My New Party

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Fri Sep 10, 2004 8:15 am

Ravaatra Gellantara
Female Aasimar Lawfully Good
Paladin of Ilmater 3/Cleric Morninglord of Lathander X
STR 16 DEX 13 CON 10 INT 5 WIS 16 CHA 20
Weapons: Great Swords, Maces

Will start as Paladin for three levels, then squat two to keep from getting hit with XP penalty.

Marros Droverson
Male Human True Neutral
Rogue 2/Barbarian 2/Druid X
STR 18 DEX 14 CON 16 INT 6 WIS 18 CHA 4
Weapons: Large Swords, Crossbows

I thought the idea of a barbaric druid sounded kind of cool. I'm mostly going to be using the shape change ability with him and for spells, they will mostly be healing spells. I am little curious as to what abilities you can use once you change shapes. I've heard that you can rage, I'm wondering if I could use the Rogue's hide ability as well. Also, what damage type does the creature shapes do? He will start off as a Rogue, then add the Barbarian levels and then continue as a Druid.

Crueak Arborshate
Male Drow Chaotic Evil
Rogue 2/Ranger 1/Barbarian 2/Wizard X
STR 10 DEX 20 CON 10 INT 20 WIS 10 CHA 10
Weapons: Dual Small Blades, Bows

I want him to be dual-wielding small baldes with Weapon Finesse for melee attacks in the beginning. Once he has enough Wizard spells, he'll become the mage bomber. He will progress as so: Rogue 1, Ranger 1, Wizard 1, Rogue 2, Barbarian 1 & 2 and then continue on as Wizard.

tfrab · Post by **tfrab** » Fri Sep 10, 2004 8:25 am

[QUOTE=neocool00]Ravaatra Gellantara
Female Aasimar Lawfully Good
Paladin of Ilmater 3/Cleric Morninglord of Lathander X
STR 16 DEX 13 CON 10 INT 5 WIS 16 CHA 20
Weapons: Great Swords, Maces

Will start as Paladin for three levels, then squat two to keep from getting hit with XP penalty.[/QUOTE]

IMHO INT is too high, I would also improve CON and lower to 10 DEX (you can wear plate armor, who cares dex!).
You may also consider to make a Pure cleric of Lathander (you get animate dead earlier) and add a Paladin level only later i the game, when you get a very nice item that only paladin can use...
Furthermore she seems the only diplomat of your party, but paladins cannot get money for completed quests and attack evil creatures rather than accepting quest from them.

Wrath-Of-Egg · Post by **Wrath-Of-Egg** » Fri Sep 10, 2004 8:56 am

MORE CONSTITUTION.. to get more.. make charisma smaller...(if you dont have any real use for that ability..)

for your drow.. do you realise that drows are 2 levels behind other races.. + 60% XP penalty.. if you can dual fourth time.. that character wont be ganing much of levels...

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Fri Sep 10, 2004 10:59 am

[QUOTE=Wrath-Of-Egg]...for your drow.. do you realise that drows are 2 levels behind other races.. + 60% XP penalty.. if you can dual fourth time.. that character wont be ganing much of levels...[/QUOTE]
I figured since a Male Drow's favorite class is Wizard, then it will be ignored. The other three classes are within one level of each other, so why should I receive a XP penalty? Besides, with only three characters, I figured I would advance faster than with 6.

Mirk · Post by **Mirk** » Sat Sep 11, 2004 4:00 am

You don’t have to squat levels with the aasimar – paladin as a favored class means you NEVER get XP penalties for it, not only if it is the highest class.

Also, I see no reason to get 3 paladin levels – the Remove Disease ability is not too useful (I NEVER used it, and ended up with 70+ disease removing potions at the end of the game)

The druid’s shapechange forms are pretty weak, IMHO, even with the barbarian levels. I like druids, and had a monk1/druid once, which is even more shapechange-optimised, and even he stopped using this ability after chapter 1. If you decide to stick with it, tough, the rogue abilities can de used while shapechanged.

Brynn · Post by **Brynn** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 1:27 am

Neocool, don't you think it would be better to have a pure barbarian and a pure rouge? That way you could focus one character on using thief skills, and the other on barbarian skills - maybe it would be more effective then have two multiclass chars of the same class. Just a suggestion, though

Thidiazuron · Post by **Thidiazuron** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:46 am

[QUOTE=neocool00]Ravaatra Gellantara
Female Aasimar Lawfully Good
Paladin of Ilmater 3/Cleric Morninglord of Lathander X
STR 16 DEX 13 CON 10 INT 5 WIS 16 CHA 20
Weapons: Great Swords, Maces

I am afraid that you can´t take Lathander, a Paladin of Ilmater can only take a Cleric of Ilmater, wich is cool, but not as cool as a Lathander. Consider taking less CHA and taking more WIS and DEX.

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 6:13 am

[QUOTE=Brynn]don't you think it would be better to have a pure barbarian and a pure rouge? That way you could focus one character on using thief skills, and the other on barbarian skills - maybe it would be more effective then have two multiclass chars of the same class. Just a suggestion, though[/QUOTE]
Actually, I wanted to take the Barbarian classes because I wanted the the two characters to have rage. I thought from a role playing perspective that they would have short tempers. This is the first pary I have created where I didn't have a full time Rogue. I wanted to do something a little different.

[QUOTE=Thidiazuron]I am afraid that you can´t take Lathander, a Paladin of Ilmater can only take a Cleric of Ilmater, wich is cool, but not as cool as a Lathander. Consider taking less CHA and taking more WIS and DEX.[/QUOTE]
Acutally, you can, you just can't take any more Paladin levels after taking Cleric levels. That is why I took the three Paladin levels first. The reason for the max Charisma is Paladins get to add their Charima bonus to their saving throws. I thought I would max it, take only 16 wisdom and add to wisdom on level ups.

