About Sarevok

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Tue May 20, 2003 12:14 pm

1) If you look at his portrait, he has glowing golden eyes, and markings on his forehead. Is he an Aasimar? I know in 3rd Edition D&D (actually, in Icewind Dale 2), they are mentioned as to having those color eyes, and birthmarks depicting the god/deity that sired them. Of course, the mark could be tatoos, and those eyes could be from he slaying other Bhaalspawn in the past and coming closer to reincarnating Bhaal through his body.

2) Are there any descriptions of his other former equipment? I heard he wore what was called 'Demon Mail' or 'Demon Plate' for armor. Is that true? What about his helmet? Too bad that doesn't appear to be available through a mod, or either Deirdre or Joluv. Then again, they could become cheese material.

I just thought I'd ask because they've peculiarized me for quite a while.

VonDondu · Post by **VonDondu** » Tue May 20, 2003 12:36 pm

1) I think the reason why his eyes glow (other than the fact that it makes him look cool)

is because he's been brought back from the dead.

2) The Sword of Chaos +2 that the genie gives you in Chapter One was Sarevok's sword. It doesn't seem very impressive, but as the description says, much of its power died with Sarevok.

When you bring Sarevok back to life, he says, "...my sword and armor have not appeared. No matter. Without the Bhaal essence to channel their powers, they are of little use. I shall make do without them, as I once did." Frankly, I can't think of a reason why they would appear out of thin air, unless their essence was bonded to Sarevok's essence. You can hand his sword to him, though, if you still have it in your inventory. The Ascension MOD for Throne of Bhaal lets you restore the sword to some of its former glory if you give it to Sarevok. Only Sarevok can wield it because it is a Deathbringer weapon and only a Deathbringer can wield it properly. The sword was forged specifically for Sarevok to help him channel his powers. Now that his "taint" is gone, the sword is not as powerful as it was before, but it's still a pretty good weapon. (+4 Two-Handed Sword, damage 1-10+4, wielder gets 10% magic resistance and receives 1-5 hit points per hit.)

I don't really understand the story behind Sarevok's armor. I read somewhere that he was trying to assume the form of one of Bhaal's avatars, but I'm not sure whether that means that he summoned it out of thin air using his Bhaalspawn powers or whether he had someone forge it for him to help him channel his powers. As far as I know, the helm goes with the armor, and it is considered part of the armor.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Tue May 20, 2003 12:51 pm

1) Well, if you notice his eyes in the intro cinematic for BG1, his eyes have that glow to them.

2) I did know about the whole Ascension sword thing, to the truth. I remember the whole dialogue about the sword/armor thing. There just sounded like someone would have some more insight into the matter.

By the way, I do have the Original Saga for Baldur's Gate since my the first disc of my original copy accidentally got broken. I ran over it with my computer chair about a year ago.

With it, I got a limited edition lithograph of Sarevok as well.

I just have to admit, the guy seems pretty cool looking and sounding overall.

kopywrite · Post by **kopywrite** » Wed May 21, 2003 12:11 pm

Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
1) Well, if you notice his eyes in the intro cinematic for BG1, his eyes have that glow to them.

Always wondered about that too...I suppose it was merely an aesthtic thing given to him to enhance his overall badness...and yet he was nearly elected mayor (or lord ) of Baldur's Gate

Didn't anyone suspect (asides from the party) that there might be something untoward about the towering guy with evil glowing eyes in black horned armour that was trying to take over?

jerubal · Post by **jerubal** » Wed May 21, 2003 4:46 pm

We're still bearing in mind that the Aasimar are the partial sons and daughters of deities anyway, aren't we? Therefore all Bhaalspawn are Aasimar of a sort; or probably more precisely, they're Tieflings.
Perhaps it's simply manifested more in the stronger ones, or just randomly in some... afterall, not all Aasimar have the marks.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Wed May 21, 2003 9:21 pm

Originally posted by jerubal
We're still bearing in mind that the Aasimar are the partial sons and daughters of deities anyway, aren't we? Therefore all Bhaalspawn are Aasimar of a sort; or probably more precisely, they're Tieflings.
Perhaps it's simply manifested more in the stronger ones, or just randomly in some... afterall, not all Aasimar have the marks.

Yeah, you got a point there.

