Please Read

T'lainya · Post by **T'lainya** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 8:55 pm

Everyone, once again...please try to be calm and noninflammatory with your posts.

yaanathn · Post by **yaanathn** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 12:32 am

I agree that the Palestinians should be handled for this. I mean, no one, I mean NO ONE, dances and celebrates at the tragedies of another like that, even if the two parties are not on friendly terms, and even if the two parties are enemies, most of the time. It is childish (should I say, retarded) of those people in the streets to do what they are doing. It is an act of cowardice in itself, for even victors of war, any war, do not celebrate out of spite the way those people did today. I do not think the United States has to do anything about that just yet (what can it really do?), but I trust that the Palestinians will soon learn that they've only ruined themselves with such a cheap act of cowardice.

If we determine that Bin Laden was indeed responsible for this, then I agree wholeheartedly with the President's decree that the guilty party and anyone harboring that party will be hunted down and punished (paraphrasing and mixing some of his words together).

Kind of interesting, all this. The date (911), the President of the time (who's father watched over the Gulf War), and the people (the Americans, dare I say the foremost in defending democracy and freedom in the world). Like everyone else, I'm eager to see how events unfold from here. This is history already, and it might become bigger yet.

jennabard · Post by **jennabard** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 1:22 am

did anyone bother to look at arafat's face?

it was filled with horror and shock. he condemns the act. but unfortuntely, some of his people do not follow him and his ideals.

frankly i feel sorry for him. the action of a few has destroyed any chance he had to help his people.

Garcia · Post by **Garcia** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 1:28 am

once again nice handeling of things from our mod.
still I am pretty sure that no matter if people here come from abroad or not there isn't any in this forum that could see any good in the the terroris act. we come from many diffrent places but are pretty much the same. we seem to be in the same boat but i agree that things could easily get carried away due to the great loss on the anger against an "unknown" enemy.

VoodooDali · Post by **VoodooDali** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 6:15 am

Thanks, Buck. For some reason, this is the only forum I've wanted to post on. I watched the towers go down with my own two eyes yesterday morning. I saw a person or persons (I had binoculars, but it was still hard to tell) jump from the building. Before I moved last year, I lived only 3 blocks away from the WTC. Everywhere I've lived in the NYC area, I've had awesome views of the WTC, and the city seems so empty to me without it. I cannot describe how sad I am, and even though I want the people who did it to be brought to justice, it saddens me more to think we could find ourselves in another war over this. I don't know what else to say...I woke up this morning after having nightmares, and hoped it wasn't true, but there it is. I wish the world were more like BG, and evil was something palpable and relatively unambiguous. As Buck already said--I also want to remind people that NYC is a city of immigrants, and probably a lot of muslims died in this tragedy as well, so try not to lump them all together in your anger. My community is full of Egyptians who are Coptic christians and fled their country due to persecution...I feel bad for them that they will be given a hard time just because of their names. Anyway, this is the greatest forum, and I'm glad you are all there.

Coot · Post by **Coot** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 6:53 am

I can't believe something like this would really happen, that somebody would ever do a thing like this. It's something that you would expect to see only in a movie, and a bad one at that.
Even though the US is half a world away from the Netherlands, everybody I meet is so very, very shocked. So many people are watching the newsbroadcasts that the streets are almost empty around here.
I'm very much impressed by the people who immediately sprung into action, the police, firefighters, first aidpeople, etc. Many appear to have been hurt or killed while trying to save others.
I wish all people who have been touched by this enormous tragedy the strength you need to get through this.

Sailor Uranus · Post by **Sailor Uranus** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 7:06 am

I've read from various sources the responses from nearly every head of state worldwide. "Shocked" seems to be the most common thought; "horrified" is another. The interview w/ Arafat was pretty telling. It was clear that this hit him pretty hard and he was truly speechless. I think what's next is pretty clear... once it is determined who is responsible for these atrocities, the wrath of the entire world will be centered on those parties.

jace4ever · Post by **jace4ever** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 8:23 am

I certainly hope that God will help us find those culprits soon...

.........

In a time of war and destruction, a hero arises to fight darkness. His name is Jace and his name shall live forever for all time.

C Elegans · Post by **C Elegans** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 8:35 am

Originally posted by yaanathn:
I agree that the Palestinians should be handled for this. I mean, no one, I mean NO ONE, dances and celebrates at the tragedies of another like that <snip>

Please read my post (a reply to Rob-hin) about celebrations in the "Afghanistan feels our pain"-thread.

