*SPOILERS*
I have finished my first time all the way through the game, I played as a light-side female Revan. I was very careful to only choose light-side actions and dialogs, and my LS chart was maxed all the way up by the end.
I turned all kinds of people from the dark side to the light side, and did my best good girl work on Korriban:
a. I saved the 3 wannabees from the sith student by telling Lashowe the joke about the mandalorians.
b. I persuaded 2 of the hopefuls to leave, who were waiting at the Sith Academy entrance, but 1 died anyway
c. I persuaded the reluctant student (Kal Elgwin?) to quit the acadamy and go to the Jedi Academy on Dantoine
d. I rescued the renegade sith students in the cave and covered up for them
e. I rescued the malfunctioning droid and covered up his escape
f. I didn't let the crazy former master kill Mekel, but I worked it wrong and ended up fighting him and killing him myself. I should have taken all the mad master's attacks
g. Best of all, I helped Yuthura Ban defeat Uthar, then after I beat her, I convinced her to go to Dantoine too.
h. I fought and killed all the teachers and students at the Sith Academy after Yuthura left. So when I left Korriban, they had no master, no teachers and no students.
I went to Dantoine before my encounter with Leviathan, and I talked to the student and Yuthura. I really liked my conversations with her. I think that was the most satisfying quest conclusion of all. Better than getting Bastila back.
Then on the Star Forge, I turned the Jedi's precious Bastila back to the light side, but she still sounds like she might go back darkside, if not watched like a hawk.
So after I killed Malak, I get to see the light-side ending, and listened through Admiral D's gushing praise, then Vendar - that sanctimonious, puny Yoda wannabee - gets his turn, and of course has to warn us about the dark side, but the last thing he says pi**ed me off so bad, I went straight back and opened a saved file that starts just before the temple, so I could go dark- side imediately.
I hate the line he uses about redemption: "the prodigal knight has returned." No other returning dark-siders get treated that way by him. No gladness for all the people I turned - while he sat on his thumbs. No gratitude for beating Malak. No thanks for helping destroy the Star Forge. No gladness for my return. It made me wish for a chance to cut the little toad down myself, personally!
Any other Vendar haters out there?
*SPOILERS* Man I hate Master Vendar!
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Bagofbones
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*SPOILERS* Man I hate Master Vendar!
Against boredome,
Even the Gods themselves
Struggle in vain.
Even the Gods themselves
Struggle in vain.
where is this mod?
Soon more stuff will come here, but I guess I will just put one of my favortie websites (besides Game Banshee)
here
{Its Homestar Runner}
here
{Its Homestar Runner}
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Bagofbones
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See this whole thread was a rant for me, but...
Okay, this may be more work than it deserves, but it is my time to waste, so...
I looked up the story of the prodigal son in the New Testament. It's in Luke Chapter 15 verses 11 through 32. Here is my opinon of Vandar referring to this story.
1. It's from earth, about 33 AD. For a Star Wars galaxy character to use it means it is meant from Bioware for US to understand the reference from OUR perspective.
2. There are three main characters in the story in Luke 15. The prodigal son (the younger of 2 sons,) the father and the older brother. In the story, when the prodigal returns, the father sees him in the distance, is filled with "compassion," runs out to him, embraces him, kisses him on the neck, puts his best robe on him, puts a ring on his finger, orders the servants to kill "the fatted calf" for a party to celebrate the return of his younger son - who was as if he were dead, but now is alive to the father. does that sound like the reaction of Master Vandar?
3. The older brother hears the party and asks one of the servants what's going on. When he learns that the party is for his wandering younger brother, he gets angry and sullen, and won't go in. The father comes out and asks why he's angry, and the older brother complains that although he had always been faithful, the father had NEVER thrown a party for him.
So I ask now, if Vandar can call me (Revan,) a "prodigal knight" who has returned (to the light side,) should I call him brother, or father?
Okay, this may be more work than it deserves, but it is my time to waste, so...
I looked up the story of the prodigal son in the New Testament. It's in Luke Chapter 15 verses 11 through 32. Here is my opinon of Vandar referring to this story.
1. It's from earth, about 33 AD. For a Star Wars galaxy character to use it means it is meant from Bioware for US to understand the reference from OUR perspective.
2. There are three main characters in the story in Luke 15. The prodigal son (the younger of 2 sons,) the father and the older brother. In the story, when the prodigal returns, the father sees him in the distance, is filled with "compassion," runs out to him, embraces him, kisses him on the neck, puts his best robe on him, puts a ring on his finger, orders the servants to kill "the fatted calf" for a party to celebrate the return of his younger son - who was as if he were dead, but now is alive to the father. does that sound like the reaction of Master Vandar?
