problem with cleric spells in sequencers

Isilion · Post by **Isilion** » Mon Apr 23, 2012 6:38 pm

I have Aerie in my party and wanted to use her cleric spells in sequencers and triggers.
I made one containing Heal, Remove paralysis and Protection from evil 10', but the heal spell failed to cast, even when i'm standing right next to the target.
I even did a test where i made aerie cast a heal on the target first so she was surely in touch range and then use the spell trigger, but the heal still failed to cast.
when she uses that trigger on herself, the Heal does cast though

i have a similar problem with my minor spell sequencer containing Bless + Chant. Bless gets casted normally but chant fails to cast, except when i target myself.
At first I thought it was because chant doesn't require a target, but then i realised that PfE10', works the same way as Chant, affecting a sphere around the caster, and that spell did get casted in the spell trigger.

Am i misunderstanding the mechanisms?
Are there any undocumented limitations, such as not being able to cast touch spells on targets other than yourself?

On top of that I ran into another problem.
Whenever Aerie used her spell trigger, her special ability button grayed out, even though i still had some abilities active such as minor spell sequencer. Recasting the minor spell sequencer resulted in an error message saying I already has such an ability active, so it was clearly still there.
Is there anyway to fix/circumvent this problem?

densorteengel · Post by **densorteengel** » Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:52 am

spell sequencer

As far as I recall, the sequencer can only target the person it belongs to (Aerie in this case) - Does it not say so in the description?

As to the greyed out button - I have no clue.

Sykar · Post by **Sykar** » Fri Jul 06, 2012 2:52 am

If I remember correctly all buff/heal spells must either be targeted OR AoE otherwise one of them will fail.
Try a sequencer with just Heal for example and see if it still does not work.

densorteengel wrote:As far as I recall, the sequencer can only target the person it belongs to (Aerie in this case) - Does it not say so in the description?

As to the greyed out button - I have no clue.

That is not true I can target enemies quite well with my triple Flame Arrow or Skul Trap Sequencer.

Sadly I cannot check this right now.

Edit: Ok now I could with a quick Aerie -> buy Sequencer test save of my current game, all heals must be centered on the caster, you cannot heal others with Sequencer/Trigger at all.

Isilion · Post by **Isilion** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 12:16 pm

thanks for the replies

i currently have no access to my pc with BG, but will try to fiddle around with it next week.

so heals in sequencers can only target the caster? that's a big disappointment, i was hoping for some fast emergency heals (without using greater restoration). is there any documentation on these limitations?

what about chant also failing to be cast?
i thought it used the same cast mechanisms as Protection from Evil 10', which does get cast successfully. Though the chant problem was with the minor sequencer, i can't remember if i tested it with other sequencers. couyld they work differently?

as for the special ability button being greyed out, maybe i can try to use shadowkeeper to delete her active sequencer abilities and then cast them again. Maybe it was a one time error.

densorteengel · Post by **densorteengel** » Sun Jul 08, 2012 2:06 pm

IF I am getting this right (this time) - you can't mix caster-centered spells, with spells that targets other people (your party/enemies). It has to be one or the other - however, the center on caster isn't so bad - chant, protection against evil, group healing, haste and so forth will work, as long as they are centered on the caster

OR you could target enemies as the previous post said

But I don't think you can mix them together

Isilion · Post by **Isilion** » Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:47 pm

I've been doing some testing and found some conclusions
all of these apply to all 3 kinds of sequencers/triggers
all of this applies to both mage and cleric spells

- ALL (but one) touch spells will fail if the sequencer is not targeted at the caster, this includes all healing spells, but also spells such as free action, cure disease, slow poison, protection from lightning, etc. They even fail when the target is in touch range (tested it with casting a heal on target first, the test heal worked, the sequencer failed). Even the mage spell Vampiric touch follows this rule, the other mage "touch" spells such as ghoul touch are technically weapon spells.
The one exception is negative plane protection, which in a sequencer can be cast on a target other than the mage himself. However, despite the spell description saying "range: touch" it can always be cats from a distance, so no surprise it still allows that in a sequencer.

- Caster centered aoe spells differ in their behavior. Some behave just as touch spells - i.e. the sequencer will fail if not cast at the mage himself, it will work if it is - and some don't
The ones that do follow the touch spell behavior are: chant, mass cure, the mage spell invisibility 10' radius, and i'm fairly sure mass invisibility would have too if it hadn't been a level 7 spell.
The ones that don't follow this rule are protection from evil 10' radius and defensive harmony. These 2 spell can be put in a sequencer and cast at a far away target and the spell will not fail. However, I am certain this is a BUG.
Consider the follwoing setup: A <--> B <--> C with C being the mage. When the mage casts one of these 2 spells B gets buffed but A is too far away. But when the mage has these spells in a sequencer and targets it at B, all 3 characters will be buffed. Sounds unintended to me.