Hints for playing with Bard as PC?

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Thu May 15, 2003 8:39 pm

I beat the game last month with a Paladin character. At this point, I was just wondering if any could offer some good tips on playing with a bard, such as good equipment, spells etc.

My current ideas would be

1) Proficient in Blunt and Missile weapons (for Ashideena and the Light Crossbow of Speed), and Large Sword later on

2) Wear Bracers, Cha-improving Cloak, etc.

3) Have plenty of Armor, Shield, Magic Missile, and Chromatic Orb spells handy.

4) Use Minsc and Khalid as primary "infantry" (IOW, used as frontline offense/defence, tanked up)

Now for my questions.

1) What's a good way to employ the Bard song ability?

2) Will i need to be invisible (a la spell/potion) for my bard's pick-pocketing ability to work well enough, or can I rob some NPCs blind (w/o invisibility) if the skill is high enough? (I've got 18 Dex to start out)

3) Are these stats good enough?

15 Str
18 Dex
17 Con
18 Int
10 Wis
18 Cha

Well, how am I doing?

Sojourner · Post by **Sojourner** » Thu May 15, 2003 10:27 pm

I'd recommend getting the Shield Amulet ASAP - to free up spell slots for magic missile. Keep your bard out of melee - for closer range, consider using darts, especially when you get your hands on darts of stunning.

1) Use the bard song in battle - you can play, fire off a spell, then go back to playing.

2) No - pickpocketing only requires a high enough skill - use those potions of Master Thievery.

3) Those stats are really good.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Fri May 16, 2003 6:54 am

Originally posted by Sojourner
I'd recommend getting the Shield Amulet ASAP - to free up spell slots for magic missile. Keep your bard out of melee - for closer range, consider using darts, especially when you get your hands on darts of stunning.

1) Use the bard song in battle - you can play, fire off a spell, then go back to playing.

2) No - pickpocketing only requires a high enough skill - use those potions of Master Thievery.

3) Those stats are really good.

Thanks for your help, Sojourner. Having read many of your posts in the pasts (when I used to lurk for info), I thought you'd turn up sooner or later.

Hmmmm.... shield amulet. I've gotten that a couple of times. I wonder where. *strokes beard and thinks; Daevaron, the Iron Throne, and Durlag's Tower come to mind*

Identify doesn't seem that necessary with the amount of lore that bards have with. Besides, by the time mine's at max level, and all tomed up, he'll make Dynaheir look like she needs to bump her education up a notch!

Sojourner · Post by **Sojourner** » Fri May 16, 2003 7:09 am

You can buy the Shield Amulet at the Nashkel Fair - I forget how many charges it has initially.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Fri May 16, 2003 7:41 am

Originally posted by Sojourner
You can buy the Shield Amulet at the Nashkel Fair - I forget how many charges it has initially.

Well, yeah, you can buy it there, but I swear I won that in some battle with an enemy that was important in a quest. I know that the CLOAK of the shield is in the last level of Durlag's tower before the Demonknight, so it was somewhere else.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Tue May 20, 2003 8:11 pm

Hints for BG2 as well

Well, I was wondering if you could also help me, in this case with advice when I get this bard into BG2 - equipment and everything else.

1) I think he'd be best as a Skald, with the bonuses it gets to its attacks (and AC, I believe?).

2) Definitely keep the Melodic Chain from the Bard Stronghold.

Any other advice?

Sojourner · Post by **Sojourner** » Wed May 21, 2003 8:08 am

Depends - do you have ToB?

Coot · Post by **Coot** » Wed May 21, 2003 9:54 am

A skald is good, but I had a lot of fun with my blade.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Wed May 21, 2003 10:32 am

Originally posted by Sojourner
Depends - do you have ToB?

Yeah. The only thing is, I don't plan to use the HLA 'Use Any Item', mainly because it sounds like it makes him cheap. Besides, you only get a certain amount of them throughout ToB.

Thufir Hawat · Post by **Thufir Hawat** » Wed May 21, 2003 1:24 pm

Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
Yeah. The only thing is, I don't plan to use the HLA 'Use Any Item', mainly because it sounds like it makes him cheap. Besides, you only get a certain amount of them throughout ToB.

I do not believe that Sojourner was asking about ToB because of the UAI ability. If you plan on taking a bard into ToB, I would not suggest a skald. Their main strength is in their bard song, and any regular bard can use the HLA 'Improved Bard Song', which is just as good as the skald's song. The skald essentially becomes useless, because any character bard could have that same amazing bard song. I recommend a blade, which still gets the great song (although at a higher level), and a couple other cool other innates thrown in there, like offensive and defensive spins.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Wed May 21, 2003 9:03 pm

Hmmmm...