You say noone celebrates the death of innocents, but I've already heard many Amercians and Europeans expressing the want to send nucelar bomb to various countries in the Arab world, and wishing pain, torture and slow death to "Palestinians", "Arabs", "Afghanistanians" and "Muslims" in general. Perhaps some of the people who say this would celebrate the death of those people?

Also, please remember there's a very small minority of Palestinians (or other people in the Arab world) who support the terror act.

[ 09-12-2001: Message edited by: C Elegans ]

Coot · Post by **Coot** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 9:28 am

Adding to that:
Many kids in the school where I teach are from the Middle-East. No-one, children or parents, expressed any feelings of joy, on the contrary. My colleagues and I have spend the better part of our working day comforting scared and shocked kids.

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 10:23 am

Posted by White Rabbit -

The government released that they are 90% sure that Hasim Bin Laden (sp?) is behind the attacks. The same guy that bombed the world trade center not too long ago. This is a time for revenge, we must stop these terrorists before they attack again. And to all you who were celebrating this in the streets (example: palastinians), your day will come... May you all die slowly.

Have they released this information then? This afternoon a reporter questioned Tony Blair as to whether the US intelligence service had any ideas. He said they did, but would not elaborate...

tomberry · Post by **tomberry** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 10:32 am

i believe that those that celibrate this tragety are just minorities. most ppl wouldn't aprove such actions no matter the culture, race, or even religion.
you have to remember that those terrorist are minorities themselves, and only a few nations in the world are willing to harbor them. i doubt that they are still willing to harbor them after something like this. no nation is that foolish.

Darkpoet · Post by **Darkpoet** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 10:40 am

Originally posted by White Rabbit:
The government released that they are 90% sure that Hasim Bin Laden (sp?) is behind the attacks. The same guy that bombed the world trade center not too long ago. This is a time for revenge, we must stop these terrorists before they attack again. And to all you who were celebrating this in the streets (example: palastinians), your day will come... May you all die slowly.

Hmmmmmmm from what I saw, the media only show one part of palastiniens cheering. Again it's not the whole frigging country.

justAidan · Post by **justAidan** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 10:59 am

Originally posted by jennabard:
did anyone bother to look at arafat's face?

it was filled with horror and shock. he condemns the act. but unfortuntely, some of his people do not follow him and his ideals.

frankly i feel sorry for him. the action of a few has destroyed any chance he had to help his people.

Its just tragic through and through.

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 11:02 am

@DP - how are you? *hug* I was looking for you

KidD01 · Post by **KidD01** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 11:42 am

Buck, Sir ! Glad to see your comment on this tragedy. Yes this is a dark time indeed for human being, to see such a horrible action done by cowards.

Aside from the matter some thoughts came to me that why people only stand side by side when there's a tragedy happens ? Why they can't keep this when everything is calm and peaceful ? The answer I got is Ambition.

To all people of US, my deepest sympathy to you all.

MegaToerist · Post by **MegaToerist** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 12:36 pm

I've just found out about what happened today (I was on a ferry when things happened), and I'm really shocked, even by only seeing photographs...
As so many persons already said, it's really terrible. I'd like to express my deepest sympathy to all people who are somehow touched by this disaster...

Geert

(Edit - clicked "add reply" instead of "review topic"

)

[ 09-12-2001: Message edited by: MegaToerist ]

Nightmare · Post by **Nightmare** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 3:11 pm

About everything that happened...

It probably is Osama bin Ladin who controled these heinous acts of terror and death, because he is one of the only ones that has the money and resources to it. But remember, everyone thought it was middle east terrorists who commited the Oaklahoma City bombing. It wasn't until 2 or 3 days after that they found out it was an ex-Us military person. I'm not saying that it was an American who did this, but you never know who it is.
Also on bin Laden, I think the US might just "prove" its him and wipe him out, even if he didn't commit these acts. He should die. They should then continue the investigation in secret and kill the one responsible, if it wasn't bin Laden. The public will be gald, and one less terrorist in the world...

One of the frightening things is that something like this happened in a Tom Clancy novel (Debt of Honor/Executive Orders). The US and Japan were on the brink of war, but they ended the hostilities with negotiation, IIRC. Then, a terrorist crash a plane into the Congress or Senate (can't remember which), and kill the president, Congress, and top political/military leaders. I predict that Bush will send out a reaction like that in Clear and Present Danger (the book, not movie), another novel by Clancy. Only much larger in scale.

