Important GameBanshee Decision

fable · Post by **fable** » Wed Apr 18, 2001 6:58 pm

Buck, I know what you mean about advertising not doing it for you. My question is this: do you think you could make the needed revenue off equipment and walkthrough materials? I'm inclined to doubt that--call me a cynic, but I suspect most players will simply check out websites that offer those features free, while still posting on your boards.

The main concern I have about signing up for Flashlink isn't the money, but my anonymity. I strongly suspect that Flashlink will take a list of subscribers and sell it everywhere, and I'll end up getting tons of junkmail. This has happened before; subscription sites make money in this fashion.

Still, I'm open to any arguments on this issue (or most others, heh). I like your website, and if a certain Other BG2 Website Board Which Has Vanished were to suddenly reappear tomorrow, I'd continue posting here, as my primary board of interest. I don't object to the cash. I do question the folks I don't know, in the service I've never tried.

Zfalcon · Post by **Zfalcon** » Wed Apr 18, 2001 8:24 pm

Hi Fable,

I am one of the originators of Flashlink and I can guarantee that we don't sell anyones e-mail address or any other personal information. We have a privacy policy posted at http://www.flashlink.com/index.php?p=privacy that you can take a look at. If the Policy isn't clear enough in stating that the only thing we use the information we get from you for is to verify the credit card being used is yours, then I need to change it to make it clearer. The last thing we want is for people to have to worry about receiving e-mail spam or anything else they didn't want because they signed up for a Flashlink account.

Flashlink came about because of my websites (hqgaming.com, aoe2.com, and diablo2.com) not making enough to cover bandwidth costs, and I couldn't afford to pay over $ 3500.00 per month out of my own pocket to keep them going. We searched for numerous solutions and tried everything you can think of, from banners, to popups, to donations on my sites. None of these things were able come close to covering the insane costs of bandwidth I had each month. I talked with some other webmasters that I knew and found that everyone was having the same problem, and after trying to think of what we could do to keep our sites online (and not go broke personally paying for the bandwidth) Flashlink was created.

Flashlink isn't a big company looking to make a lot of money, its just a group of webmasters who don't want to see their sites that they love go offline. Simply, without Flashlink this is what would have happened to my sites just due to cost.

I hope this answers your question, and if you have any other comments or questions about Flashlink and our Privacy Policy, don't hesitate to ask. I can be reached at davids@flashlink.com.

Sincerely,
David Suit - Flashlink

Flagg · Post by **Flagg** » Wed Apr 18, 2001 11:55 pm

One of my concerns with this new system is the payment system. To what extent will this service be available to people that either don't have a creditcard or are not willing to use their creditcard over the internet?

Manveru · Post by **Manveru** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 2:33 am

@Flagg - And it is very good point. I haven't got credit card.

So what about people without it ?

Torotorotorotix · Post by **Torotorotorotix** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 3:10 am

Originally posted by Manveru:
@Flagg - And it is very good point. I haven't got credit card.

So what about people without it ?

Well, I don't have a creditcard either. I may not be an exalted member, but I am part of the 'public' as well. Actually, I think there are more of the like of me than of the regulars here...
So it would mean shutting out passers-by and passers-by-that-stick (like yours truly) as well as people with no credit card.
It may be cheap, but still, asking fee for walkthroughs and the like (however good they may be) sounds a little desperate. A guide may be more expensive, but it feels better to have a solid paperback in your hands than knowing you have to pay no matter how many times you will visit a website...

Flagg · Post by **Flagg** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 3:39 am

Originally posted by Torotorotorotix:
It may be cheap, but still, asking fee for walkthroughs and the like (however good they may be) sounds a little desperate. A guide may be more expensive, but it feels better to have a solid paperback in your hands than knowing you have to pay no matter how many times you will visit a website...

One minor correction, Flashlink is a service composed of a conglomeration of gaming sites. In other words you would not only have access to GameBanshee, if GameBanshee joins, but also to the other sites included in Flashlink.

TheDeacon · Post by **TheDeacon** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 4:49 am

I think one important aspect is forgotten here. The Net is moving from a free service to a paid service. Many of the large websites are dropping like flies. Ad-revenues are dropping like crazy, and no site can survive without turning towards a paid service.