Originally posted by Thufir Hawat
I do not believe that Sojourner was asking about ToB because of the UAI ability. If you plan on taking a bard into ToB, I would not suggest a skald. Their main strength is in their bard song, and any regular bard can use the HLA 'Improved Bard Song', which is just as good as the skald's song. The skald essentially becomes useless, because any character bard could have that same amazing bard song. I recommend a blade, which still gets the great song (although at a higher level), and a couple other cool other innates thrown in there, like offensive and defensive spins.

Okay, point taken. I just thought the "Single Weapon Style" would work out better (for the extra point to AC). What would be some good ideas for dual-wielding in SoA and ToB with a Blade? Let's say, for instance, I have proficiency in Long Sword, Flail, and Bastard Sword, along with *** in 2-Weapon Fighting? I'm getting curious.

Of course, that could mean Foebane and Angurvadal (Fire Giant Strength and more, after all) in ToB. Good idea? Also, what did the Imp. Bard Song give for abilities in comparison and contrast to the Skald Bard song, and what did the normal and Blade normal songs do? I head normal bards only gave a plus to luck rolls when the song was activated, so what about Blades?

Thufir Hawat · Post by **Thufir Hawat** » Thu May 22, 2003 5:08 pm

Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
What would be some good ideas for dual-wielding in SoA and ToB with a Blade? Let's say, for instance, I have proficiency in Long Sword, Flail, and Bastard Sword, along with *** in 2-Weapon Fighting? I'm getting curious. Of course, that could mean Foebane and Angurvadal (Fire Giant Strength and more, after all) in ToB. Good idea?

Although ToB is not my specialty, if you plan on taking a blade, I highly suggest you duel-wield (***). For weapons, I definately suggest long swords for Angurvadal. For a second weapons, I would not go for flails. I would probably take scimitars, for Belm in SoA (extra attack/round is very useful), and later Spectral Brand +5 in ToB (I personally prefer it to foebane, but it is really just a matter of preference).

Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
Also, what did the Imp. Bard Song give for abilities in comparison and contrast to the Skald Bard song, and what did the normal and Blade normal songs do? I head normal bards only gave a plus to luck rolls when the song was activated, so what about Blades?

The blade gets a song just like the vanilla bard does - I believe it gives the same bonuses as the mage spell 'Luck'. The skald song gives you, at 20th level, +4 to hit, +4 to damage, and -4 to Armor class for your entire party, along with immmunity to fear, stun, and confusion. The enhanced bard song gives the bard himself -10 to armor class and 10% magic resistance, along with giving the party 4 to hit, +4 to damage, and -4 to Armor class, immmunity to fear, stun, confusion, 5% magic resistance, and immunity to all normal weapons. The Enhanced Bard Song HLA is obvoiusly the superior song.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Fri May 23, 2003 5:18 am

Originally posted by Thufir Hawat
Although ToB is not my specialty, if you plan on taking a blade, I highly suggest you duel-wield (***). For weapons, I definately suggest long swords for Angurvadal. For a second weapons, I would not go for flails. I would probably take scimitars, for Belm in SoA (extra attack/round is very useful), and later Spectral Brand +5 in ToB (I personally prefer it to foebane, but it is really just a matter of preference).

The blade gets a song just like the vanilla bard does - I believe it gives the same bonuses as the mage spell 'Luck'. The skald song gives you, at 20th level, +4 to hit, +4 to damage, and -4 to Armor class for your entire party, along with immmunity to fear, stun, and confusion. The enhanced bard song gives the bard himself -10 to armor class and 10% magic resistance, along with giving the party 4 to hit, +4 to damage, and -4 to Armor class, immmunity to fear, stun, confusion, 5% magic resistance, and immunity to all normal weapons. The Enhanced Bard Song HLA is obvoiusly the superior song.

Well, if you ask me, a Skald who gets that just gets better if you give him that in ToB. I'm still debating.

This is what I'm playing for a party:

SoA:
PC (Human NG Bard)
Minsc
Anomen
Jaheira
Imoen
Aerie (romance, I guess)

For ToB, I'll switch Jaheira for Sarevok. To tell the truth, that's about the same crew I use every time, and it just works out the best. I have 2 Warrior-Priests (Anomen and Jaheira) that fight and heal, 1 straight-out fighter, 2 that cast mage spells (though I may narrow it down since my main character will be casting spells as well).

Would you suggest that this party set needs a little tweaking? I just use Imoen because she doesn't start to get repetetive(sorry Jan, but CN and NG don't mix that well for me) and needy of their initial equipment to be a good thief. Besides, there are rings, a pair of gloves, potions, and an amulet in ToB that will help w/ her thieving skills. Not too bad, eh? I just about played through ToB with the party mentioned above, but with a Paladin with lack-luster stats a few years ago.

Skuld · Post by **Skuld** » Fri May 23, 2003 6:16 am

Well I've noticed that your bard has 17 Con, and non-fighter types don't get bonuses for Con above 16. So you might wanna take that into consideration even though it is a small matter. And the Shield amulet is a must.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Fri May 23, 2003 6:31 am

Originally posted by Skuld
Well I've noticed that your bard has 17 Con, and non-fighter types don't get bonuses for Con above 16. So you might wanna take that into consideration even though it is a small matter. And the Shield amulet is a must.

