Petition to Lift Ban on Stalker-Clerics

Andrew Shih · Post by **Andrew Shih** » Fri Aug 17, 2001 10:13 pm

Please visit the official ToB general forum at 'http://www.interplay.com/bg2throne/' and sign onto a petition for Bioware/Black Isle to lift the ban on stalker-clerics and archer-clerics for the final version of the official patch.

--Riverwind

fable · Post by **fable** » Fri Aug 17, 2001 11:15 pm

You know, you might get a better response if you actually posted those reasons you feel are most important here, before sending people out to look at 'em, elsewhere.

Aegis · Post by **Aegis** » Fri Aug 17, 2001 11:25 pm

and, another point goes to Fable...

Xyx · Post by **Xyx** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 3:39 am

[url="http://feedback.blackisle.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=7&t=009896"]Here[/url]'s the exact thread, for those that are interested.

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 4:17 am

Good initiative, Rivvy. But isn't the now released patch the official one? Anyway, I've signed the petition and am hoping for a change.

Andrew Shih · Post by **Andrew Shih** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 6:52 am

In support thereof:

1. The stalker-cleric is a valid multi-class under both manuals. Any multi-class is a valid dual-class, and you can choose a kit for the first class. Ranger/clerics are valid multi-classes, and a stalker is a ranger kit.
2. Stalker-clerics were allowed in SoA, you could create them and play through with them in SoA, so why are they suddenly banned in ToB? A stalker-cleric which continues on into ToB loses his backstab and is still restricted to leather armor, isn't even given the opportunity to pick an alternative ranger kit.
3. The reason has nothing to do with ranger-clerics specifically not being allowed, or ranger kits dualled to clerics specifically not being allowed, because ranger/cleric multi-classes, rangers dualled to clerics, and beastmasters dualled to cleric are still allowed in ToB.
4. Nor does the reason have to do with their being overpowered. They were one of the best class combos in SoA but there are numerous other classes and class combos which could be argued to be better.
5. The stalker-cleric was one of the more interesting, dynamic, and unique class combos in SoA. I don't think there were any other CRPG's other than SoA which showcased the stalker-cleric.

--Riverwind

Rogue · Post by **Rogue** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 7:05 am

They only have TWO weapons they can backstab with, so whats the point? A Club and a Quarterstaff, Stalker-Clerics are utterly POINTLESS man, all you get is improved stealth and 3 extra spells that a mage can cast sooner and better...

Sabre · Post by **Sabre** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 7:20 am

Why don't you just delete the DUALCLAS.2DA file from the Override directory - this will get it back to what it was in SoA, which mean you can have Stalker-Cleric and Archer-Cleric

Uther Pendragon · Post by **Uther Pendragon** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 10:20 am

Originally posted by Rogue:
<STRONG>They only have TWO weapons they can backstab with, so whats the point? A Club and a Quarterstaff, Stalker-Clerics are utterly POINTLESS man, all you get is improved stealth and 3 extra spells that a mage can cast sooner and better...</STRONG>

You obviously haven't play one yet. Have you played a straight Ranger/Cleric?

If you have, than you just how awesome one can be. Now picture that PC with x4 backstab with say, the staff of the ram +6 (THAC0 6 Dmg. 1d6 +12 +1d4 piercing with a 15% of being knocked back and stunned with each strike. All this and a speed factor of 1!). Able to cast haste on all your skeleton warriors (believe me, it makes a difference). And you still get all the Cleric and Druid spells!!

This DC is a soloist's dream Believe me, I know. I have one still from SoA install, and he is one of my 3 best characters.

Astafas · Post by **Astafas** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 10:23 am

Originally posted by Rogue:
<STRONG>They only have TWO weapons they can backstab with, so whats the point? A Club and a Quarterstaff, Stalker-Clerics are utterly POINTLESS man, all you get is improved stealth and 3 extra spells that a mage can cast sooner and better...</STRONG>

There are several very good clubs and staves. Start for example with Blackblood and then go for the Staff of Ram. The Stalker/Cleric also get a backstab multiplier in addition to the spells. Do you see the point now? Maybe you should try this class before saying it's pointless.

seanthony · Post by **seanthony** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 10:37 am

yeah man! haha.. Ranger/Cleric rocks!!! haha.. i mean, serious.. they are so good.. its like a fighter/cleric with an edge. I mean, u get both druidic and clerical spells.. and u get to backstab too! and the staff of the ram makes a difference!

in ToB, i created a new R/C and it was smooth sailing for me. I think I used a Flail mainly (Flail of Ages) or something.. but yeah.. it was good fun.

Andrew Shih · Post by **Andrew Shih** » Sat Aug 18, 2001 2:54 pm

The Stalker/Cleric is weak? I don't think so. In case any of you didn't try this combo in SoA when it was still allowed....

--Riverwind

[reprinted by permission of the author]

-------------------------------------------------------
STALKER/CLERIC (9-19) "The Stealth Bomber"
-------------------------------------------------------
THACO: 4 (85%)
HP: 146
AC: 3
# ATTACKS: 3
WEAPONS: [Cleric Weapons]
SPELLBOOK: C/D-11/11/9/9/6/4/2
IMMUNITIES/RESISTANCES: None
SAVING THROWS: 2/6/5/8/7
SPECIAL SKILLS/ABILITIES: Triple Backstab, Stealth, Racial Enemy, Charm Animal, Turn Undead
PROGRESSION: Early Transition
DIFFICULTY: Advanced
COMMENTARY: With stealth and sanctuary, no one can see him coming, and when he strikes, the Stalker/Cleric gets triple backstab, dual-wield with 3 attacks/round, a low THACO, Turn Undead, and a Racial Enemy. He has access to the full range of druid as well as cleric spells, allowing him to cast offensive spells such as "Call Lightning" or "Holy Smite," combos such as "Sanctuary/Blade Barrier," assassination spells such as "Slay Living,: defensive combos such as "Iron Skins/Full Heal," and anti-mage spells such as "Insect Plague." Even though he lacks thief skills other than backstab, this character is definitely capable of going it alone. The Stalker-Cleric is limited to studded leather armor. However, he can heal as necessary when he is injured, which will not happen that often, given that half the time the monsters won't be able to see him. The Stalker-Cleric has tons of hit points and fairly low saving throws. Finally, he can cast the mass destruction spell: "Firestorm."
RATING: 'A-'

Uther Pendragon · Post by **Uther Pendragon** » Tue Aug 21, 2001 12:26 pm

*Applauds*

Well done, Riverwind. However, I would rate the Stalker/Cleric at an A, as opposed to your rating of A-.

[EDIT] Could you imagine how amazing the Stalker/Cleric AKA "Stealth Bomber"

would be if you could multiclass him/her?

[ 08-21-2001: Message edited by: Uther Pendragon ]