*chuckles, thinking about one of the dialogues that can happen in ToB between Sarevok and Imoen*

VonDondu · Post by **VonDondu** » Thu May 22, 2003 12:27 am

I thought that Tieflings had some demon blood in their lineage, not divine blood. Isn't there a difference? Bhaal was a god, so if anything, Bhaalspawn are all Aasimars, not Tieflings.

jerubal · Post by **jerubal** » Thu May 22, 2003 4:51 am

Yeah, demons and fiends. But Bhaal wasn't a particularly nice god, I don't think. It always seemed to me like Aasimar were touched by good divinity, and Tieflings were touched by evil...

Either way the Bhaalspawn come under one of those two headings, I reckon.

Rav · Post by **Rav** » Sun May 25, 2003 8:23 am

Actually, Aasimar have Celestial blood (Solars, Archons etc.) and hence this does not apply to Sarevok either.

Just something to make him look cool.

UncleScratchy · Post by **UncleScratchy** » Sun May 25, 2003 11:54 am

Bhaal started out as a human

Keep in mind that Bhaal was one of three powerful mortal, presumably human mages (the other two being Bane and Myrkul the Necromancer) who set out to defeat Jergal (Lord of the End of Everything) and take over his realm as the god of strife, death, and the dead. These three, like Saravok afterwards, vowed to either become gods or die trying. Eventually in their travels they destroyed one of the Seven Lost Gods (this was the demigod Borem of the Lake of Boiling Mud) and each took a portion of this defeated god's divine essence for themselves. Jergal was suspected of secretly helping the three kill Borem as he had tired of his throne and was manipulating events so these three could find their way to him. Anyway, the three fought their way to Jergal who surprised them by willingly giving up his throne and godly portfolio. Jergal talked them into playing a game of knucklebones to decide who would get what portion of his portfolio. Bane won and chose to rule as the god of hate and strife. Myrkul was second and chose to be god of the dead. Bhaal, who finished last, chose to be god of death and murder. Later Bane, Bhaal and Myrkul were killed during the Time of Troubles by Cyric when Ao forced all the gods into mortal shells.

Although the story doesn't give any specifics about Bhaal's earlier mortal existence it doesn't sound like he had either Aasimar or Fiend blood in him, just a very powerful human wizard who ascended to demigod and then lesser god status. Also, from the ToB saga we learn that Sarevok was born of a human mother, a priestess of Bhaal. So Sarvok's eyes are just yellow because that's how the artist drew him. I like VonDondu's idea that his eyes were depicted that way to show that he was brought back from his dead wraith form when given some living Bhaalspawn soul. If it was because of his Bhaal blood one would expect that all Bhaalspawn would have similar eyes.

VonDondu · Post by **VonDondu** » Sun May 25, 2003 6:48 pm

Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
1) Well, if you notice his eyes in the intro cinematic for BG1, his eyes have that glow to them.

That's a good point. In BG1, maybe Sarevok's eyes glowed because he, more than any other Bhaalspawn, knew how how to channel his Bhaalspawn powers. If that were the case, then not all Bhaalspawn would have to have glowing eyes. Give the big guy some credit. Even in his wraith-form, he possessed considerable powers; he even showed you how to use the Pocket Plane. Maybe when he was alive, he could make his eyes glow at will, and maybe he was making them glow in the BG1 intro cinematic just to scare the person he was about to kill.

But that explanation does not hold up in Throne of Bhaal, when he no longer had the "taint". If his Bhaalspawn powers made his eyes glow in BG1, they wouldn't be glowing in ToB unless something else (or something new) made his eyes glow. Maybe he still has some of the attributes of a wraith. Maybe his eyes glow because he's a Deathbringer, and it's a good way to scare people.

Or maybe there is no good explanation for it. But I think we should try to be consistent.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Tue May 27, 2003 4:46 am

Re: Bhaal started out as a human

Originally posted by UncleScratchy
Keep in mind that Bhaal was one of three powerful mortal, presumably human mages (the other two being Bane and Myrkul the Necromancer) who set out to defeat Jergal (Lord of the End of Everything) and take over his realm as the god of strife, death, and the dead. These three, like Saravok afterwards, vowed to either become gods or die trying. Eventually in their travels they destroyed one of the Seven Lost Gods (this was the demigod Borem of the Lake of Boiling Mud) and each took a portion of this defeated god's divine essence for themselves. Jergal was suspected of secretly helping the three kill Borem as he had tired of his throne and was manipulating events so these three could find their way to him. Anyway, the three fought their way to Jergal who surprised them by willingly giving up his throne and godly portfolio. Jergal talked them into playing a game of knucklebones to decide who would get what portion of his portfolio. Bane won and chose to rule as the god of hate and strife. Myrkul was second and chose to be god of the dead. Bhaal, who finished last, chose to be god of death and murder. Later Bane, Bhaal and Myrkul were killed during the Time of Troubles by Cyric when Ao forced all the gods into mortal shells.

