character development/levelling discussion thread

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Tue Jan 13, 2004 12:08 am

This thread is meant to discuss character development/levelling, like what class to choose, what skills to pick etc. i see some similar threads for specific classes, so maybe this thread can serve to direct to those threads as well as have some discussions. hopfully more direction can be done so it becomes easy to find the classes desired.

Note: this thread will be more "power play" style (sorry if you do not like the term) as it will likely focus more on NVW characters than P&P charcter development.

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Tue Jan 13, 2004 12:18 am

I'll kickstart this thread with a "question" for one of my newer character builds:

Character: Rogue(9)/Fighter(2)/ShadowDancer(1)
Stats:
STR: avg, DEX: max, CON: avg, INT: abv avg, WIS: avg, CHR: abv avg
(with avg=10-11, abv avg=12-16, max=being as high as i can possibly get it to be)

so, i'm pretty cool as a capable rogue with all the rogue skills, hiding, traps, locks being no problem. and ability to use any magical item.

i'm thinking of 3 possible paths for the next 8 lvls:

1. multiclass as a bard: this will give me some spellcasting ability without sacrificing too much skill points

2. multiclass as a sorceror: this will give me good spellcasting ability, sacrificing uber roguish and combat capability

3. continus as a rogue/fighter: (more on rogue lvls than fighter) this will simply improve upon what i have now without much changes and no spellcasting (except from scrolls/wands/staves).

my top choice witll be #1. any one has suggestions or comments?

thegreywolfe · Post by **thegreywolfe** » Thu Jan 15, 2004 11:28 am

Sorcerer 18 / Red Dragon Disciple 1

My stats are pretty much on par for a sorcerer.

I decided with this character to max on my spellcasting ability before switching to RDD so that I would have some decent power to play with. So far it hasn't been difficult at all. I think I had more problems with my dwarven defender. I do tend to keep the maximum number of alies with my sorc though. I'm in chapter two now, so so far I have Deekin, the drow woman, my fairie familiar, and the huge elemental. I was going to let Deekin go so I could pick up the tiefling, but i've found that Deekin is a very useful henchman.

macdong · Post by **macdong** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 1:49 am

my char: rogue(7)/assassin(8)/shadow dancer(1)

i killed every up on this point in game (beginning of chapter 4 in original compaign) by myself (no henchmen). the hide in plane site feat is just overpowering. and with assassin's death attack, an enemy rated as "impossible" (who isn't immune to sneak attack) can be dealt within seconds. i also have a pair of mace of disruption to switch when i encounter undead creatures. i did recruit Daelan when i fought those dragons in chapter 3 though. they are just too tough

macdong · Post by **macdong** » Sat Jan 17, 2004 1:51 am

you can't have more than 3 classes, unless they change that in HotU (don't have it, don't know)

Originally posted by shift244
I'll kickstart this thread with a "question" for one of my newer character builds:

Character: Rogue(9)/Fighter(2)/ShadowDancer(1)
Stats:
STR: avg, DEX: max, CON: avg, INT: abv avg, WIS: avg, CHR: abv avg
(with avg=10-11, abv avg=12-16, max=being as high as i can possibly get it to be)

so, i'm pretty cool as a capable rogue with all the rogue skills, hiding, traps, locks being no problem. and ability to use any magical item.

i'm thinking of 3 possible paths for the next 8 lvls:

1. multiclass as a bard: this will give me some spellcasting ability without sacrificing too much skill points

2. multiclass as a sorceror: this will give me good spellcasting ability, sacrificing uber roguish and combat capability

3. continus as a rogue/fighter: (more on rogue lvls than fighter) this will simply improve upon what i have now without much changes and no spellcasting (except from scrolls/wands/staves).

my top choice witll be #1. any one has suggestions or comments?

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Sun Jan 18, 2004 6:19 pm

Originally posted by macdong
you can't have more than 3 classes, unless they change that in HotU (don't have it, don't know)

awww shucks.. you're right. oh well... i guess i'll just progress with more rogue levels. i'm doing fine fighting most things really.. except lichs who are able to cast spells even when i'm hitting them, and a stoneskinned lich is pretty tough. haven't face dragons yet.. but soon i'll know. i'm pretty kick-shift +2,+4,+4 too... especially with ghostly visage and bless active..

