Who to take, Jaheira or Anomen

Pradeep · Post by **Pradeep** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 6:01 am

Hi,
Please help me decide whether to replace Jaheira with Anomen.

I am in chapter 3 and about to go to the graveyard district to complete the Shadow Thieves quest before heading to spellhold.

My party is as follow:
Me - Kensai/Mage - Lvl 9/13
Minsc - Lvl 12
Keldorn - Lvl 12
Nalia - Lvl 13
Jan- Lvl 11/12 will replace with Inomen (sp?)
Jaheira - Level 10/12 (cleric 12)

Should I replace Jaheira with Anomen (Cleric perspective)? I would have taken Viconia, but can't because of Keldorn. Also if I get rid of Jaheira she will be gone forever.

Your thoughts please!

Balinor

Stilgar · Post by **Stilgar** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 6:07 am

I would keep Jaheira, just for the fackt that Amonem is the most anoying NPC ion the game!

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 6:18 am

Anomen is one of the very best NPCs and, IMO, not at all annoying. He's got an attitude, so what? One drawback of having him together with Keldorn is that there is only one pair of Gauntlets of Dex (which has to go to Keldorn since he can't use a shield with Carsomyr). Anomen has a rather lousy AC without them. Still, if you give him Full Plate, a shield and the FoA along with Sling of Everard, he's equipped for going toe to toe with any bad guy. I actually prefer the Cleric spells to the Druid ones, but I know many don't. I believe this is what should decide for you. Also, depending on your sex, you can only have a romance with one of them. If you play a male, stay put with Jaheira. If you play a female, switch for Anomen.

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 6:19 am

In my own opinion I would keep Jaheira, but then I like her a lot!

You have currently two spellcaster/thieves in your party and will pick up a third with Imoen.

What I would be considering, if I had your party line up, would be to let either Nalia or Jan go if you are going to pick up Imoen (mage/thief (and a better thief!)) - it will be dependent on how you feel personally amout Nalia and whether or not you have the Fighter Stronghold to keep.

You could then wait until you get back to Athkatla to take Anomen (to replace Yoshimo - see below) on board and his quests...

But re other NPCs available - Yoshimo would be good for a LOT of exp if you take him to spellhold! And he has good thief skills. It is your own personal choice ! it will always be a juggling game until you find a line up you are happy with

Laurelei · Post by **Laurelei** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 7:16 am

Unless you have time to wait around to complete Anomen's upgrade to Knight, he's not a great cleric. I know everyone bitches about Jaheira, but some of the druid spells are just awesome, it would be hard for me to give them up.

If you want more cleric power, I would probably give up Nalia for Anomen instead. You have two mages in your character and Jan/Imoen already.

Promise · Post by **Promise** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 7:30 am

I kick Anomen out whenever I play a female PC, tolerate his annoying personality as a party member is one thing, romancing such a loser is another matter...
Anyway, I keep as many female party members as possible, I like having a lot of women around me.

Craig · Post by **Craig** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 8:37 am

Kick nalia

Zartuul · Post by **Zartuul** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 11:30 am

I agree with removing Nalia too. Imoen is better then her and you already have Jan for a backup mage, having 3 mages is redundant. Anomen can be half a fighter and a full fighter when you cast Rightemous Magic or whatever that spells is and/or Holy Power.

TheHellion · Post by **TheHellion** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 1:24 pm

I'd definitely keep Jaheira. I don't care much for Anomen, but even that aside, Jaheira is a must-have throughout the game. She's quite tankable, and Insect Plague will be your very best friend for months to come.

Before you head off to Spellhold, I would seriously consider dropping Nalia for Yoshimo. You already have a mage/thief in Jan, and Nalia's really just a toned down version of Imoen. Yoshimo's a great thief, and I think you'll find him to be extremely useful in Spellhold.

Trust me.

Pradeep · Post by **Pradeep** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 2:23 pm

Ok! I think I will keep Jaheira. I like the Insect Plague spell too (was great with the lich in the crooked crane inn) and also the summon fire elemental (worked wonders with the beholders).

However, should I really be dropping Nalia and picking up Yoshimo? I had him before and replaced him with Jan.

I like Nalia and additionally I use my Kensai/Mage to quickly cast a few spells and then jump into melee. Nalia and Jan are then my main mages.

