Strange Incident Upon Entering Downtown: Explanation?

Knox · Post by **Knox** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 2:55 pm

I have recently entered the Hollywood district and completed some of the quests there, but I would like to share a very bizarre happening that occured when I first gained access to Downtown some time ago.

In the first few minutes of my exploring this new Downtown area (this is my first time playing the game), a Sabbat thug ran past, clutching a knife. I jogged after him for a couple blocks, thinking crime might be a part of Downtown and that perhaps I'd get to see him mug somebody. Then, quite out of the blue, a random NPC (one of the fellows in the black jackets, similarly dressed to Knox (to whom I share no relation)) spin-kicks the thug and kills him! Then the NPC runs away, bent over, gasping for breath as if something were after him (the same behavior NPCs exhibit if you threaten them). :laugh:

The streets of Downtown have been quiet ever since. Have any of you ever experienced anything similar, as far as wacky, unrelated events? What could cause something like this to happen? Thanks!

Woozaii · Post by **Woozaii** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:16 pm

OOPS!!! Double posting!

Woozaii · Post by **Woozaii** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:16 pm

A glitch in the game engine. It happens lots of times, in all areas. Its probaly something like the sabbat thug is hostile (or something. I am far from sure). And npc attacks hostile sabbat thug, but when npc sees a dead body, they panic because thats what they are set to do.

And welcome to gamebanshee.com Knox

. (This is becoming a habit

)

Wrath · Post by **Wrath** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 3:26 pm

heh that happened to me too... many times

I also got suprised at the first time

Knox · Post by **Knox** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 4:02 pm

[QUOTE=Woozaii]A glitch in the game engine. It happens lots of times, in all areas. Its probaly something like the sabbat thug is hostile (or something. I am far from sure). And npc attacks hostile sabbat thug, but when npc sees a dead body, they panic because thats what they are set to do.

And welcome to gamebanshee.com Knox

. (This is becoming a habit

)[/QUOTE]

Haha, really? I wish I'd caught it more than that one time... I got a real kick out of it.

What drives the NPC to attack a hostile thug, though? I mean, in what event would they need to attack someone at all? After all, if I present a threat, they just run/hide.

I'm glad to've finally joined after reading for awhile, now. Thanks for the welcome!

yrthwyndandfyre · Post by **yrthwyndandfyre** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 6:47 pm

[QUOTE=Knox]IIn the first few minutes of my exploring this new Downtown area (this is my first time playing the game), a Sabbat thug ran past, clutching a knife. I jogged after him for a couple blocks, thinking crime might be a part of Downtown and that perhaps I'd get to see him mug somebody. Then, quite out of the blue, a random NPC (one of the fellows in the black jackets, similarly dressed to Knox (to whom I share no relation)) spin-kicks the thug and kills him! Then the NPC runs away, bent over, gasping for breath as if something were after him (the same behavior NPCs exhibit if you threaten them). :laugh: [/QUOTE]
What you are experiencing is the artifact of an ongoing gang-war in LA. That's not a Sabbat thug. Those are two rival Kine street gangs. You periodically catch them in little scrimmages like that, but to date I've found no particular use from them except taking and pawning the weapons the dead ones leave behind.

Knox · Post by **Knox** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 7:48 pm

[QUOTE=yrthwyndandfyre]What you are experiencing is the artifact of an ongoing gang-war in LA. That's not a Sabbat thug. Those are two rival Kine street gangs. You periodically catch them in little scrimmages like that, but to date I've found no particular use from them except taking and pawning the weapons the dead ones leave behind.[/QUOTE]

Wow! That's so interesting I might think you're pulling my leg... if you didn't seem to be a prominent member around here.

Is this documented somewhere?

yrthwyndandfyre · Post by **yrthwyndandfyre** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 8:23 pm

[QUOTE=Knox]Wow! That's so interesting I might think you're pulling my leg... if you didn't seem to be a prominent member around here.

Is this documented somewhere?[/QUOTE]
Not to my knowledge. It's just a personal observation. If you look, the ones involved in these scrimmages tend to hang around street corners and alley mouths, and if you look long enough, both sides wear 'colors'. They always fight with conventional weapons, never display any powers, and in all other respects are just normal street thugs. Some of them share clothing similarities with Sabbat, but the number of character models in the game is somewhat restricted.

If any of them were Sabbat, well, let's just say that the Sabbat aren't shy about using their powers and don't generally "get it on" with common gangland trash unless they're recruiting new shovelheads. No, this is just a common, garden-variety gang war. You're new, so these incidents are doubtless interesting to you. I see these skirmishes all the time. In a single game, you'll probably see (or hear) a couple of dozen. Listen for the swish of a blade, or unaccountable gunfire.

If the character you were following were a vampire, do you think a common street thug could kill it with *single* spin-kick? That's just not happening. Mercurio survived a beat down by at least 5 armed thugs who were impressed by his resilence, and he's just a ghoul.

Knox · Post by **Knox** » Mon Dec 19, 2005 9:56 pm

[QUOTE=yrthwyndandfyre]If the character you were following were a vampire, do you think a common street thug could kill it with *single* spin-kick? That's just not happening. Mercurio survived a beat down by at least 5 armed thugs who were impressed by his resilence, and he's just a ghoul.[/QUOTE]

Ah, well, I wasn't under the impression they were vampires, just the Kine working for the Sabbat (at least, I recall this was the case) that I'd seen in the warehouse I had blown up not long before. When I questioned the friend who had introduced me to the game about the thuggish guys on Downtown's street corner, that was what he explained them as being. However, after this thread and further observation, it looks like he was mistaken.