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Sun Jan 18, 2004 6:23 pm

on a (un?)related note: i've faced the spirit of the woods in chapter 2 yesterday (my last location here).. but i was thinking of spamming ancient dire bears for xp. i gained 2 levels there with my last char gaining 800+ xp.

only to my surprise, i got only 3!!! i have SOU, but not HOTU. is this a problem with the patch?

macdong · Post by **macdong** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 12:27 am

i am not sure what you did. did you spam a couple of dire bears so the spirit could kill it or something? did you do so with a wand?

Originally posted by shift244
on a (un?)related note: i've faced the spirit of the woods in chapter 2 yesterday (my last location here).. but i was thinking of spamming ancient dire bears for xp. i gained 2 levels there with my last char gaining 800+ xp.

only to my surprise, i got only 3!!! i have SOU, but not HOTU. is this a problem with the patch?

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 6:23 pm

ok, this is how i spamed ancient dire bears (so soryy i cannot think of another way of putting this):
.
.
<spoiler - highlight to read>
in neverwinter woods, for the spirit of the woods quest, there is an altar where u are supposed to sacrifice yourself? if you carve your name, an ancient dire bear will appear and attack you. i simply did this many times.
</spoiler>

thing is, when i did this the last time with a pure rogue, i got something like 800+ xp, but now, after taking to fighter levels (with two less rogue levels) i'm getting 3 xp !?!

macdong · Post by **macdong** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 6:35 pm

is there a chance you might confuse the ancient dire bear in the nearby cave with the ancient dire bear spawned by the altar?
i tried this before, and the ancient dire bear spawned by the altar has always given me 3 XP points.
if you are looking for a real spoiler, try this.
although it does appear quite late, so it might not be of any significance.
in chapter 3, in the hill giant cave level 2, there is a cook in one of the room with 2 hostages.
when you talk to the hostages, you get 50 XP points, and after you end the dialogue you get another 100.
well if you save in the middle of the conversation and reload, you can keep the 50 XP for free.
and you can keep doing so until you fell in sleep or your consicence finally gets to you

Originally posted by shift244
ok, this is how i spamed ancient dire bears (so soryy i cannot think of another way of putting this):
.
.
<spoiler - highlight to read>
in neverwinter woods, for the spirit of the woods quest, there is an altar where u are supposed to sacrifice yourself? if you carve your name, an ancient dire bear will appear and attack you. i simply did this many times.
</spoiler>

thing is, when i did this the last time with a pure rogue, i got something like 800+ xp, but now, after taking to fighter levels (with two less rogue levels) i'm getting 3 xp !?!

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:14 pm

no thx. i was thinking of boosting my way a little

but i'm not really into it. i didn't notice how much the other ancient dire bears were giving me, i just noticed that the one there gave me 3xp and was wondering if my char may be considered too powerful.. being able able to take down minotaurs in 2 rounds and all.

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:18 pm

rereading the post by thegreywolfe, i'm wondering. if i were to build a monk/sorceror/dragon disciple.. what would it be like? i'm thinking about monk(10)/sorceror(20)/DD(10) at the end, and taking this character from SOU to HOTU. just to sastify my desire to create a warrior/caster. comments? (no spoilers please..)

macdong · Post by **macdong** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:36 pm

i don't know. a level 10 monk really isn't all that helpful...

Originally posted by shift244
rereading the post by thegreywolfe, i'm wondering. if i were to build a monk/sorceror/dragon disciple.. what would it be like? i'm thinking about monk(10)/sorceror(20)/DD(10) at the end, and taking this character from SOU to HOTU. just to sastify my desire to create a warrior/caster. comments? (no spoilers please..)

