned with the character having to explain in combat vocally what he wants done with the spell, such as with wall of stone. A telepathic link would be better.
No sense in a summon class that doesn't make use of a majority of the pet abilities, that make sense to apply.
One last ability i thought of and hadn't added yet was something i called Adaptive Movement, you and your minion share a pool of actions in a round. as in between the two of you, there are 2 standard actions and 2 move actions to use. how nifty would it be in certain rounds to use 2 full attack options from one or the other, or a standard attack + fullround attack, and your minion is able to take a move action?
for higher level summons from the summon monster's list, the celestials and fiends tend to have enchanted weapons i thought, nothing gigantic, but present. Otherwise I'd probably say that the minion gains the benefit of the spell greater magic weapon/fang, with the summoner's class level for the determination of strength.
i'll probably drop the tongues effect, in favor of the telepathic bond that wizards share with their familiar, as some of the spells don't make sense as far as rules are concerned with the character having to explain in combat vocally what he wants done with the spell, such as with wall of stone. A telepathic link would be better.
No sense in a summon class that doesn't make use of a majority of the pet abilities, that make sense to apply.
One last ability i thought of and hadn't added yet was something i called Adaptive Movement, you and your minion share a pool of actions in a round. as in between the two of you, there are 2 standard actions and 2 move actions to use. how nifty would it be in certain rounds to use 2 full attack options from one or the other, or a standard attack + fullround attack, and your minion is able to take a move action?
i like your idea of splitting up the benefits into a sort of class progression tree.
the choice between the two would be easy to make though. One would be significantly better than the other depending on stat rolls. The character's low cha score would never reach the heights it could if the player rolled higher.
low stats.. take the one based on your weapon's enchantments, slower path to power, but higher end result reachable, than if you took minion's path. I'll call this path the Master's Possession.
high stats means consistent level of power, that scales up slightly as you find stat increases. If the character got a high charisma to start,and picked the minion's path then Minion's focus and Harmful Intent(working name, as all of the class abilities are) (cha modifier to damage rolls) would yield higher results, early game and late game.
Since it would be a forgone conclusion as to which you'd pick (based on a random roll) its not particularly interesting.
The only aspect i've not considered is whether your minion through master's possession would get your weapon's special abilities like say.. keen, or defending or the elemental enchants.
If those were added to the consideration it wouldn't be as clear cut. I think if those enchantments were part of the consideration the minion's path would be inferior, given the assumption that a character's possession are not consistently lost or stolen.
the choice between the two would be easy to make though. One would be significantly better than the other depending on stat rolls. The character's low cha score would never reach the heights it could if the player rolled higher.
low stats.. take the one based on your weapon's enchantments, slower path to power, but higher end result reachable, than if you took minion's path. I'll call this path the Master's Possession.
high stats means consistent level of power, that scales up slightly as you find stat increases. If the character got a high charisma to start,and picked the minion's path then Minion's focus and Harmful Intent(working name, as all of the class abilities are) (cha modifier to damage rolls) would yield higher results, early game and late game.
Since it would be a forgone conclusion as to which you'd pick (based on a random roll) its not particularly interesting.
The only aspect i've not considered is whether your minion through master's possession would get your weapon's special abilities like say.. keen, or defending or the elemental enchants.
If those were added to the consideration it wouldn't be as clear cut. I think if those enchantments were part of the consideration the minion's path would be inferior, given the assumption that a character's possession are not consistently lost or stolen.
Well, most groups I know of don't play with random stat rolls, so basing the choice with that system in mind isn't a good idea. Even those that use random rolls, mostly allow you to arrange your stats as you'd like.mizzrym wrote:i like your idea of splitting up the benefits into a sort of class progression tree.
the choice between the two would be easy to make though. One would be significantly better than the other depending on stat rolls. The character's low cha score would never reach the heights it could if the player rolled higher.
low stats.. take the one based on your weapon's enchantments, slower path to power, but higher end result reachable, than if you took minion's path. I'll call this path the Master's Possession.
high stats means consistent level of power, that scales up slightly as you find stat increases. If the character got a high charisma to start,and picked the minion's path then Minion's focus and Harmful Intent(working name, as all of the class abilities are) (cha modifier to damage rolls) would yield higher results, early game and late game.
Since it would be a forgone conclusion as to which you'd pick (based on a random roll) its not particularly interesting.
The only aspect i've not considered is whether your minion through master's possession would get your weapon's special abilities like say.. keen, or defending or the elemental enchants.