I spent a lot of time exploring Downtown's backalleys this evening and finally got to witness one gang member shouting "freeze!" at a guy spray painting a wall, then taking him down with a knife. I'll definitely keep an eye out for future instances of gang war, though my very first random spin-kick kill will always be close to my heart!

pennypincher · Post by **pennypincher** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 4:59 pm

It does happen from time to time. I've had kine make efforts to kill each other... Often right in the mouth of the backstreets I would have liked to use for feeding... Selfish buggers!

On a side note, isn't it curious that all hobos in America are martial arts masters? Go ahead, dominate or dementate a group of them and watch them... Not just round house kick each other... But Leap Through The Air, dealing fatal flying round house kicks to the brain cases of their former friends.

Needless to say, hilarity ensues!

yrthwyndandfyre · Post by **yrthwyndandfyre** » Fri Dec 23, 2005 2:33 pm

Martial Arts Masters

[QUOTE=pennypincher] On a side note, isn't it curious that all hobos in America are martial arts masters? Go ahead, dominate or dementate a group of them and watch them... Not just round house kick each other... But Leap Through The Air, dealing fatal flying round house kicks to the brain cases of their former friends.[/QUOTE]
Actually, that's not that unlikely. The Ko-Budo martial arts popped up in the far east in response to oppression by the feudal lords of the time. Kappuera popped up in South America among the slaves to defend themselves from the slave-masters. Kung Fu was developed by monks who wanted to protect themselves during their wanderings. Savate was developed among French peasantry to protect themselves against the royal armies. Hapkido was developed among Korean peasants to protect themselves from their overlords.

The only martial arts that have been developed specifically for warfare are those that use obvious weapons. Archery, Swordsmanship, Firearms, Knife-fighting, and so forth.

The martial arts that depend on non-obvious weapons generally developed among repressed people. Thus the Sai, Tonfa, one-, two-, and three-section staffs, spike and chain, Shaken, Shuriken, Nunchaku and so forth.

The ones that found ways to use non-obvious weaponry in useful ways were the ones that weren't permitted to carry obvious weaponry. That's why a good martial artist can find any number of weapons within arms reach, from a play-boy magazine to a key-chain to a radio antenna.

I have perhaps 30 weapons within two meters of me as I type this, and you could be sitting right beside me at this moment, and not be able to spot a single one of them. One of them is the chair you are sitting on. Another is the keyboard I'm typing on.

pennypincher · Post by **pennypincher** » Tue Dec 27, 2005 10:46 pm

Yes yes, I know, I've done martial arts as well... In fact it was a ninjitsu instructor who insisted that we name 10 items in the room that could be used to kill a person (And he did NOT find people pointing out "That crossed pair of swords" very funny.) before we could progress to using standard ones... His theory being that the only person who every really mastered using a weapon was a person who would never really need one. However:

I doubt very much the existence of hobo-fu... Short maybe of a tendency to push people over and kick them in the stomach a lot, or smash an empty bottle and "shank" them... In modern society. I also GREATLY doubt the physical prowess of most hobos to the extent of leaping into the air and turning their body full circle for flying kicks to the head. We are talking about people who mostly eat left over McDonalds and drink Metho...

yrthwyndandfyre · Post by **yrthwyndandfyre** » Wed Dec 28, 2005 2:15 pm

[QUOTE=pennypincher] I doubt very much the existence of hobo-fu... Short maybe of a tendency to push people over and kick them in the stomach a lot, or smash an empty bottle and "shank" them... In modern society. I also GREATLY doubt the physical prowess of most hobos to the extent of leaping into the air and turning their body full circle for flying kicks to the head. We are talking about people who mostly eat left over McDonalds and drink Metho...[/QUOTE]
The hobos never fight of their own accord. The ones using Hobo-Fu are under the direction of a vampire to expend every last iota of their life energy in one final flurry of action. They are very likely running on high adrenaline (hence the heart attacks even in the very young) and endorphine levels (thus insensate to pain - even the pain their actions would otherwise inflict in themselves). Just what would you be capable of? We've all heard the stories of slight mothers moving cars by themselves to save their children (and trust me - that is no urban legend).

So 90 seconds, superhuman strength and speed, no pain, no consequence, heavy euphoria, no self-control, and jacked up on two of the most powerful drugs in the world - you could do pretty much anything - up to and including shoving cars aside. Such a foe would be a formidable adversary even for a vampire for the few seconds they had left. Even if they were a hobo.

Physical prowess is not a simple function of musculature and training. People jacked up on PCP have been known to survive for several minutes with wounds that should have been incapacitating or even fatal. It's fairly easy to assume that normal is always normal, but I've actually seen a man standing inside a bonfire for a full minute without so much as singing a hair - no tricks - he was just cold enough that it took that long for him to warm up to the point where the fire became dangerous. In extraordinary conditions, people readily do extraordinary, even unbelievable things.

Wesp5 · Post by **Wesp5** » Sat Apr 16, 2011 10:54 am

yrthwyndandfyre wrote:What you are experiencing is the artifact of an ongoing gang-war in LA. That's not a Sabbat thug. Those are two rival Kine street gangs.

Exactly. Troika even named the two groups "Jets" and "Sharks" in the level file! I guess it's to give some real random behaviour downtown, similat to STALKERs hyped up "A-Life".

Anicsin · Post by **Anicsin** » Tue Apr 26, 2011 6:58 am

Hmmm... Maybe Chuck Norris himself is a vampire...?

Rad · Post by **Rad** » Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:01 pm

Anicsin wrote:Hmmm... Maybe Chuck Norris himself is a vampire...?

If Chuck Norris was a vampire, he wouldn't have to worry about sunshine, sunshine would have to worry about him...

Curry · Post by **Curry** » Tue Apr 26, 2011 1:56 pm

You guys realize this is a 2005 thread?

Anicsin · Post by **Anicsin** » Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:52 am

it doesn't matter