Backstabbing a Dragon

Xan deVir · Post by **Xan deVir** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 2:19 am

.I keep reading it everywhere, that beholders, golems and dragons are Immune to backstab and It's right according to Ad&d but in bg2 I've always been able to backstab the big guys. The actual backstab immunes have been mages because of their spell triggers set to stoneskin, underdark creatures such as drow, and only one beholder and 2 golems - I'm referring to SOA areas only with TOB and all patches installed.

.what's wrong with my bg2 installation or the ability to backstab is a function of character level vs victim level???

Sojourner · Post by **Sojourner** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 3:07 am

Are you sure you're successfully backstabbing dragons, and not seeing a "backstab seems to have failed" message?

Xan deVir · Post by **Xan deVir** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 3:12 am

...I backstabbed Adalon for 60 dmg.
EDIT: the 60 damage hit was a critical hit backstab, with a normal hit I usually do 7-30 dmg *and* I get a "backstab Xable dmg" message.

TheDude · Post by **TheDude** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 3:29 am

well i never could backstab dragons, but beholders and gauths where never a problem for my to backstab.

Sojourner · Post by **Sojourner** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 3:33 am

Normally, you cannot backstab Adalon - you do get the "backstab seems to have failed message", though it is conceivable to do a lot of damage on a critical hit with the right weapon. Do you have any mods installed?

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 3:46 am

Read the battletext. You cannot backstab dragons.

Xan deVir · Post by **Xan deVir** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 4:16 am

@Sojourner
I had no mods installed, only the last tob patch and baldurdash fixpack, the only thing I can think of as a problem may be a too high character level - level 21+ assassin. before starting a new game I'll reinstall bg2 and will use the following patches/mods, please lemme know if any compatibility issues are known:

v26498 Tob patch + v26499 Beta
Baldurdash v1.12 Tob fixpack
Ascension
Return to Windspear
Imoen Relationship
David Gaider's Improved TOB battles
Improved Dragon/Mind Flayer/Beholder/Golem AI
Ishan's Insane Monsters
Edited XPLEVEL.2DA (to make my 2 person party level up slowly like a 6 person party)
Custom KIT
Edited Immie's .Cre files (to keep the bg1 tome bonuses to stats)

I know some of the mods haven't been released yet but It will take me ages to finish bg1 anyway cuz I don't have enough free time to play

. btw, are there any other mods I should try on my next run.

@Bruce Lee
I *Know* I'm not supposed to b-stab them - but I CAN!

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 4:25 am

were you using the high level ability assassinate? could be that...

now think guys, you are taking a staff orkatana to a creature the size of a boeing 747, and whacking it in the back...

so you are ACTUALLY BUTT STABBING!!!

sorry, it had to be said before I exploded...

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 4:29 am

OKay I guess things could be different in different games. It can't be assassinate either becuase it doesn't work on creatures that cant be backstabbed, but then again you could... could you please show us a screenshot? You know I am sceptic

Xan deVir · Post by **Xan deVir** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 4:39 am

@UserUnfriendly
Butt stabbing sounds cool!!!

@ Bruce Lee
about screenshots:
http://www.gamebanshee.com/forums/showt ... adid=15532

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 4:55 am

Not the best screenshot I have ever seen

Actually it may well be the worst...
Ah well I guess I'll just have to take your word for it then.

Thrar · Post by **Thrar** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 7:41 am

if u did 60 dmg with 1 hit vs adalon it was pretty sure not a backstab, but just a critical.
even valygar who only gets x3 did usually 60-70 for me in underdark, a thief gets x5, should be in the ~100 range (not to mention assassin who would b around 140 with x7).

Baldursgate Fan · Post by **Baldursgate Fan** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 8:05 am

@Xan deVir

Believe me, backstab was the first thing I tried against Firkraag when I played a thief, it didn't work!

For that to work, you need to hide in shadows - but dragons can see you. No where you can hide from them.

In lieu of a screenshot like what Bruce suggested, could you maybe attach your saved game here?

I have done everything imaginable with this game, except for backstabbing a dragon. I would like to try it for once.

Xan deVir · Post by **Xan deVir** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 8:09 am

Originally posted by Thrar
if u did 60 dmg with 1 hit vs adalon it was pretty sure not a backstab, but just a critical.
even valygar who only gets x3 did usually 60-70 for me in underdark, a thief gets x5, should be in the ~100 range (not to mention assassin who would b around 140 with x7).

when you backstab someone you see a battle text, something like this: "backstab Xable damage" and when you backstab a backstab immune creature you see "backstab seems to have failed" msg. besides that dragons are resistant to physical dmg, 25% IIRC and I've never seen my assassin dealing more than 25 non-backstab critical dmg. So I'm sure I backstabbed Adalon and I think it's beacuse of my high level, In my next game I'll level up slowly /w my edited XPLEVEL.2DA so it's no longer a problem...

Xan deVir · Post by **Xan deVir** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 8:20 am

@Baldursgate Fan
I have no saved game file nor a screenshot, I was used to backstab dragons in a multiplayer game with my friend. we finished playing about 3-4 months ago. the reason why I posted this thread is because I've seen a few times topics about backstabbing where people wrote that dragons are backstab immune... and I said WOW... I didn't know!!!

I'm gonna use CLUA to get to to that area, and shadowkeeper to create a character... the same I played... my bg2 installation is there so it should work again...

UPDATE: with the dragon improved AI installed it's impossible to get behind the dragon!!!

(I'm happy now!)

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 10:38 am

Was the dragon neutral when you backstabbed it? They see invisible characters, but maybe only when hostile. Perhaps a backstab is possible on a non hostile dragon... sounds unlikely but maybe.

Xan deVir · Post by **Xan deVir** » Fri Apr 26, 2002 10:46 am

Originally posted by Bruce Lee
Was the dragon neutral when you backstabbed it? They see invisible characters, but maybe only when hostile. Perhaps a backstab is possible on a non hostile dragon... sounds unlikely but maybe.

yeah, the dragon was neutral when I backstabbed it, but now I'm sure it was a serverside bug.