ToB With Only 1 Mage - Recommended?

ElvenKing · Post by **ElvenKing** » Wed Nov 06, 2002 9:15 am

I plan on running a fairly balanced, traditional party through SoA that comprises of:

CG - PC Stalker
LG - Keldorn
LN - Anomen
TN - Jaheira
CN - Jan
NG - Imoen

However, once I hit the pocket plane I intend to pick up Sarevok for both the plot enhancement and the melee power. Which would give me this:

CG - Stalker
CE - Sarevok
LG - Keldorn
LG - Anomen
TN - Jaheira
NG - Imoen

My problem is who do I drop? Ideally, I would like to drop Jan but this would leave me with only 1 magic user. Will I run into problems with this? I'm not as worried about the thieving skills since there are items that would boost Imoen's abilities. Or has this party become way too melee heavy?
I realize there is no perfect party, I'm just looking for a well-balanced party with good interactions.
Your thoughts would be much appreciated!

ElvenKing

jcompton · Post by **jcompton** » Wed Nov 06, 2002 9:53 am

On the whole, melee rules in TOB. It's basically all about how many Greater Whirlwinds you can employ.

So yes, a single mage party should be sufficient.

serjeLeBlade · Post by **serjeLeBlade** » Wed Nov 06, 2002 10:00 am

Ahem... You may not care about thieving skills...
Don't you care about Spike Traps and Use Any Item, either?

Mho...
Sarevok and Keldorn's abilities are somewhat similar...
(Plus I don't think they would be eager to be in the same party anyway)...

ElvenKing · Post by **ElvenKing** » Wed Nov 06, 2002 12:20 pm

I agree about Keldorn and Sarevok being similar - however I feel Sarevok is essential from a plot perspective and for Keldorn I think his character is fantastic plus there are some serious paladin only items that are too good to pass up on. Since I am unwilling to play one myself Keldorn is the next best thing. I guess I could go with the following party:

CG - Stalker
CE - Sarevok
LG - Keldorn
TN - Jaheira
LG - Aerie
NG - Imoen

Which would give me more mage power. However, I lose Anomen's high level cleric spells/turning plus a NPC who is perfect for tanking up with the good blunt weapons (Crom Faeyr, Flail of Ages, etc.) and various shields.
All these choices are driving me crazy...

ElvenKing

dios · Post by **dios** » Wed Nov 06, 2002 3:51 pm

IMHO let Keldorn go away...sarewok is just so much better...=) IMHO that is.

Or just throw out your stalker thats the best alternative =)

Koveras · Post by **Koveras** » Wed Nov 06, 2002 6:50 pm

I agree with the others to boot Keldorn. THe paladin only items are powerful but a mage casting spells is just as if not more powerful than those items. I have seen many balanced parties, and they seem to have 3 frontline tanks, a cleric, a druid, and a mage. Of course there'll be muti and duals involved. I'm posting this since you said you wnated a balanced party.

ElvenKing · Post by **ElvenKing** » Thu Nov 07, 2002 8:57 am

So you're saying that once I get to the Abyssal Fortress I should go with the following?

CG - Stalker
CE - Sarevok
LG - Anomen
TN - Jaheira
CN - Jan
NG - Imoen

Do I have enough tanking power? I prefer melee over casters, but there are some pretty nasty fights in Ascension...
Between Jan and Keldorn, who would you say has the better interactions throughout ToB? In SoA I would say Jan wins hands down, but which NPC's had alot of interaction in the expansion?

ElvenKing

serjeLeBlade · Post by **serjeLeBlade** » Thu Nov 07, 2002 9:29 am

You have four fighter-types there (four characters capable of Whirlwinding I mean...)
So I would say yes, tanks are enough...
And remember that Jan will eventually be able to use the Paladin Bracers as Keldorn would... but he will be able to use, say, the bard gloves too (which you wouldn't be able to use at all otherwise)...
I can't stand the idea of finding all these nifty ToB items (shiny ones, anyone?)

and not being able to use all of them... but that's only me, obviously

(Otoh, I don't know about Keldorn banters in ToB... Never brought him along, sorry!)

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Thu Nov 07, 2002 3:20 pm

You will be fine either way really. Imoen as a mage is plenty... I would say that you would miss Jans thieving skills more than his spells.

Nightmare · Post by **Nightmare** » Thu Nov 07, 2002 9:23 pm

Mages are nice in ToB, but melee rules. Mages are good in some fights for pretty much Time Stop + Improved Alcrity, then Horrid Wilt them to death. But, with one mage you should be fine.

I'd keep Keldorn. Personally, he is my favourite NPC, and I'd keep him for the ToB ending. He and Sarevok have some good chats, and both can decimate everything in melee.

I'd actually say drop Jaheira for Sarevok, and keep Jan.