Speaking of Tom Clancy, he was interview on CNN last night. He had some very good points:
1)The suicide hijackers, if Islamic, it is against their religion for suicide.
2)This terrorist attack is odd; most terrorists would attack the WTC as a statement, and leave it at that. But they also attacked the Pentagon, and another plane was supposed heading for Washington.
3)He said that the gouvernment didn't had enough funding put into human intelligence. The news person on CNN asked why not. He said it was unpopular with people, generally because the media made it look that way. The news lady said that the news stayed neutral and unbiased. He said that no, they are not. They greatly influence public opinion and gouvernment policies. She basicly ended the interview right then and there (man are CNN going to get blasted).

The bombs in Kabul, Afganistan, were not part of a US attack, IMO. The US gouvernment doesn't move that quickly. For example, it took the US two days to formally declair war on Japan after Pearl Harbour.

ThorinOakensfield · Post by **ThorinOakensfield** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 3:24 pm

Originally posted by Gaxx_Firkraag:
About everything that happened...

It probably is Osama bin Ladin who controled these heinous acts of terror and death, because he is one of the only ones that has the money and resources to it. But remember, everyone thought it was middle east terrorists who commited the Oaklahoma City bombing. It wasn't until 2 or 3 days after that they found out it was an ex-Us military person. I'm not saying that it was an American who did this, but you never know who it is.
Also on bin Laden, I think the US might just "prove" its him and wipe him out, even if he didn't commit these acts. He should die. They should then continue the investigation in secret and kill the one responsible, if it wasn't bin Laden. The public will be gald, and one less terrorist in the world...

One of the frightening things is that something like this happened in a Tom Clancy novel (Debt of Honor/Executive Orders). The US and Japan were on the brink of war, but they ended the hostilities with negotiation, IIRC. Then, a terrorist crash a plane into the Congress or Senate (can't remember which), and kill the president, Congress, and top political/military leaders. I predict that Bush will send out a reaction like that in Clear and Present Danger (the book, not movie), another novel by Clancy. Only much larger in scale.

Speaking of Tom Clancy, he was interview on CNN last night. He had some very good points:
1)The suicide hijackers, if Islamic, it is against their religion for suicide.
2)This terrorist attack is odd; most terrorists would attack the WTC as a statement, and leave it at that. But they also attacked the Pentagon, and another plane was supposed heading for Washington.
3)He said that the gouvernment didn't had enough funding put into human intelligence. The news person on CNN asked why not. He said it was unpopular with people, generally because the media made it look that way. The news lady said that the news stayed neutral and unbiased. He said that no, they are not. They greatly influence public opinion and gouvernment policies. She basicly ended the interview right then and there (man are CNN going to get blasted).

The bombs in Kabul, Afganistan, were not part of a US attack, IMO. The US gouvernment doesn't move that quickly. For example, it took the US two days to formally declair war on Japan after Pearl Harbour.

I think it is possible that the terrorists may have not been Islamic.
On NBC IIRC, a woman called from a hijacked plane talked to somebody and they asked what was the race of the hijackers, where are they from, (by appearence).
She said she couldn't tell where they were from.
IMO it isn't to difficult to tell, because generally Muslims are from the Middle East and Sub Continent and from Malaysia and Indonesia.
Now it couldn't be that hard to tell these people apart, but she couldn't.
That would mean they probably had quite pale skin and probably black hair.

I believe it could have been anybody, and the hijackers are framing the Muslims, who are already heavily suspected.

Also after Bin Laden destroyed the embassies in Kenya, he immedaiately took credit. And he and his followers were proud of it. The Taliban are upset, the Palestinians are upset, bin laden is declining.
I bleive them .

Yes maybe some people did celebrate this catastrophe, but their just celebrating because something happened to the almighty US. It doesn't mean they actually did this.

So basically i say that it was somebody else.

Has anybody ever heard of the enviormental froup called ELF.
They have been known for burning down houses, and anything to destroy civilaztion.
I'm not saying they did this, but it could have been anybody.

hamstermutiny · Post by **hamstermutiny** » Wed Sep 12, 2001 3:31 pm

Hopefully the worst is behind. Except, it is all too possible the worst may yet come.
It may not be America next time. Every nation is at risk, anything could be a target. Acts such as this may not even be commited by the same terrorist group(s). Any group, or individual with sufficent ability and desire could do this.
There is no sure-fire way to prevent something like this from happening again. Numerous laws and measures can be enacted. While they will hinder, discourage, and even reveal terrorists, it is impossible to stop them completely.
America hasn't been changed by this. The whole world has been. We are all vunerable. Do not extricate your nation from this fact. Learn what you can from it.