Although the story doesn't give any specifics about Bhaal's earlier mortal existence it doesn't sound like he had either Aasimar or Fiend blood in him, just a very powerful human wizard who ascended to demigod and then lesser god status. Also, from the ToB saga we learn that Sarevok was born of a human mother, a priestess of Bhaal. So Sarvok's eyes are just yellow because that's how the artist drew him. I like VonDondu's idea that his eyes were depicted that way to show that he was brought back from his dead wraith form when given some living Bhaalspawn soul. If it was because of his Bhaal blood one would expect that all Bhaalspawn would have similar eyes.

Yeah, I'll never forget reading "The History of The Dead Three" for the first time in BG1 and thinking "Wow, that must be alot to do to become a god." In the storybook item, Bhaal was described as an assassin, not as a mage. Was he a combination of thief of mage, or something else? Bane was called a tyrant, which could have been anything including a mage, and Myrkul was a necromancer, which was a no-brainer.

It's a shame that some stories and ideas are not fully explained.

UncleScratchy · Post by **UncleScratchy** » Tue May 27, 2003 9:38 am

Re: Re: Bhaal started out as a human

Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
Yeah, I'll never forget reading "The History of The Dead Three" for the first time in BG1 and thinking "Wow, that must be alot to do to become a god." In the storybook item, Bhaal was described as an assassin, not as a mage. Was he a combination of thief of mage, or something else? Bane was called a tyrant, which could have been anything including a mage, and Myrkul was a necromancer, which was a no-brainer.

It's a shame that some stories and ideas are not fully explained.

The makers of BG are just taking Forgotten Realms lore from the existing Dungeon&Dragons books on dieties. They have limited space to get into much depth with this lore within the game, though they make a pretty good effort with all the books laying about that you can read. Morrowind does something similar. Those that want to learn about the lore of the fantasy setting can read every book they find, while others who just want to get on with the games can ignore them. You could probably find out more of the story if you could latch onto one of those original D&D source books. I guess I just assumed that all three had to be mages of sorts to have gained so much power that they could kill a demigod. But in retrospect, you are correct, we only know for sure that Myrkul was a mage/necromancer. Although BG2 only allows the assassin kit as a thief specialization I don't think we should assume that this applies to the D&D lore. Bhaal could have been an assassin with mage, thief or fighter's roots. I think much more has been written about Bane than the other two. Bane manages to resurrect himself and return after the Time of Troubles as the god of strife. The title of 'tyrant' connotates that he was a powerful lord or even a king at one time. I think BG plays on these D&D themes with Bhaal where dead or vanquished gods, like Bane or Mistra, are able to make a comeback. Later even Cyric is vanquished and replaced by other gods. Since Bhaal doesn't make a comeback in the official D&D sagas, the BG developers had a nice concept and precedent to explore with the game's storyline.

Rav · Post by **Rav** » Tue May 27, 2003 2:46 pm

Assassin is not necessarily a class. If you are a cleric but get payed to kill people, aren't you an assassin as well?

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Tue Jun 10, 2003 8:05 am

Another thing about him *minor spoilers*

Also, what about his relationship with Tamoko? Was she really like a sweetheart to him as well as an accomplice?

I kinda heard through the grapevine about what happens to him as somewhat of an epilogue in ToB, I won't go into it, or ask about it, just so I can actually see it for myself, as well as not spoil it for gamers who haven't gotten that far. I was close to beating the game but my original Paladin really bit the dust at that point. That, and I didn't have a computer of my own at that point.

VonDondu · Post by **VonDondu** » Tue Jun 10, 2003 2:41 pm

Originally posted by Galuf the Dwarf
Also, what about his relationship with Tamoko? Was she really like a sweetheart to him as well as an accomplice?

I kinda heard through the grapevine about what happens to him as somewhat of an epilogue in ToB, I won't go into it, or ask about it, just so I can actually see it for myself, as well as not spoil it for gamers who haven't gotten that far...