Yeah, I was sort-of aware of that. I just thougth it would be a good precaution anyway. I did want to go for 17 Str, but the only option I have now is to roll a new bard until my eyes bleed. I'm fortunate to have one with such stats anyway. He's going to fair better than my Gnome Cleric Illusionist I have in store. The Gnome only needed to have a bit higher strength, or I'd be trying him instead. I just wanted to see what it would be like to have a multi-class fighter mage with 20 to both Int and Wis.

As somewhat of an aside, what are the best Multi-Classes of all, considering race and all? I would guess Fighter/Cleric for Dwarf, Fighter/Mage for Elf, no choice but Fighter/Thief for Halfling, but what for Half-Elf and Gnome?

Skuld · Post by **Skuld** » Fri May 23, 2003 6:44 am

For the Gnome try a Cleric/Illusionist, Illusionist/Thief, or Cleric/Thief. As for the half-elf i'm not sure what's left to do.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Fri May 23, 2003 7:08 am

Originally posted by Skuld
For the Gnome try a Cleric/Illusionist, Illusionist/Thief, or Cleric/Thief. As for the half-elf i'm not sure what's left to do.

Yeah, I thought as much for Gnomes. Half-Elves would probably be best as Fighter/Druids or Cleric/Rangers. Here are some of the characters I have in character files:

Reffrin
Lawful Good
Gnome
Male
Cleric/Illusionist
11 Str (too low of SoA, definitely)
16 Dex
16 Con
19 Int
17 Wis
17 Cha

I was hoping that the Str could have been higher, so that he could use the Flail of Ages right from the get-go.

Daetheron
Neutral Good
Elf
Male
Ranger
18/71 Str
19 Dex
17 Con
10 Int
15 Wis
17 Cha

Mainly for use of Bows, so he would probably either be a vanilla Ranger in BG2 or maybe an Archer.

Brughardt
Lawful Good
Dwarf
Male
Fighter/Cleric
18/61 Str
12 Dex
19 Con
12 Int
17 Wis
16 Cha

This one would work. If only his strength were at /91 or higher.

Frahnkeg
Neutral Good
Dwarf
Male
Fighter
18/83 Str
17 Dex
19 Con
10 Int
7 Wis (won't help in a part of Sahuagin city in SoA, of course)
16 Cha

Relligar
Lawful Good
Dwarf (see a connection to my interests?

)
Male
Cleric
16 Str
10 Dex
19 Con
10 Int
17 Wis
16 Cha

I just have so many ideas, and so little time for the implimentation of all of them. *sigh*

Thufir Hawat · Post by **Thufir Hawat** » Fri May 23, 2003 11:12 am

Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
Well, if you ask me, a Skald who gets that just gets better if you give him that in ToB. I'm still debating.

That is not really the point...every bard in ToB gets the enhanced bard song, not only the skald. So, a blade could have an even better song than the skald, therefore eliminating the skalds only advantage over him. With a blade, you can have just as good a song, along with special abilities like Offensive and Defensive Spin. Although the choice is up to you, I highly recommend you take a Blade over a Skald.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Wed May 28, 2003 11:26 am

My progress so far (some spoilers abound for beginners, inc. treasure location)

Well, right I am in Chpt. 3, and am helping Minsc rescue Dynaheir. The interesting thing is that I actually got about 3 (or was it 5?) +2 arrows from some Kobold raiding party as I was making my way out of the mines! OMG, this guy is pretty cool, also since his lore and spell slot (which I use for identify has also helped save money on identifying items by about 60% so far. Yay!

These Xvarts have been a bit of pain as I'm on my to save Dynaheir. They're everywhere!

Minsc, Khalid, and Jaheira have been able to really take them down, but they just keep coming! I'm fortunate to have been able to kill some cave bear and get those bracers for Xan. We're not getting totally clobbered, but it's annoying. This my party so far:

PC: Lvl 2 Bard

Minsc: Lvl 2 Ranger

Khalid: Lvl 1 Fighter

Jaheira: Lvl 2/2 Fighter/Druid

Imoen: Lvl 2 Thief

Xan: Lvl 2 Enchanter (Thank goodness for that moonblade! Soon to be replaced by Dynaheir, though)

How am I doing so far?

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Fri Jun 06, 2003 10:41 am

Yeah, since my Bard has such a high Pick Pockets skill, I guess I don't have to worry about making Imoen put points in the same skill.

Not that I've had too much of a problem with that in my game with a Paladin, but she will have more skill points put into Open Locks, Detect Traps, and Stealth. This way, with the Stealth-enhancing equipment, she'll be a lean, mean backstabbing machine!

Well, somewhat off topic, what people are really good for pickpocketing in this game?

I already know of:

- Algernon (definitely necessary for up to Chpt. 5)

- Shandalar (a couple good items on him)

Who else?