3. The older brother hears the party and asks one of the servants what's going on. When he learns that the party is for his wandering younger brother, he gets angry and sullen, and won't go in. The father comes out and asks why he's angry, and the older brother complains that although he had always been faithful, the father had NEVER thrown a party for him.
So I ask now, if Vandar can call me (Revan,) a "prodigal knight" who has returned (to the light side,) should I call him brother, or father?
Against boredome,
Even the Gods themselves
Struggle in vain.
Even the Gods themselves
Struggle in vain.
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Fraoch
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It could just be me....
But whenever I see any Joda-type of creature all I can do is wish I could hang the wee bugger from a clothes-line by his ears - I have had this since the first time I ever saw Star Wars, and I was seven at the time.....
Once saw a SW pastiche made with action figures and there's a shot of Joda being...well..handled rather intimately by a Gomorrean guard - could be a nice idea for a mod ?
But whenever I see any Joda-type of creature all I can do is wish I could hang the wee bugger from a clothes-line by his ears - I have had this since the first time I ever saw Star Wars, and I was seven at the time.....
Once saw a SW pastiche made with action figures and there's a shot of Joda being...well..handled rather intimately by a Gomorrean guard - could be a nice idea for a mod ?
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fable
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Originally posted by Bagofbones
So I ask now, if Vandar can call me (Revan,) a "prodigal knight" who has returned (to the light side,) should I call him brother, or father?
Call him a guy who was borne two drinks too light. Hell, you had your entire identity wiped clean; "you" haven't returned from anywhere. But that's the problem with bad writers: wisdom is thought of, and portrayed, as nothing more than sanctimonious condescension.
To the Righteous belong the fruits of violent victory. The rest of us will have to settle for warm friends, warm lovers, and a wink from a quietly supportive universe.
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alpha_hazard
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The story of the Prodigal Son is always missused...It's not that weird...although I do understand your confusion at the fact that the story is from human history which was neither long ago, nor in a galaxy far away, there are many who belive that the stories of the Bible and other religious texts are universal...Therefore this same thing could have happened in the "star wars universe"
The story of the Prodigal son is a story of great redemption...The greatest of all being revans...Besides, it would really be taxing on Bioware to create a seperate ending to coincide with all of your actions in the game, it is simple easier and cheaper for them to create the LS and The DS endings and hope everybody is pleased.
The story of the Prodigal son is a story of great redemption...The greatest of all being revans...Besides, it would really be taxing on Bioware to create a seperate ending to coincide with all of your actions in the game, it is simple easier and cheaper for them to create the LS and The DS endings and hope everybody is pleased.
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fable
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Originally posted by alpha_hazard
The story of the Prodigal son is a story of great redemption...The greatest of all being revans...
Except that he hasn't been "redeemed," because Revan never came back and sought anything. Your PC isn't Revan: you're tabula rasa, a clean slate: a totally new personality in Revan's body. Without that Revan personality to draw upon, he can't "repent," for whatever that's worth, because he's a different person, and Revan's dead.
To the Righteous belong the fruits of violent victory. The rest of us will have to settle for warm friends, warm lovers, and a wink from a quietly supportive universe.
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alpha_hazard
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I realize that...But whose to say the prodigal son in the story did not also have his memory erased and he returned to his home by piecing together fragmented memories...
I'm kidding, for those of you blind to sarcasm... Anyway
Sure, you are not revan, but you are still given the choices to go down the path of the darkside again and again, just as the prodigal son is given the choice to return home. Just like the prodigal son who is received with good will by his father, you are received well by the Jedi order, because you have redeemed yourself in their eyes..It does not matter how your PC is view by themselves or you, but how you are viewed by your "Father" do you get my meaning? The story is of redemption in the eyes of those you betrayed, but in the eyes of your own character...
And like I said before, bioware, despite their status as game designers, just didn't have the time or resources to come up with a whole new parable to fit your adventure, so they borrow from the Mythos of our own culture in order to make it seem more "real" In addition to that, they just don't have the resources to have additional little cut scenes to show the results of your actions, because that would just be really boring and besides...we all know the results anyway..
Besides...if you were truly returned to the light side, you wouldn't need credit for that (Oh, wow, I sound like a total geek right now...HAhahaha!)
