Way back in Redemption, I sucked dry so many vampires that Christof should have become a Tremere Regent in the first third of the game and a Methuselah by the second. If Diablerie was implemented at all...
In Bloodlines, it is greatly accounted for, so in the entire game you cannot suck even on a lowliest shovelhead.
From what I've heard about the PnP game, it should not be either of those extreme cases, so I guess I ought to be able to feed at least on the lower generation vampires and any others with blood weaker then own.
PnP players, what do you think?
ROMERO: If you should see any zombies in that time, you need to put them down. Just don't let them bite you.
PC: Why? Do you turn into a zombie if they bite you?
ROMERO: Naw, it just hurts like a bitch.
It depends a lot on how you run your game. I'm not a power gamer, and I don't really run a campaign that allows for much of that. As such, diablerie is an anathema. It is very taboo, and most vampires are aware that there will be some repercussions even if they feed on a lowly vampire. Now if I was to present an opportunity for greater power...well, then, the temptation might be somewhat greater. However, I've known others who play diablerie centered campaigns.
Regardless, I don't think diablerie is ever something that should be approached casually in a campaign (even in the latter type of campaign). To do so really undermines the pnp universe White Wolf created. It is a very big deal to suck the essence out of another vampire. It's a big deal because you essentially *take on* the essence of that vampire. Particularly if they were more powerful than you, diablerie can have significant ramifications (in radical cases, you are eventually controlled by the other vampire, particularly if they were significantly lower in generation than you). Secondly, the more powerful your blood becomes, the bigger target you become (particularly by the Sabbat). And, finally, diablerie is considered a horrible crime in Camarilla and Anarch society. If you're found out, you'll generally be slain or hunted by the Prince (or Baron) of a city.
In general, Bloodlines is far closer to the pnp game than Redemption (that’s true across the board). Redemption features far too many vampires, for starters. It's simply not likely that a character would face 100s of actual vampires as Christof and company do. Moreover, the moral dilemma of diablerie should have been more prominently featured. You don't simply chew on another vampire for sustenance, unless there is simply no other option. Having the player character succumb or resist the temptation of diablerie could have enriched Bloodlines. However, it's certainly not a vital thing to have in the game.
So, esentially, in Redemption they got it wrong, and Bloodlines has a more correct approach to it, but neither game actually implements it...?
Indeed it might be interesting to have such opportunities... but I guess computer game mechanics couldn't cope with such a complex matter, so probably the concept remains exclusive to the PnP games
ROMERO: If you should see any zombies in that time, you need to put them down. Just don't let them bite you.
PC: Why? Do you turn into a zombie if they bite you?
ROMERO: Naw, it just hurts like a bitch.
I can't see Diablerie as an immense technological problem. All you really need are variably-sized arrays, which, in a game like this, would be pretty much slam-dunk if it was done in C, C++, or C#. Of course, you're not allowed to collect more than one of any weapon, which I do find mystifing - there is no reason for it unless you are in a 'stunned monkey' language which would make variably-sized arrays all but impossible, and thus make diablerie all but impossible to implement.
I do, however, tend to favor Faust on this one. Diablerie is a great deal more than a game in the WoD, and as such, it should not be readily available.
Sic gorgiamos allos subjectatos nunc
(The Addams family motto: Gladly we feast on those who would subdue us)
Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy, and good with Ketchup.
Well, I didn't think it would be a technological problem. I more thought of rules subsystem which seems to be a stripped-down PnP version. Especially it would be hard to support all the possibilities - something like, I think, pennypincher said about how he would use Potence to do stuff simply not implemented in the game, but possible by the PnP rules and with human players. Software just has its limits, it cannot reinterpret the rules in that way. I can't imagine how could all that be acomplished; using neural networks?
Anyways, maybe it's for the best. The current set of scripts is apparently swarming with bugs even still, so what would happen if someone tries something yet so more complex?
I do, however, tend to favor Faust on this one. Diablerie is a great deal more than a game in the WoD, and as such, it should not be readily available.
I agree with that. For one reason or the other it's simply not something to be thrown in a computer game.
ROMERO: If you should see any zombies in that time, you need to put them down. Just don't let them bite you.
PC: Why? Do you turn into a zombie if they bite you?
ROMERO: Naw, it just hurts like a bitch.
Yeah, I have no problem with it being thrown in the game. It just needs to be dealt with "seriously" if it is thrown in the game. Meaning, you only have some select opportunities to do it, and these opportunities have a distinct effect on the character. Perhaps, as a plot device, that marks your character in some way. So, yeah, mechanically it wouldn't be a big deal. But to do it right, you'd have to add another dimension to the game.
I reckon there was a patch for that... Bloody awful... Redemption game to allow The Anathema, or Diablerie. However as pointed out, that skips the very basic principal behind it...
Every act of Diablerie costs a point of humanity and requires a check for a second! It's the greatest act of pure, self indulgent evil! To take the soul of another living being or vampire and pull it from them and damm it for an eternity of oblivion being used as a quick fix for your desire for pleasure or power! Blam!
However, Bloodlines mostly handles it in the manner I imagine real vampires would handle it. They don't tell you a lot about it. Why, if you were an Elder vampire, would you EVER tell your Childe that they can suck your soul out to gain your amazing powers?? I sure wouldn't!!
"I know your trapped for an eternity as my lesser, with no hope of ever being the top dog... But I like you enough to tell you that you can suck my soul out of me and gain my strength.. Just don't okay?"
HARDLY!!
I imagine most neonates know jack **** about Diablerie. Maybe they've heard that the Sabbat do it, and it's evil, and you'll be killed if you try it, but I can't imagine they would have the foggiest idea of WHAT to do. Maybe if they hang out with Anarachs and Sabbat a bit someone might fill them in, but a good little Cammerilla Vampire would prolly never get told because that kind of info would only be passed down the chain when it was important for someone to know... And I wouldn't be suprised if it was a matter of: It's important for Bob to know about Diablerie now for him to carry out this task for us, and when he's done we can prove he knows too much about Diablerie and have him killed.
Also, Diablerie has so many Tells that it makes it very difficult to get away with. Your aura is laced with black and pusling red veines, you feel creepy and "wrong" somehow, you take on characteristics of the person whos soul you drained... Give me good honest blood drinking any day! Much safer!
If Diablerie was implemented at all...