Question

Tsunami · Post by **Tsunami** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 6:04 pm

Whats the best class to multi a rouge to? If u want a fighet kinda rouge with dual wield etz.

fable · Post by **fable** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 7:05 pm

Originally posted by Tsunami
Whats the best class to multi a rouge to? If u want a fighet kinda rouge with dual wield etz.

I've never applied any rouge to anything that fidgets. In my experience, if it's going to move about a lot the rouge is going to go flying all over the place, and you're better off using a small hammer to stun the creature, first.

KidD01 · Post by **KidD01** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 7:19 pm

@fable : small hammer ?

fable · Post by **fable** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 8:02 pm

Originally posted by KidD01
@fable : small hammer ?

Well, it depends on the size of the fidgetting creature, and how much it fidgets. If it fidgets a lot, a large hammer will cover more territory, but then you take into account the loss of rounds per turn in wielding the weapon. A smaller hammer requires more dexterity, but you can use it a lot more often, and still avoid splattering rouge.

Krysalyn · Post by **Krysalyn** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 9:11 pm

hmmm, maybe the poster meant "rogue" instead...

fable · Post by **fable** » Sat Jan 11, 2003 9:12 pm

Originally posted by Krysalyn
hmmm, maybe the poster meant "rogue" instead...

Ooooh, sure! Next you're going to tell me that he meant "fighter" instead of fidget. Right, as if I'm going to believe that!

Bloodstalker · Post by **Bloodstalker** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 12:00 am

A ranger works well with a rogue. A level of ranger gives you the dueal wield capabilities and since for the most part my rogues don't were anything more than light armor, it works pretty good.

Of course, I don't see that much benefit with my playing style, since my rogues main attack is with ranged weapons.

Jaesha · Post by **Jaesha** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 4:08 am

ROFLMAO Fable, you fidgeridoo!

Gruntboy · Post by **Gruntboy** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 10:41 am

Now, now fable, there's no need to be patronising to people with lesser keyboard skills.

fable · Post by **fable** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 12:00 pm

Originally posted by Gruntboy
Now, now fable, there's no need to be patronising to people with lesser keyboard skills.

Actually, his typewriting skills look fine. He substitutes letters regularly and accurately when he wants to, like "etz" for "etc," and does other, similar fad stuff.

But since you put it so nicely, @Grunt...

Human thief, add a level of ranger, get your dual-wielding automatically. Once you hit around level 13 or so with a rogue, switch to fighter because you'll have maxed out on trap difficulty. Very powerful combination with sneak attacks.

Krysalyn · Post by **Krysalyn** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 12:31 pm

Originally posted by fable
Human thief, add a level of ranger, get your dual-wielding automatically. Once you hit around level 13 or so with a rogue, switch to fighter because you'll have maxed out on trap difficulty. Very powerful combination with sneak attacks.

that is better than sticking with rogue levels only?

I realize that a lot depends on the build of the rest of your party, but please try to evaluate the following based on: hit points, skill pts, feats, special abilities/class benefits...

rngr1/roguexx

roguexx/ftr4

rngr3/roguexx/ftr4

the first lvl of rngr gives you free ambidex and dual wield, plus a few extra hit points... the 4 levels of ftr gives you weapon specialization, plus extra hit points... progressing further in rogue gives you an additional 1d6 sneak attack dmg every 2 lvls...

now, I am considering mainly a scout/assassin rogue with these builds. I would like to dual wield 2 short swords, likely scouting and then sneak attacking the opposing mage or strongest opponent. what is the best build, trying to ignore the other members of the party? (which is why I asked to try to consider hit pts, skills, feats, specials only)

the rngr3/ftr4 is only to avoid multiclass exp penalty...

fable · Post by **fable** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 12:40 pm

Sure, you can continue on the rogue path (with 1 ranger level), but the benefits decrease. Weigh the advantages the fighter gets (especially those nice presents that come their way every 2 levels), vs those of a thief. There's not much contest.

What's your party makeup?

Krysalyn · Post by **Krysalyn** » Mon Jan 13, 2003 7:53 am

Originally posted by fable
Sure, you can continue on the rogue path (with 1 ranger level), but the benefits decrease. Weigh the advantages the fighter gets (especially those nice presents that come their way every 2 levels), vs those of a thief. There's not much contest.

What's your party makeup?

yes, but the problem lies in the fact that once you go to 3 classes, two of them have to always be within one level of one another... if you choose a race that favors rogue, than ranger and fighter levels always have to be within one of each other...

so for me, I think the choice comes down to either taking one level of ranger, and getting ambidex and dual wield for free, and then the rest of the levels are in rogue, or taking 4 levels of fighter to get weapon specialization and "buying" the ambidex and dual wield, while also getting weapon specialization available to me... plus that will give me the option of continuing to progress in fighter levels if I want to turn the rogue into more of a tank than a sneak attack char...

but, the concern I have is that the rulebook says that rogues get an additional 1d6 of sneak attack dmg every 2 levels of rogue... that seems like it could add up quite a bit down the road, being an assassin or mage killer, especially when dual wielding two short swords... it seems like it would be better for this type of char (sneak attack expert) to continue in rogue levels rather than fighter levels...

what is the difference in feats and skill pts gained per level between rogue and fighter?

fable · Post by **fable** » Mon Jan 13, 2003 8:45 am

Originally posted by Krysalyn
so for me, I think the choice comes down to either taking one level of ranger, and getting ambidex and dual wield for free, and then the rest of the levels are in rogue, or taking 4 levels of fighter to get weapon specialization and "buying" the ambidex and dual wield, while also getting weapon specialization available to me... plus that will give me the option of continuing to progress in fighter levels if I want to turn the rogue into more of a tank than a sneak attack char...

Which is what I meant to suggest, above. Fighters simply offer you the tempting tray of feats much more regularly than any other class; and what thief could or should resist a sneak attack that also invokes Dirty Fighting? That said...

but, the concern I have is that the rulebook says that rogues get an additional 1d6 of sneak attack dmg every 2 levels of rogue...

This is true. The problem I found lay in enemies later in the game, whose own choice of feats and skills pretty much negated my thief's sneak attacks much of the time. Rather than bet on the sneak attack, putting all my money on this advantage, I prefer spreading out my bet with other, more direct fighter feats that weren't negated by the loss of an element of surprise.