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Nov 07, 2002 9:37 pm

JCompton put it well. Mages are given the edge, IMO, in SoA, but the tougher opponents you find in ToB often have enormous innate magical resistance. Melee is the way to go, so either trade off Jan or Imoen. Given the magical booster items you'll find, either will do well in a ToB party.

Littiz · Post by **Littiz** » Fri Nov 08, 2002 3:09 am

???
ToB adds quest spells buddies...
And 9th level spells, which you could cast only from scrolls in SoA..

Why bother meleeing every single opponent, when you can take them
all at once?

MR isn't a problem, there are counters for that, add that many
high level spells simply bypass MR...
My easiest run through ToB was with Tashia

serjeLeBlade · Post by **serjeLeBlade** » Fri Nov 08, 2002 7:35 am

Originally posted by Gaxx_Firkraag
I'd actually say drop Jaheira for Sarevok, and keep Jan.

This is a point.
I was assuming that Jaheira was ElvenKing's romance, but otherwise, she can definitely go.
She's nowhere as useful as Sarevok, Keldorn or Jan in ToB. Being a multiclass druid becomes VERY annoying, when you need 3,000,000 xp (read "6,000,000") just to get to level 15.

fable · Post by **fable** » Fri Nov 08, 2002 9:53 am

Why bother meleeing every single opponent, when you can take them all at once?

Because in ToB, there are quite a few creatures you can't even take singly with magic. Simply put, magic matters less in ToB than it did in SoA, despite the new spells.

Littiz · Post by **Littiz** » Fri Nov 08, 2002 11:16 am

I think you're wrong, @Fable. In SoA, often you don't have enough
spells, and HAVE to do some melee.
In ToB, you can literally rely COMPLETELY on spells, if you want.
The only creatures whom I remember to be completely immune to magic
are Magic Golems... and even there, you could just summon some low
level monster with normal weapons.

The rest of ToB enemies fall easily to magic, some need only a careful
choice of spells.
I encountered no opposition whatsoever with Tashia in my party!
(that's why with Kelsey I'm learning all low-usage spells this time...)

But if you speak about personal tastes, I won't argue

Leonardo · Post by **Leonardo** » Fri Nov 08, 2002 1:06 pm

Just one mage will make it harder, even more if you have The Ascension installed. I've found it much easier when I had Kelsey, Tashia and Jan in the party than when I had just Edwin.
But of course, if it can be solo'ed by a mage it can be done with one mage plus a party.

UserUnfriendly · Post by **UserUnfriendly** » Fri Nov 08, 2002 6:29 pm

the first time i ran thru soa, tob, i used a standard sorc...

the party just stood around shooting stuff while my summons and planetars did the work...

its the summons, and dragon breaths that are the real killers....

Baldursgate Fan · Post by **Baldursgate Fan** » Sat Nov 09, 2002 1:49 pm

I have to agree with User.

My last SOA/ TOB with 3 sorcs (Bun Bun, Tashia, Kelsey), Solufein, Mazzy and Sarevok wiped the floor with Melissa and the other end-bosses very easily.

Summons rule.

VonDondu · Post by **VonDondu** » Fri Nov 15, 2002 6:59 am

Instead of replacing Jan with Sarevok, I'd replace the Stalker with a Ranger/Cleric. But that's just me.

Jan has better dialogue in Throne of Bhaal than Keldorn or just about anybody else, which shouldn't surprise anybody. (I'm not including any MODs in that comparison.)

You can successfully complete Throne of Bhaal on the Core Rules setting with only one Mage, but only if the Mage can advance far enough and fast enough. In other words, if you have only one Mage, you shouldn't have more than three members in your party. I once played Throne of Bhaal with only two characters, a Ranger/Cleric and a modified Imoen (9th Level Thief dualled to a Conjurer). When I got to the last chapter, I realized that I needed another Fighter, so I restarted the game and recruited Sarevok. It was great from a practical standpoint as well as a role-playing standpoint: My Three Bhaalspawn against The Five. Playing BG1/BG2/ToB with just my main character and Imoen and then, later, Sarevok brought the story full-circle, especially with the Ascension MOD installed. The bond between my characters was just incredible, and it gave new significance to Tamoko.

Again, I want to emphasize that Imoen could handle Mage duties by herself in my game only because she was higher in level than she would have been if I'd had six people in the party. If you have six people in your party, I suggest that you include two Mages or more.

Having both Anomen and Jaheira is a little redundant. With a Stalker, and Inquisitor, a Deathbringer, and a Fighter/Druid, I think you could live without Anomen, but it's a tough call. If Aerie can advance far enough, she'll be formidible, and she might be just what you need. Imoen would be your primary spellcaster and Aerie would give her support with lower-level spells, in addition to Aerie's Cleric duties.

Bruce Lee · Post by **Bruce Lee** » Fri Nov 15, 2002 9:15 am

I just have to say that although I like mages ToB is very easy with a full party evenn if you dont have a mage.
I believe that the first time you play through ToB it is easier with a party with almost only fighters. Atleast there will be fewer reloads IMO.