Tamoko is one of Sarevok's girlfriends. (Cythandria, the woman on the upper level of the Iron Throne who has Sarevok's diary, is another one of his girlfriends.)

Tamoko was deeply in love with Sarevok, and she wanted to save him from himself. She thought that if it weren't for the taint of Bhaal, Sarevok would not be so destructive. She wanted him to live not as a god, but as a man--with her, of course. She wanted you to defeat him but spare his life so that he could lead a more normal life, so she betrayed him in Baldur's Gate by telling you about his plans. He broke up with her when he found out about that. (He must have felt at least some love for her since he didn't kill her for it.) At that point, she thought the only way to regain his trust would be to block your path and defeat you. However, she knew that if she succeeded, he would proceed with his plans to become a god and she would still lose him. She also knew that if you killed her, you would also kill Sarevok. Neither outcome appealed to her, and she was ready to throw her life away. If you were willing to forgo looting her corpse for some great items and refused to fight her, then she could see that you were not like Sarevok despite the taint you shared with him, and that proved to her that Sarevok was evil by his own choice, not because of his taint. When she came to that realization, she renounced him and left in disgust, warning you not to be as foolish as she was.

It kind of makes you wonder if they have any future together after Sarevok is resurrected. Would she have him back? Does he love her enough to do what it takes? It certainly shows a side of Sarevok we don't usually think about. We usually think of him as a villain, a rival, and a killing machine, not a lover.

The Z · Post by **The Z** » Tue Jun 10, 2003 8:12 pm

It kind of makes you wonder if they have any future together after Sarevok is resurrected. Would she have him back? Does he love her enough to do what it takes? It certainly shows a side of Sarevok we don't usually think about. We usually think of him as a villain, a rival, and a killing machine, not a lover.

Doesn't Sarevok's ToB ending state that he "buried his loved one Tamoko and then wandered..."?

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Wed Jun 11, 2003 6:24 am

Originally posted by VonDondu
Tamoko is one of Sarevok's girlfriends. (Cythandria, the woman on the upper level of the Iron Throne who has Sarevok's diary, is another one of his girlfriends.)

Tamoko was deeply in love with Sarevok, and she wanted to save him from himself. She thought that if it weren't for the taint of Bhaal, Sarevok would not be so destructive. She wanted him to live not as a god, but as a man--with her, of course. She wanted you to defeat him but spare his life so that he could lead a more normal life, so she betrayed him in Baldur's Gate by telling you about his plans. He broke up with her when he found out about that. (He must have felt at least some love for her since he didn't kill her for it.) At that point, she thought the only way to regain his trust would be to block your path and defeat you. However, she knew that if she succeeded, he would proceed with his plans to become a god and she would still lose him. She also knew that if you killed her, you would also kill Sarevok. Neither outcome appealed to her, and she was ready to throw her life away. If you were willing to forgo looting her corpse for some great items and refused to fight her, then she could see that you were not like Sarevok despite the taint you shared with him, and that proved to her that Sarevok was evil by his own choice, not because of his taint. When she came to that realization, she renounced him and left in disgust, warning you not to be as foolish as she was.

It kind of makes you wonder if they have any future together after Sarevok is resurrected. Would she have him back? Does he love her enough to do what it takes? It certainly shows a side of Sarevok we don't usually think about. We usually think of him as a villain, a rival, and a killing machine, not a lover.

Yeah, I remember alot of that stuff. A shame, though. Love ends up becoming such a driving force for drastic measures. No wonder so many do so much for ones that are in their hearts. *sigh* Love. *sniffs a rose, only to have a bee inside it land threateningly on his nose* Oh great.

Some day I'll feel it like the sting I'm about to get.

Galuf the Dwarf · Post by **Galuf the Dwarf** » Tue Jun 17, 2003 8:26 am

Now, about the upgraded Sword of Chaos from the Ascension Mod.

Can only Sarevok wield it, or can somebody that meets that whole rigamarole of requirements equip it? The last I read of it, a character had to be of chaotic alignment, and nothing that accounted as a truly heroic warrior (i.e: Paladins, Rangers). I don't remember seeing the requirements being something including "Deathbringers" or Sarevok, but does somebody mind clearing this up?

Leonardo · Post by **Leonardo** » Tue Jun 17, 2003 12:21 pm

I'm not 100% sure, but I think I managed to make Minsc wield it after pumping up his CON with Lum's and a Ioun stone.