Brynn · Post by **Brynn** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 6:41 am

I see. I was just wondering if it pays off - b/c this way both of them will have only the low-level barb abilities... Btw, fighters can have Whirlwind Attack, that's powerful, too.

But you're right to consider it from the roleplaying point of view first

Mirk · Post by **Mirk** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 9:35 am

whirlwind attack? don't think so...

@neocool00: roleplaying reasons are the just fine (better than others, maybe?) to base a char on.

the one thing you should consider, IMHO: you don't have a tank. and a tank is actually a very important char in IWD2. there are many situations when your party is ambushed from different locations/directions, when the number of monsters is just overwhelming, where the enemies are on patrols in the area, etc. - exactly the situations where a char that rushes in with the "me' boys'll thrrrrough 'em buffs rrrrright at me' behind, they will" attitude, and has the HPs to take a few hits if "me' boys" are busy with... enemy spellcasters at the back row... that summoned demon that appeard with his jaws right above the poor wizard's head... you get the picture.

EDIT: added some 'flavor' to the comment, hopefully to be understood as 'Dwarvish'... as this is how the tanks are (stereotypicly) portrayed.

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 10:21 am

Tank is the problem I'm running into. I've played through Targos and wasn't too happy with the outcome of the final fights. My characters did ok and no one died, but my cleric and druid got surrounded awful fast. I thought that I could play with a Cleric as a tank mixed with some Paladin levels and she would be ok, but now I'm having second thoughts. I've always wanted to play a pure Monk, how do they stand up as a frontline tank? I have also dropped the Barbarian levels down to 1, you don't really get anything w/ 2 levels. With one, you still get Rage and that conveys anger IMO. Also, I'm thinking of dropping the Barbarian level from the Wizard and replacing it with a level of Fighter, that would give him the extra feat he's missing by not being a pure Wizard and it'll boost his hit points a couple. Besides, he's supposed to be a older gent. Although he's chaotic evil, I think he should know how to handle it. The druid is to be a younger person with some issues, hence hindering him on controlling his actions. Although he is wise, he lacks the knowldege of restraint.

Mirk · Post by **Mirk** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 11:37 am

in my expierience monks are difficult to tank with, at least up untill the middle-high levels. however, i think a (non-roleplayish) shield dwarf monk with:

str 18
dex 18
con 20
int 3
wis 16
cha 1

(or something less min-maxing, but along the same lines), should do just fine.

as to the Rage issue, I have little experience with it, since i never had a char with high enough Barbarian levels to get the Tireless Rage, and the regular rage is just not that useful for my builds.

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Mon Sep 13, 2004 1:53 pm

Yeah, I was thinking of keeping her as an Aasimar like this:

Ravaatra Gellantara
Female Aasimar Lawfully Neutral
Monk of the Old Order X
STR 18 DEX 18 CON 12 INT 6 WIS 20 CHA 6

Now the question is, with a pure Monk, which stat do you increase as she progresses?

Mirk · Post by **Mirk** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 2:06 am

as a tank, your HPs are more important than AC. you should defenately put more points (a lot more) in Con. this can be done at the expence of Str, Dex, and especially Wis.

as to the progression, IMHO Str is the only way to go. the monk will not get the uber-weapons, with stable (2dX) damagea, elemental damage, high critical range, and effects on hit, not to mention bonuses to hit.
the other stats are less important: your saves will be high enough, your AC increases with levels, and wisdom can be increased with items throughout the game, for those rare moents when an extra +1 to the DC of Stunning Fist makes a difference.

item/abiliies spoiler:

Monks have a lot of abilities to spread points around. hence, a good item for a monk is a Ring of Hearty Strength (+1 str, +1 con) - you leave your abilities at uneven score, and get +1 on two of them. the ring is available from a merchant half-way through the game.

neocool00 · Post by **neocool00** » Tue Sep 14, 2004 11:19 am

Updated party build

Ravaatra Gellantara
Female Deep Gnome Lawfully Neutral
Monk of the Old Order X
STR 16 DEX 20 CON 10 INT 4 WIS 20 CHA 4
Weapons: Axe (Slashing)/Fists, Polearm (Piercing), Sling (Missle(Bludgeoning))

Decided to go with a pure Monk. Changed her to a Deep Gnome because of the awesome saves and bonuses. Besides it's a party of three, she'll keep up with the rest.

Marros Droverson
Male Human Lawfully Neutral
Monk of the Old Order 1/Fighter 2/Druid X
STR 18 DEX 14 CON 16 INT 6 WIS 18 CHA 4
Weapons: Large Sword (Slashing), Mace (Bludgeoning), Crossbow (Missle(Piercing))

Dropped the Barbarian and Rogue levels for a level of Monk and 2 Fighter levels. The Monk's AC from Wisdom will help w/ shape changing and the two levels of Fighter will give extra feats and hit points. Bad thing is now I have to rely on him to be the healer (or not get hit

)

Crueak Arborshate
Male Drow Chaotic Evil
Rogue 2/Ranger 1/Fighter 2/Wizard X
STR 10 DEX 20 CON 10 INT 20 WIS 10 CHA 10
Weapons: Dual Small Blades (Piercing), Quaterstaff (Bludgeoning), Bow (Missile (Piercing))

Replaced Barbarian levels with Fighter levels for additional feats and hit points. Since my healer is going to be a little on the weak side, I'm going to need the extra hit points. However, I am going to progress him as so: Rogue 1, Ranger 1, Wizard 6, Fighter 2, Rogue 1 and finish off Wizard. I may even drop Fighter 2 and extra Rogue level, just depends on how he progresses.