If those were added to the consideration it wouldn't be as clear cut. I think if those enchantments were part of the consideration the minion's path would be inferior, given the assumption that a character's possession are not consistently lost or stolen.
Also, even with high stats, I'd think twice to chooce between CHA to damage and giving my minion the abilities of my weapon, like Keen and such. (Not that Keen is particularly useful.) A way to overcome DR can be very useful later on, not to mention Greater Magic Weapon or Speed. You can alter the ability to let your minion use your Weapon Enhancements and Armour Enhancements, or something like that. Just throwing out ideas.
Summons that can heal, on top of my head: Summon Monster: the Leonal has Cure Critical Wounds 3x and Heal 1x, and the Unicorn from Summon Nature's Ally has Cure Moderate Wounds x3, IIRC.
its great fun to chat about class design 
i play with 2 methods, picked by my players.
the first is simply 4d6, reroll a die if it comes up as one, but only once per set.
the second is the point buy system, and i generally go with 28 or so points to work with.
This group tends to like the die roll, liking that fact that they could get an excellent set of stats to work with. They seem to not understand the laws of probability in which you're not going to get consistent results every time, its the averages that balance out.
each item enchantment has its place, i like keen, because i've made characters who use dual Kukri. Its not a particularly strong build, but its fun to throw a crit every round or so, with 6-7 attacks per round.
damage reduction is certainly a consideration to be able to get around, but short of weapon oils its not easy to fix. any creature with dr/magic is easy to get around whenever a wizard/cleric would be present, but dr/cold iron or silver is trickier.
and since an item's material isn't an item enchantment i'm not sure how the minion would be able to gain benefit short of carrying around a weapon for them to switch to(if a weapon wielder).
i play with 2 methods, picked by my players.
the first is simply 4d6, reroll a die if it comes up as one, but only once per set.
the second is the point buy system, and i generally go with 28 or so points to work with.
This group tends to like the die roll, liking that fact that they could get an excellent set of stats to work with. They seem to not understand the laws of probability in which you're not going to get consistent results every time, its the averages that balance out.
each item enchantment has its place, i like keen, because i've made characters who use dual Kukri. Its not a particularly strong build, but its fun to throw a crit every round or so, with 6-7 attacks per round.
damage reduction is certainly a consideration to be able to get around, but short of weapon oils its not easy to fix. any creature with dr/magic is easy to get around whenever a wizard/cleric would be present, but dr/cold iron or silver is trickier.
and since an item's material isn't an item enchantment i'm not sure how the minion would be able to gain benefit short of carrying around a weapon for them to switch to(if a weapon wielder).
I don't like Keen (and Criticals in general) since so many things are immune to it.
Anyway, There's the Metalline weapon Enhancement (which I never play without) to get around metal DR, and the Transmutation enhancement too. Holy, Unholy, Lawful, Chaotic help with DR as well, as does Sacred. A Force Enhancement on a ranged weapon simply doesn't care about DR at all. Check the Magic Item Compendium for those that aren't from the DMG.
All in all, Oils are terrible ineffective to get around DR (lose a round to apply it, short duration, high cost.)
The Shared Action Pool sounds great, but opens the way to abuse. Imaging some creative multiclassing with some Wizard or Cleric levels... At most, I'd make it shared Move Actions.
Anyway, There's the Metalline weapon Enhancement (which I never play without) to get around metal DR, and the Transmutation enhancement too. Holy, Unholy, Lawful, Chaotic help with DR as well, as does Sacred. A Force Enhancement on a ranged weapon simply doesn't care about DR at all. Check the Magic Item Compendium for those that aren't from the DMG.
All in all, Oils are terrible ineffective to get around DR (lose a round to apply it, short duration, high cost.)
The Shared Action Pool sounds great, but opens the way to abuse. Imaging some creative multiclassing with some Wizard or Cleric levels... At most, I'd make it shared Move Actions.
mm i can see how a hasted wizard multiclass could abuse the hell out of the shared action pool. Though their spells would suffer significantly on caster level effects.
The metalline item enhancement i haven't heard of before.. then again i don't have the magic item compendium.
I imagine its online somewhere without much trouble.
don't the alignment weapons carry significant penalties for wielders if they don't match they alignment?
the good summoner would have a good minion.. effectively making unholy items not particularly helpful in my mind. similar with chaos and axiomatic, the master and minion are likely to have differing alignments there. low level summon spell lists offer an assortment of alignments.. but the options dwindle as the ranks get higher.