Yeah...byebye
I'm kidding, for those of you blind to sarcasm... Anyway
Sure, you are not revan, but you are still given the choices to go down the path of the darkside again and again, just as the prodigal son is given the choice to return home. Just like the prodigal son who is received with good will by his father, you are received well by the Jedi order, because you have redeemed yourself in their eyes..It does not matter how your PC is view by themselves or you, but how you are viewed by your "Father" do you get my meaning? The story is of redemption in the eyes of those you betrayed, but in the eyes of your own character...
And like I said before, bioware, despite their status as game designers, just didn't have the time or resources to come up with a whole new parable to fit your adventure, so they borrow from the Mythos of our own culture in order to make it seem more "real" In addition to that, they just don't have the resources to have additional little cut scenes to show the results of your actions, because that would just be really boring and besides...we all know the results anyway..
Besides...if you were truly returned to the light side, you wouldn't need credit for that (Oh, wow, I sound like a total geek right now...HAhahaha!)
Yeah...byebye
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EtherSeraph
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You know, not to go against the whole "Bioware and them is cheap" theory and all, but, in other games like Fallout and Fallout 2, they made diffrent endings open depending on what you did in the towns, if you didnt visit a place they didnt mention it, but if you saved a town it told you bout how things got better, if you worked to screw things up in the city, told you bout how it got worse.
In Baldurs Gate 2 and its expansion it tells you bout how the characters you met move on with good or bad endings pending on how you go. But considering they were prob planning Kotor 2 with finding out what happened to some of the characters.
It wouldnt have cost that much to make a few diffrent add-ons for a light sider who went that extra several lightyears to be the best Jedi they can be, as opposed to just roping them in with the light siders who said, "ya, but im busy" and left them to their own doom and damnation (or out right killing them on the spot). would have been very nice for me as i always did Korriban last on my quests, so after rescuing all the people there and what not there was no Dantooine to go and check and see how everybody was doing. *shrugs*
Anyways, theres my Dollar Fifty. AND I WANT CHANGE DAMN IT!!!!!
In Baldurs Gate 2 and its expansion it tells you bout how the characters you met move on with good or bad endings pending on how you go. But considering they were prob planning Kotor 2 with finding out what happened to some of the characters.
It wouldnt have cost that much to make a few diffrent add-ons for a light sider who went that extra several lightyears to be the best Jedi they can be, as opposed to just roping them in with the light siders who said, "ya, but im busy" and left them to their own doom and damnation (or out right killing them on the spot). would have been very nice for me as i always did Korriban last on my quests, so after rescuing all the people there and what not there was no Dantooine to go and check and see how everybody was doing. *shrugs*
Anyways, theres my Dollar Fifty. AND I WANT CHANGE DAMN IT!!!!!
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alpha_hazard
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WEll, That's true, I thought I had mentioned that...But one difference in Fallout/2 is that there was no animation for the majority of the ending...And considering that there was not a narator (I suppose Vandar could have narated the ending part...) it would have changed the flow and feeling of the game considerably...But Maybe in the New one, seeing as how there are some fallout creators on the team...
On a more philisophical note...Coincidently (Or, ironicly, if you want to piss george carlin off) Carlin has a pet peeve about the use of "prodigal"...In truth, the word Prodigal means "Excessive or prodigious generosity" And the full story of the prodigal son (not the abridged version give above) invovles the Prodigal son swindling his family's fortune, then high tailing it to mexico, or whereever the biblical equivalent is...Later he shows up and he is forgiven by his father, but his brother feels that he should at least be given credit for staying loyal to his father, rather than running away...
So here is the thing...Aside from the whole part about the money...in fact, really, even that's true, because Revan runs off with a whole bunch of battle ships...(of coruse he returns with more, so I guess he's a better investor than the Prodigal son).
Anyway, I know I've had enough of this subject...But I wasn't quite sure the horse was dead, so I had to beat it a little more, Now, I'm gonna put it in the hole I've dug for myself.
On a more philisophical note...Coincidently (Or, ironicly, if you want to piss george carlin off) Carlin has a pet peeve about the use of "prodigal"...In truth, the word Prodigal means "Excessive or prodigious generosity" And the full story of the prodigal son (not the abridged version give above) invovles the Prodigal son swindling his family's fortune, then high tailing it to mexico, or whereever the biblical equivalent is...Later he shows up and he is forgiven by his father, but his brother feels that he should at least be given credit for staying loyal to his father, rather than running away...
So here is the thing...Aside from the whole part about the money...in fact, really, even that's true, because Revan runs off with a whole bunch of battle ships...(of coruse he returns with more, so I guess he's a better investor than the Prodigal son).
Anyway, I know I've had enough of this subject...But I wasn't quite sure the horse was dead, so I had to beat it a little more, Now, I'm gonna put it in the hole I've dug for myself.