Finished the game - Bring back Bioware!!! [SPOILERS]

Faelyn · Post by **Faelyn** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 2:40 pm

I just finished the game and I must say the ending is far more disappointing than I had imagined.

The original KotOR provided a decent cutscene explaining what happened straight after destroying the Star Forge and defeating Malak.

KotORII however comes up with a lame ending in which Kreia/Traya gives you a brief explanation of whats happening in the future but nothing special.

As far as I understand it, Kreia/Traya wanted to train you as you could mean the end of the Force. I'm assuming Bao-Dur is still alive, but why the hologram and how did he stay on the Ebon Hawk with Remote actually managing to get off the ship? How does Mira get off the ship when its stuck, how does she get back on it and why couldn't I do that? Why is Kreia/Traya happy at the end when I'm clearly not following her path.

Why did Revan start the Jedi Civil war? It didn't seem like he 'fell' to the dark side but had a clear plan as G0-TO hinted with his 'leaving the important worlds' intact.

How can the Jedi Academy on Dant start rebuilding when Kreia/Traya killed all the masters. At least they could give a brief explanation on that, like a cutscene with a rebuilt Enclave, a master and some students.

It seems like rush-friday-afternoon job.

Bioware is much better at these things..

Robnark · Post by **Robnark** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 5:18 pm

to be honest I'm not too impressed with bioware's storytelling skills either, but at least their predictable, pedestrian, single-twist stories are solidly made affairs, rather than the almost laughably slapdash Sith Lords plot

Faust · Post by **Faust** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 7:33 pm

Personally, I didn't think the Sith Lord story, as a whole, was bad. It certainly was more intricate in places than the lionshare of CRPGs developed these days (though that in itself may be saying a lot about the present state of things). It just wasn't developed to its full potential. The finished product ended up leaving a lot of loose ends. In general, it was a worst case scenario of "long drawn out beginning to build suspence" (which is great), a mediocre middle, and then a rushed ending to resolve it. The end product, therefore, seemed to be "rushed" villain development, no NPC plot resolution, and a rushed conclusion to your character's saga.

SPOILERS

Anyway, the by-product of this "rushed nature" was many loose ends being created that Faelyn mentioned. They seemed to draw many things to a conclusion with a line or two of dialogue (Jedi Order is restarted by your pupils, is implied somewhat), or not at all (NPC conflicts, story resolution). And some things, they seem to be leaving for the third installment of the game. Hopefully, they'll put together a a more complete product that answers the questions implied by the second game.

Soulforged · Post by **Soulforged** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 8:16 pm

I think that a pont is missing here. It's not the fact of Bioware or Obsidian. The point is Lucas Arts and the policy of rushing the game destroyed everything. The history (I'll keep saying it) is great, it just feels odd and desappointing for the ending and the cuts that it had suffered. When the plot and others details on the game are revised then all will be smoother and all things will fit. Problably even the real ending and the missing parts will be realized, so... In my opinion Obsidian did a better game, in all the points (try viewing it without all those bugs) better fighting, better dungeoning, better history (except for all the crashes of the Ebon Hawk), and the no level cap thing is something that i was hoping from much time indeed. Why have a level cap at all? Is better if you never quit leveling and more realistic. But there is another history for another time...

Rusicade · Post by **Rusicade** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 8:58 pm

Faults with the plot weren't isolated to the end of the game. Nar Shadaa had a number of problems, eg: you were suppose to "get the attention" of the Exchange by completing various quests. But one of the quests required that you talk to the Squid who ran the local branch of the Exchange. Some how I think talking to the guy would have end run any need to get the crime organization's attention. That was one of a number of problems.
The game was more open than KOTR I, which I liked. Characters were as good if not better.
But when it came to the plot, they just didn't seem to care. There were simple manuevers that could have straightend-out the plot. The Hut's group could have been one of the two organizations crowding the refugees on Nar Shadaa. At the end, you could have fought Kreia in a "Force Dead Zone" that would have cancelled out the Force Bond, making the ending logical. Mano a Mano w/o the Force (actually I thought that was going to happen). Instead you get the all important "Force Bond" for 3/4 of the game that... just disappears at the end.
I hope for KOTR III they hire an English Major to go over the story line.

Faust · Post by **Faust** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 9:28 pm

Heh. After playing Vampire: Bloodlines, I thought the grammar was excellent in KotOR2. I'd agree, however, that there were plot holes throughout the game (or, more annoying, incomplete story elements). I didn't mean to short change those in my post. It felt to me that a lot of fine tuning that was planned was never done. It simply becomes more prominent the further you get into the game.That said, I'd agree the blame probably needs to be laid more at the feet of Lucas Arts, rather than Obsidian. It seems very obvious that this imposed deadline on them, was the major reason the game feels "rushed" in places.

Rusicade · Post by **Rusicade** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 9:43 pm

Is Lucas Arts known for hurrying their developers? KOTR I & 2 are the only games of theirs I've played.

Thanks

Faelyn · Post by **Faelyn** » Thu Mar 10, 2005 3:37 am

I'm not saying Obsidian did a bad job as a whole. It is a good game, I liked the storyline and the way you can develop your team-members. Combat was good, dungeons were good and it looked nice enough. It just felt like it was being rushed through when it would've been a lot better if they just would've taken a little more time to tie up some loose ends and go a bit more in-depth.

Admo · Post by **Admo** » Thu Mar 10, 2005 3:52 am

[QUOTE=Rusicade]Is Lucas Arts known for hurrying their developers? KOTR I & 2 are the only games of theirs I've played.

Thanks[/QUOTE]

Yes, usually to "maximise" commercial gain. Even if it means that the quality suffered. Most people believe that KotOR II was rushed forward for the holiday season and so that there would be no conflict with Episode III film and game.

Marcus Wallace · Post by **Marcus Wallace** » Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:24 am

Reunion

I agree the story-end really sucked but I liked the part of seeing admiral carth onasi and Miss Bastila. for me kinda weird..since I slaughterd them in Kotor I

I really loved the fact that after 20hours of playing with mandalore i discovered he was actually Canderous Ordo. but besides that, yeah kotor II sucks some nice end-movies could be nice