The metalline item enhancement i haven't heard of before.. then again i don't have the magic item compendium.
I imagine its online somewhere without much trouble.
don't the alignment weapons carry significant penalties for wielders if they don't match they alignment?
the good summoner would have a good minion.. effectively making unholy items not particularly helpful in my mind. similar with chaos and axiomatic, the master and minion are likely to have differing alignments there. low level summon spell lists offer an assortment of alignments.. but the options dwindle as the ranks get higher.
mm usually only happens when you're a playing a good character.. and do something foolish.
or if you're playing an evil campaign, its slightly more likely due to betrayals, and evil npc's tending to like summoned minions through gate spells.
I think i'll go with the Minion's focus and harmful influence, magic explains all, but having class abilities that scale off of items seems ultimately shaky.
significant buffs every time your weapon/armor improve.. makes wealth far too important to improving the character.
reasonable location for harmful influence I'm thinking 5th level or so.
or if you're playing an evil campaign, its slightly more likely due to betrayals, and evil npc's tending to like summoned minions through gate spells.
I think i'll go with the Minion's focus and harmful influence, magic explains all, but having class abilities that scale off of items seems ultimately shaky.
significant buffs every time your weapon/armor improve.. makes wealth far too important to improving the character.
reasonable location for harmful influence I'm thinking 5th level or so.
So i've been fiddling with finishing the class ideas.
A number of changes have been made. The spell casting progression was removed, the hd reduced to d4, con bonuses from soul boost removed.
The summoner and minion now permanently have Shield Other active on each other, while the Minion is present. This grants enough hp to bring the character down to more reasonable hp levels.
to demonstrate
at 20th level the character would have 20 * 2 (average d4 roll) + 20 * con modifier + minion's hp (roughly 100 hp for a cr 11 summon from rank 9)
That brings the characters hp much closer to a fighters.
20 * 5 (average d10 roll) + 20 * con modifier
If you factor out the con modifier (by having a score of 10)
the class can be shown to have 40 hp + minion's, vs 100 hp for the fighter.
A number of changes have been made. The spell casting progression was removed, the hd reduced to d4, con bonuses from soul boost removed.
The summoner and minion now permanently have Shield Other active on each other, while the Minion is present. This grants enough hp to bring the character down to more reasonable hp levels.
to demonstrate
at 20th level the character would have 20 * 2 (average d4 roll) + 20 * con modifier + minion's hp (roughly 100 hp for a cr 11 summon from rank 9)
That brings the characters hp much closer to a fighters.
20 * 5 (average d10 roll) + 20 * con modifier
If you factor out the con modifier (by having a score of 10)
the class can be shown to have 40 hp + minion's, vs 100 hp for the fighter.
current class progression
Weapon and Armor Proficiencies
A Soul Summoner has proficiency with all simple light and one handed weapons, the long sword, Battle Axe, and the longbow and composite longbow. A Summoner also has light armor proficiency, and light shields.
Class Abilities
Summon Minion: a soul summoner has discovered the talent of summoning a single creature to protect and serve. This ability is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier. Upon first entering the class, the type of creature summoned is chosen for that spell level. Upon gaining levels enough to change ranks, you may pick a new creature. You may only have 1 minion present from your highest rank spell at one time. However you may have as many monsters summoned from your lower rank of summon monster, as long as you can spend a use of Summon Minion each time to do so.
The Summon spell like ability is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier.
The spell increases from rank one of the summon through the ranks, as the character gains levels in the class. For example at third level the soul summoner gains access to rank two of summon monster. Of note is when a Soul summoner does increase in ranks, he loses all other ranks except for the two highest ranks, and must pick a favored Summon on the highest rank.
Only one creature can be under the control of the Soul summoner, uses of Summon may be used to refresh to duration of your summoned minion, but any other spells cast from another class that summon creatures will end this effect, and end the duration of the Summon spell like ability.
Summon Monster
Monsters summon-able are on alignment requirements.
Good = summon monster : celestial/good summons on the list
Evil = summon monster : fiendish summons on the list
Neutral = May pick to follow either the Good or Evil restrictions.
In addition you and your minion share a telepathic bond for communication.
A Summoner may not call a creature of an alignment opposed to their own. A neutral Summoner must call an animal or an elemental minion.
Spell DC to dismiss the summon is equal to 10 + rank of the summon + cha modifier + misc modifiers like ability focus.
