Jack

shana · Post by **shana** » Fri Jul 15, 2005 9:12 pm

I read on one of the threads here that some of us believe Jack is behind everything that happens in the game. Well...tonight while Jack was giving my PC "Just the basics" he told me to come to the Last Round and he would explain how "Jacked up" the whole situation was. I thought this might be some clever foreshadowing. What do y'all think?

Faust · Post by **Faust** » Fri Jul 15, 2005 9:19 pm

Mild Spoilers

It might be, though it sounds more like an expression. There is quite a bit of foreshadowing in the game, though (well at least some). E. mentions that the Jack is about to come out of the box, and the caitiff with the gift of insight actually doesn't list Jack as among those you can trust, just off the top of my head. The writers were clever in leaving little clues throughout the game for things such as that.

yrthwyndandfyre · Post by **yrthwyndandfyre** » Fri Jul 15, 2005 9:40 pm

[QUOTE=shana]I read on one of the threads here that some of us believe Jack is behind everything that happens in the game. Well...tonight while Jack was giving my PC "Just the basics" he told me to come to the Last Round and he would explain how "Jacked up" the whole situation was. I thought this might be some clever foreshadowing. What do y'all think?[/QUOTE]

In fairness, it's not "some of us". It's mostly me, and some people are willing to entertain my ideas. Not even I have ever been able to substantively prove that Jack is the ring-leader. I don't wish to implicate any of the other trusting participants in my own personal delusion out of fiat. I just said I could make a convincing argument for that theory. However, as foreshadowing goes, that is simply another thing that seems to point in the same direction, much as E.'s crack about the "Jack coming out of the box" does. There are a lot of coincidences that either point in that direction, or that are extremely convenient accidents.

Melchiah · Post by **Melchiah** » Sat Jul 16, 2005 10:51 am

Well I think the real ring-leader is the cabbie (no matter who you think he is) and that he is using Jack as an instrument because at the end Jack tells the cabbie:"it happened just like you said it would"

Nevertheless Jack is the number one manipulator in the game (not counting the cabbie)

yrthwyndandfyre · Post by **yrthwyndandfyre** » Sat Jul 16, 2005 1:42 pm

Actually, Jack is telling that to Messerach, which leads me to believe that he was a little wonky in life, or maybe he inadvertently diablorized a Malkavian. He does, when making that crack, look at Messerach, and then comment that the mummy "doesn't say much". There are plenty of clues in his previous conversations to suggest that Smilin' Jack is, shall we say, about fifteen cards shy of a full deck.

Melchiah · Post by **Melchiah** » Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:52 am

If Jack isn't adressing the cabbie then why does the cabbie reply to Jack?

I don't think Jack is insane, he just has a pretty twisted sense of humour that's all, when he is talking to Messerach it's just gloating about his victory over Lacroix and Ming and the "You don't talk much do you"-comment is just meant as a joke towards everyone who thought Messerach was an antediluvian, he doesn't really expect Messerach to talk back.

And if Jack was really "a few bricks short of a full building" I doubt he would have been able to plan everything that happens (at least not without guidance from the cabbie)

yrthwyndandfyre · Post by **yrthwyndandfyre** » Sun Jul 17, 2005 3:36 pm

Actually, the likelihood that Jack was an inveterate genius, a brilliant strategist, and altogether crazy isn't that unlikely. Genius and insanity are ever comfortable bedfellows. Not necessarily because geniuses have a tendency to be crazy, but because sanity is generally not defined by geniuses, but rather by people to whom geniuses are wholly incomprehensible.

pennypincher · Post by **pennypincher** » Sun Jul 17, 2005 5:21 pm

It could likley be more easily explained:

Jack talks to corpses because he was a scum sucking pirate low life for many years and has the humanity of your average serial killer, rapist, murderous theif and villian. Remember, they called him "Smilin Jack" because he seemed usualy cheery for a psycopath, not because he was a nice guy... I'm a nice guy, I smile... Nobody calls me smiling Nic, but you can bet your life they would if I started slaughtering entier cruise shipes wholesale while happily greeting people warmly.

It's probable, if not down right obvious, that Jacks humanity would be cutting it fine on the edges of 3-4. He likes killing vampires, he likes destorying buildings, he loves beating up punks... Hes line of what is right and wrong is freyed and withered at best, and so he likley finds very little difference bewteen talking to the living and talking to the dead... Neither have anything to say that interests his feral mind any more short of "Here, drink my blood." or "Jack, lets go beat the hell out of some people.".

As for if he was adressing the cabbie or not with his last statements... Lets look at it from two points of view and break down the facts:

The Cabbie was hidden, likley using Obfuscate. Jack is Brujah, and so his chances of having Auspex is slim and his chances of wanting it... Slightly slimmer still. After all, how does being able to see auras help you pound in a guys skull? However, it's not impossable that he learnt it along the way to more easily out smart people... So what are the chances he just HAPPENED to be using it when the cabbied snuck up on him? Slim also, but again not impossable.

If the cabbie is, as some folks insist, Caine... Then it's impossable for Jack to have known he was there. Out and out impossable. No if's/and's/or's or but's.... Can not happen, no sir, no way. If Caine doesn't want to be seen, he wont be seen... By anyone, full stop. Caine only has two Discplines "Yes" and "No"... If he wants something to be he uses Yes, and if he doesn't he uses No. Unless Caine wanted Jack to know he was there... Which would have just as easily been achived by being visable and next to him... Jack would have been yacking happily with the corpse of some acient king and never have even known Caine ever spoke a word.

If the cabbie is just a nut case, a Ravnos who has a grudge against the prince or a vampire with delusions of grandure, then it's possable Jack was talking to him, but more likley that the Vampires made his presence known when he thought it was time in order to... I don't know... Annoy Jack? Pass on some idiot wisdom without much meaning that the Brujah might enjoy? Ramble madness? Be dramatic? Either way...