All these decisions are driving me crazy and I have not played for the past couple of days as I refuse to go any further without a set party

Balinor

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 2:29 pm

I know everyone bitches about Jaheira, but some of the druid spells are just awesome

Too bad most are level 7 and Jaheira never sees them...

I agree with removing Nalia too. Imoen is better then her

Imoen has some puny Thief skills extra, Nalia has better Int (which is good with them being Mages and all) and a totally awesome Signet Ring. Somebody please explain to me what makes Imoen so great?

Admittedly, Nalia is an annoying whiner...

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 3:23 pm

Have you thought about changing Nalia for Aerie? That way you still got your three mages as well as a druid and a cleric. Also, you could let either Keldorn or Minsc go - You'd still have one of them left along with your Kensai/Mage and Jaheira, who also fights well.

If you tell me who of your NPCs you would never change, I'll give you a few suggestions as to the others.

[ 06-16-2001: Message edited by: Astafas ]

Yshania · Post by **Yshania** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 3:45 pm

OK! As I said, you will chop and change before you find the party right for you - but consider Yoshi for Spellhold!

as TheHellion as already agreed!

Let us know who you definitely want to keep and we can give you our opinions as to who to drop - if that is what you want us to do....

Pradeep · Post by **Pradeep** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 5:07 pm

I definitely want to keep Minsc & Keldorn.

The only thing about Aerie is her low hit points, and potential conflict with Jaheira -will one of them leave?

I also like Jaheira, but it would be nice to have some Cleric spells.

Does it make sense to drop Nalia for Yoshimo or should I drop Jan? Later replace Yoshimo with Imoen?

What other combo makes sense? My playing style is very balanced (melee & spells)!

Another factor that comes into play is that I have had Nalia and Jan memorize 6th and 7th lvl spells.

Thanks Again!
Balinor

TheHellion · Post by **TheHellion** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 6:19 pm

Originally posted by Xyx:

Too bad most are level 7 and Jaheira never sees them...

Insect Plague, Iron Skins, Conjure Fire Elemental, Heal, and Negative Plane Protection are great spells, none of which are 7th level.

Originally posted by Xyx:

Imoen has some puny Thief skills extra, Nalia has better Int (which is good with them being Mages and all) and a totally awesome Signet Ring. Somebody please explain to me what makes Imoen so great?

Both Imoen and Nalia have a 17 intelligence, so I don't know where you got this notion that Nalia is an inherently better mage. Imoen's thieving skills aren't the best, but she's quite good at finding/removing traps and picking locks, which are the two skills that having a thief is absolutely necessary for. With Kevin Dorner's bugfix patch applied, Imoen is an even better thief, since Black Isle gipped her out of a whole level's worth of thieving points. Nalia's a chump by comparison. Technical merits aside, she also happens to be your sister.

To me, at least, the roleplaying aspect matters.

Originally posted by Balinor:

I definitely want to keep Minsc & Keldorn.
The only thing about Aerie is her low hit points, and potential conflict with Jaheira -will one of them leave?

I also like Jaheira, but it would be nice to have some Cleric spells.

Does it make sense to drop Nalia for Yoshimo or should I drop Jan? Later replace Yoshimo with Imoen?

What other combo makes sense? My playing style is very balanced (melee & spells)!

Another factor that comes into play is that I have had Nalia and Jan memorize 6th and 7th lvl spells.

Thanks Again!

If you've had Aerie in your party previously, and you dropped her, then your romance with her is over, and putting her back in your party will not bring conflict with Jaheira. If you haven't had her in your party, then she and Jaheira will be at odds, and you'll ultimately have to decide between the two. Regardless of who you choose, the other will remain in your party as a friend, though the romance will be over.

You could drop either Nalia or Jan--it's up to you--but definitely pick up Yoshimo. Just do it.

You'll be glad you did. In Spellhold, pick up Imoen.

Cleric-wise, you can also drop either Nalia or Jan for Aerie or Anomen. Aerie's got some nice spell combinations, and you can alleviate her low hit points by either keeping her out of melee, setting the difficulty to normal so you automatically roll max hit points, or give her something like the Girdle of Fortitude. Low hit points for a spell caster isn't all that serious, as long as you can get them above 60. That way, they're not vulnerable to those annoying Power Word spells that you encounter late in the game. Anomen, of course, makes a servicable cleric. It's all a matter of preference.