A Summon minion follows the rules as stated by the summon monster spell, which means the minion cannot use a teleport style ability nor use any form of planar travel. The Summon spell like ability has no charisma requirement to cast it.
2nd level Skilled Summoner: Duration of summon increases by a number of rounds equal to cha modifier (so level + 2 * cha modifier for total duration)
2nd level Summon Mount: gains the ability to cast the mount spell, a number of times per day equal to cha modifier. Duration uses the Soul Summoner's class level.
3rd level Summoner's bond(requires skilled summoners) When you summon a creature, you gain benefits for yourself.
passive : +2 to charisma for duration of spell (does increase the duration of the current Summon post cast) While yout minion is present your move speed is increased by 10 ft.
you also gain these benefits based on alignment.
Good alignment +2 con for duration of spell
Neutral Alignment +2 dex for duration of spell
Evil +2 str for duration of spell
These bonuses count as Minion bonuses depending on alignment.(so that class based features will stack with all other benefits, but are of a specific type)
4th Spirit Link : While Minion is present both you and your minion have Shield Other cast upon the other, and the duration is equal to the length of Summon Minion.
4th level Augment summoning (+4 to str and con for summoned creatures) doesn't need prerequisites
4th level Minion's Minor Influence: you gain a bonus to bluff, diplomacy and intimidate equal to ¼ of your class levels of summoner.
5th level Soul Boost: At tenth level a Summoner takes on minor aspects of their Summoned minion.
Any strength and dexterity modifier the Minion has, the Summoner gains as a bonus to his stats, however the bonuses are one half as strong as what the Minion has. If a minion has str 26 or +8 modifier the Summoner gets +4 to his stat or +2 modifier. This is a supernatural ability in effect only during a Summons effect, and counts as a competence bonus to attributes.
You take on appearance of a celestial//demon/devil while the Summon ability is active. This appearance grants no other bonuses other than being an indicator of your alignment.
6th level Summoner's Blessing: Your Minion will now gain benefit of Greater magic Weapon or greater magic fang as appropriate.
8th level Imperative summoning a creature summoned gets 1 move action for free, usable once per summon duration
9th level Minion's Influence: your bonus from the influence class ability increases to 1/3 of your levels in the summoner class.
10th level Rapid summons: quickens a summon spell from full round to standard action
10th level Minion's Focus: You and your minion gain +1 to hit and damage rolls level/10 (rounded down) against a target flanked by you and your minion.
10th level Harmful Intent: the summoner gains a bonus to damage rolls equal to ½ of his charisma modifier.
12th level Extend summoning : A Summoner's control increases, and the Summon ability's duration is now doubled.
15th level : hostile intent: harmful intent is overwritten, and hostile intent gives your full charisma bonus to damage rolls.
19th level Minion's Greater Influence: your bonus to bluff, diplomacy and intimidate increases to ½ your class level(rounded down)
20th level Perfect Summoning: A Summoner has reached the Epitome of summoning and can now cast his Summon Minion ability as a free action, and the minion gains an additional +4 to strength and constitution.
20th level Complete Soul: The Summoner's Bond with his Summoned Minion has become so strong as to grant the summoner all of the modifier bonus in strength and dexterity of his minion. In addition the Summoner's nature changes from being humanoid, to becoming an outsider type of the type his minion is. Example of bonuses a minion with a 30 strength score for a modifier of +10, the Summoner gains +10 to Str as a result.
Good minions change their summoner to a celestial (outsider with the good type)
Evil minions change their Summoner to a Devil/Demon type (outsider with the evil type)
You no longer take aging penalties and will continue to accrue bonuses as your character ages. You will still die of old age based upon your original race.
Weapon and Armor Proficiencies
A Soul Summoner has proficiency with all simple light and one handed weapons, the long sword, Battle Axe, and the longbow and composite longbow. A Summoner also has light armor proficiency, and light shields.
Class Abilities
Summon Minion: a soul summoner has discovered the talent of summoning a single creature to protect and serve. This ability is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier. Upon first entering the class, the type of creature summoned is chosen for that spell level. Upon gaining levels enough to change ranks, you may pick a new creature. You may only have 1 minion present from your highest rank spell at one time. However you may have as many monsters summoned from your lower rank of summon monster, as long as you can spend a use of Summon Minion each time to do so.
The Summon spell like ability is usable a number of times per day equal to your charisma modifier.
The spell increases from rank one of the summon through the ranks, as the character gains levels in the class. For example at third level the soul summoner gains access to rank two of summon monster. Of note is when a Soul summoner does increase in ranks, he loses all other ranks except for the two highest ranks, and must pick a favored Summon on the highest rank.