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:24 pm

hm... so u think i should get more monk levels? or do i take some other combat capable class? my intention is not to make the character really uber being as both spellcaster+warrior... i was thinking that the dragon disciple levels will help the monk interms of combat ability...

macdong · Post by **macdong** » Mon Jan 19, 2004 10:35 pm

if you really want a warrior with spell casting abilities, a Clerics would probably be good for you. a high level clerics with high wisdom can cast spells like non other. give him/her a shield and a sword (or whatever one-handed weapon, i prefer bastard sword personally) and he/she will be quite tough to hit.

Originally posted by shift244
hm... so u think i should get more monk levels? or do i take some other combat capable class? my intention is not to make the character really uber being as both spellcaster+warrior... i was thinking that the dragon disciple levels will help the monk interms of combat ability...

shift244 · Post by **shift244** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 1:41 am

i had thought of clerics, but they're well... conventional. they make good fighters with decent spellcasting abilities, true... but then they'll lack the dragon disciple option, unless i forgo the extra attribute points.. which isn't too bad.. as more cleric levels = more spells.

how about paladin(1)/sorceror(29)/DD(10)?

macdong · Post by **macdong** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 10:17 am

this thread has some discussions about RDD. take a look:

http://www.gamebanshee.com/forums/showt ... post464372

Originally posted by shift244
i had thought of clerics, but they're well... conventional. they make good fighters with decent spellcasting abilities, true... but then they'll lack the dragon disciple option, unless i forgo the extra attribute points.. which isn't too bad.. as more cleric levels = more spells.

how about paladin(1)/sorceror(29)/DD(10)?

Xandax · Post by **Xandax** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 11:11 am

As I mentioned in the other thread (linked by previous poster) I fail to see the reasoning behind planning your characters for level 40. You will not get to level 40 by playing normal.

Instead - I'd plan my characters for some reference points. For instance, how do I want him to be at level 15-20-25 and beyond.

This makes for more evenly play throughout the game, instead of only fulfilling my "project" at the very late parts of the game.

Just IMO

thegreywolfe · Post by **thegreywolfe** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 12:01 pm

Hey shift244, my character is now a sorc 21/dd 10 and i'm actually thinking about switching to a good fighting class now, but not really certain their is a need to. I built a trainer module to level up with, but instead of just giving myself exp I set it up so I got a lot of experience for killing dragons. I can go in there and with only my fairie familiar and an elder elemental I beat the crap out of ancient dragons.

So, maybe I'll switch and add cleric to my list just for something different. Either that or I'm just gonna start a new character.

Darthel · Post by **Darthel** » Tue Jan 20, 2004 12:17 pm

RE Disciples: I originally thought about taking only 5 levels of Sorc and then switch to the prestige class; thought that I could still take the Craft Wand feat at 6th Level - nope. Apparently there are some feats that only appear when you level up in specific classes.
From The D&D SRD

CRAFT WAND [ITEM CREATION]
Prerequisite: Caster level 5th.
Benefit: …

Note that there is no mention of this feat being linked to spell caster advancement and is, in fact, available for the sorc at level 6 as a general feat choice but WAS NOT available with a Sorc5/RDD1 at the same point.
Another mis-implementation:.

EXOTIC WEAPON PROFICIENCY [GENERAL]
Choose a type of exotic weapon. You understand how to use that type of exotic weapon in combat.
Prerequisite: Base attack bonus +1 (plus Str 13 for bastard sword or dwarven waraxe).
Benefit: You make attack rolls with the weapon normally.
Normal: A character who uses a weapon with which he or she is not proficient takes a –4 penalty on attack rolls.
Special: You can gain Exotic Weapon Proficiency multiple times. Each time you take the feat, it applies to a new type of exotic weapon. …

Note that you need to use this feat for EACH exotic weapon with which you gain proficiency.
And another::.

POWER ATTACK [GENERAL]
Prerequisite: Str 13.
Benefit: …

Note that this feat is not limited to fighters but that I was unable to get it for a Sorc1 with STR 14.

These are examples of why the CRPG genre will never replace the PnP version of the game although it can cause the PnP versions to bain popularity.

BUT …
Enough of the rant; I am thoroughly enjoying this game and the way that the designers did not limit the game to starting characters after giving out the development tools for the fans to create MORE for themselves.

BTW Thanks, Xandax for your advice and input.