[ 06-16-2001: Message edited by: TheHellion ]

C Elegans · Post by **C Elegans** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 7:51 pm

Here are my suggestions:

You are a kensai/mage, and you want to keep Keldorn and Minsc. You are going to pick up Imoen later, thus you'll have another mage and a mediocre thief then. You should definitely pick up Yoshimo before you go to Spellhold.

I would suggest you give Anomen and Jaheira the other 2 places in your party. In a choice between the two of them, I'd pick Anomen, since he can cast all cleric spells and be a very good fighter with the Sling of Everard. Jaheira will never become such a good fighter, and the only useful spell she has that Anomen lacks, is Insect plague.

Still, I prefer Jaheira far above Jan, Nalia or Aerie. You don't need Nalia since you're a mage yourself and Imoen is too. Aerie has very few HP and will not get the higher level spells neither as cleric nor mage. Jan is not a very good thief, and it's annoying that his INT makes him fail a lot when scribing spells, you have to boost him with potions. He's a funny character, though.

Conclusion: I'd go for both Jaheira and Anomen and drop Jan and Nalia.

ReignsOfPower · Post by **ReignsOfPower** » Sat Jun 16, 2001 8:02 pm

If you want a Cleric, keep Jahiera, although shes not a good one anyways.

I prefer Anohmen because I have Aerie in my party and she is my cleric backup for Anohmen's lack in clerical abilities.

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Sun Jun 17, 2001 1:56 am

Both Imoen and Nalia have a 17 intelligence

Oops, you're right! I had this strange notion of Imoen having Int 16... Wouldn't make sense, though, because that's too low for dualling. Thanks!

The only thing about Aerie is her low hit points

Get Aerie to join before you are level 9. That way you'll get the level 7 Aerie, otherwise she'll be level 9 or higher. If you get her at level 7 and set the difficulty to Normal, she'll get better Hit Point rolls when she levels up.

fable · Post by **fable** » Sun Jun 17, 2001 2:01 am

I'd toss out Nalia, and put in Anomen. Just my POV, but you need a good cleric, rather than another mage. This will give your group enough variety and skill to cope with a lot of challenges: Anomen to turn undead and cast clerical spells, for instance, Jaheira to throw those Insect Plagues that hit all opponents, Jan for your thieving needs, etc.

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Sun Jun 17, 2001 3:21 am

OK, after a good night's sleep, here is my suggestion. I've tried to make a strong and well balanced party:

1) Kensai/Mage: Equipped with Celestial Fury and Dakkon's blade - hit them fast and hard! An alternativ would be a shield (lower AC) and why not a long sword (there are plenty of good ones)? Robe of Vecna and Bracers of Def AC 3.

2) Keldorn: Carsomyr, of course. His own armor and the Gauntlets of Dex.

3) Minsc: Dual-wielding FoA (one of the very best weapons and will be further iproved in ToB) and Defender of Easthaven (actually a + 3 weapon, with a + 1 bonus to AC. You need to deliver some blunt damage, too, since some monsters are immune to slashing and piercing damage. Give him the Red Dragon Scale with a Ring of Protection (or similiar) to compensate for the loss of shield.

4) Jan: You need a thief and Jan is the best after Yoshimo. He also doubles as a mage (levels up lower than Nalia and Imoen, but gets an extra spell per level) and has extra high thief skills thanks to his personal gear. He still advances in thief skills (which is not the case with Nalia and Imoen) and will therefor be more than enough for ToB. It's not worth it having a pure thief take up one place in your party and Jan also provides extremely funny conversations with Minsc and Keldorn. Any of the short sword, start with Aarbane's, and the Light Cross Bow of Speed.

5) Jaheira: Don't miss the druid spells or the romance. Spear of Kuldahar (later Impaler) together with Boomerang Dagger (later Firetooth).

You could go with Cernd instead - a matter of personal preference; I like them both.
6) Aerie: You get a third mage (always handy) as well as those cleric spells. Equip her with the Staff of Magi. That way, she'll always be able to retreat when it gets too hot and her low HP won't be a problem. It's actually very good to have a NPC with both cleric and mage spells that is more or less untouchable - you never know what you'll need. Also give her the Sling of Everard. Robe of Good Archmagi - expensive but looks really good.

The alternative would be to use Sir Anomen instead. Better at turning undead, more HPs, better Strength and THAC0... However, no mage spells and worse AC then Aerie. Equip him with Crom Fayer, a shield and the Sling of Everard. The Staff of Magi goes to Jan since it is possible to backstab with it and then immediately go invisible. Also good to be invisible when detecting traps.