Only one creature can be under the control of the Soul summoner, uses of Summon may be used to refresh to duration of your summoned minion, but any other spells cast from another class that summon creatures will end this effect, and end the duration of the Summon spell like ability.
Summon Monster
Monsters summon-able are on alignment requirements.
Good = summon monster : celestial/good summons on the list
Evil = summon monster : fiendish summons on the list
Neutral = May pick to follow either the Good or Evil restrictions.
In addition you and your minion share a telepathic bond for communication.
A Summoner may not call a creature of an alignment opposed to their own. A neutral Summoner must call an animal or an elemental minion.
Spell DC to dismiss the summon is equal to 10 + rank of the summon + cha modifier + misc modifiers like ability focus.
A Summon minion follows the rules as stated by the summon monster spell, which means the minion cannot use a teleport style ability nor use any form of planar travel. The Summon spell like ability has no charisma requirement to cast it.
2nd level Skilled Summoner: Duration of summon increases by a number of rounds equal to cha modifier (so level + 2 * cha modifier for total duration)
2nd level Summon Mount: gains the ability to cast the mount spell, a number of times per day equal to cha modifier. Duration uses the Soul Summoner's class level.
3rd level Summoner's bond(requires skilled summoners) When you summon a creature, you gain benefits for yourself.
passive : +2 to charisma for duration of spell (does increase the duration of the current Summon post cast) While yout minion is present your move speed is increased by 10 ft.
you also gain these benefits based on alignment.
Good alignment +2 con for duration of spell
Neutral Alignment +2 dex for duration of spell
Evil +2 str for duration of spell
These bonuses count as Minion bonuses depending on alignment.(so that class based features will stack with all other benefits, but are of a specific type)
4th Spirit Link : While Minion is present both you and your minion have Shield Other cast upon the other, and the duration is equal to the length of Summon Minion.
4th level Augment summoning (+4 to str and con for summoned creatures) doesn't need prerequisites
4th level Minion's Minor Influence: you gain a bonus to bluff, diplomacy and intimidate equal to ¼ of your class levels of summoner.
5th level Soul Boost: At tenth level a Summoner takes on minor aspects of their Summoned minion.
Any strength and dexterity modifier the Minion has, the Summoner gains as a bonus to his stats, however the bonuses are one half as strong as what the Minion has. If a minion has str 26 or +8 modifier the Summoner gets +4 to his stat or +2 modifier. This is a supernatural ability in effect only during a Summons effect, and counts as a competence bonus to attributes.
You take on appearance of a celestial//demon/devil while the Summon ability is active. This appearance grants no other bonuses other than being an indicator of your alignment.
6th level Summoner's Blessing: Your Minion will now gain benefit of Greater magic Weapon or greater magic fang as appropriate.
8th level Imperative summoning a creature summoned gets 1 move action for free, usable once per summon duration
9th level Minion's Influence: your bonus from the influence class ability increases to 1/3 of your levels in the summoner class.
10th level Rapid summons: quickens a summon spell from full round to standard action
10th level Minion's Focus: You and your minion gain +1 to hit and damage rolls level/10 (rounded down) against a target flanked by you and your minion.
10th level Harmful Intent: the summoner gains a bonus to damage rolls equal to ½ of his charisma modifier.
12th level Extend summoning : A Summoner's control increases, and the Summon ability's duration is now doubled.
15th level : hostile intent: harmful intent is overwritten, and hostile intent gives your full charisma bonus to damage rolls.
19th level Minion's Greater Influence: your bonus to bluff, diplomacy and intimidate increases to ½ your class level(rounded down)
20th level Perfect Summoning: A Summoner has reached the Epitome of summoning and can now cast his Summon Minion ability as a free action, and the minion gains an additional +4 to strength and constitution.
20th level Complete Soul: The Summoner's Bond with his Summoned Minion has become so strong as to grant the summoner all of the modifier bonus in strength and dexterity of his minion. In addition the Summoner's nature changes from being humanoid, to becoming an outsider type of the type his minion is. Example of bonuses a minion with a 30 strength score for a modifier of +10, the Summoner gains +10 to Str as a result.
Good minions change their summoner to a celestial (outsider with the good type)
Evil minions change their Summoner to a Devil/Demon type (outsider with the evil type)
You no longer take aging penalties and will continue to accrue bonuses as your character ages. You will still die of old age based upon your original race.