I estimate that before the end of the year at least 20% of the sites a random person is using today will have a paid area. That will increase to almost 80% within 2 years. The other 20% have either another source of income or a very generous sponsor.

I guess bundeling them in an initiative like Flaslink is a good way to offer sites like GB a source of income and on the other hand giving the public low-cost access to several websites.

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 8:00 am

I estimate that before the end of the year at least 20% of the sites a random person is using today will have a paid area. That will increase to almost 80% within 2 years. The other 20% have either another source of income or a very generous sponsor.

Not meaning to contradict you, Deacon, but where are you getting these figures from?

Torotorotorotix · Post by **Torotorotorotix** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 8:00 am

Originally posted by TheDeacon:
Many of the large websites are dropping like flies. Ad-revenues are dropping like crazy, and no site can survive without turning towards a paid service.

Maybe you're right-- I hope not, because I won't be joining the rest of the world then. I refuse to pay simply because I might or might not possibly maybe visit a site. Internet sites are no phone companies.

cheesemage · Post by **cheesemage** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 10:40 am

yet again the social evolution of man turns up again, all things start nearly cost free, a convince. But no matter what money effects all, no matter what happens there is going to be no way to stop this. Monoplys will form, then the internet will be owned by a group of people, it wont be shared, pay to go online, look at aol when it first started, now look at it now. I dont know when it will happen but it surley will, why because people arent clicking on banners, popups, so the people who run the site have two options eventually, either shut down the site, or do something like this. Humanity, always motivated by one thing money. I'm not saying the people who run this program are, no the people they have to pay are. It all comes down to this.............

Loredweller · Post by **Loredweller** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 11:49 am

First i must say i am sorry. Sorry for that common trend on internet.
The second thought i have is about fishing. First you feed the fish, then, when there is many enough ...

The third - some of posters (name only Fable, Craig, Pope, Edwin and many others, cannot remember in haste, begging pardon) should rather be paid instead of being charged

If they are gone there is no list.
The fourth - there was almost no sites i'd left my e-mail without privacy policy and vows. What i see in my mailbox is what i see in my mailbox ...

So, never say never, although i rather shall be out if it is paid service. There are enough services you cannot live without, it is very sweet if somewhere you aren't reminded about money. The very air what matters. I do not grudge about money, i can pay, i'd rather like not to think about it.
Maybe my problem is i've been in software business for time long enough to see the shift, say, form brotherhood to market, some kind of nostalgia perhaps

If i imagine the position of site owners, i'd rather understand them. If you're skilled in fishing you might consider to make it your profession. If so, you should use professional tools and you should earn at least for bread if not for butter. The money in most cases is not the central concern, most usually there is a wish to make customers happy with your service. Stick has two ends. It is way most of successful freeware goes.
I just wonder what Bioware and Interplay particularly and gaming industry as such is thinking. I have been on their list and site, i like Gamebanshee (and BGD) better. For one thing they should be interested in keeping such communities together, it is one of the best forms of advertisement besides the other aspects. I have known interesting games what failed because of lack of due care about player community. Mightn't there some support be find?
Two more aspects, if i haven't driven you tired.

The first. Most of the population there is dependent people not free with their (i'd say their parents') money. One thing is to buy a game on occasion to, say, Christmas, the other might be regular expenses, you know

The second. There always will be upstarts who will wish to do the same for free with joy, even for sport, to prove themselves or to live in the game world a bit more. Isn't it a way this site is raised? Other side of the coin is there altogether is enough of commercial sites, GameSpot only as example ( also of free services). You are going to challenge them, aren't you? Are you ready?
Certainly your site should become better (or looking so) if it'd become commercial. Will there be more of at least the same number of visitors? I'm not sure, i'd rather doubt.
It's always worth think twice if somebody is suggesting "you will do what you must and become what you must..."

Decisions is yours, of course. Good luck and thanks for this site in any case.
Just MO, moreover unarranged

L.

koz-ivan · Post by **koz-ivan** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 12:27 pm

actually i'm a bit suprised it took this long, the flashlink bit seems like a devil's bargin to say the least. will i pay to continue, not sure, which is too bad 'cause this is a pretty good site. but on the other hand there are only so many sites i can pay use...

i wish you the best of luck.

and one question - is / will flashlink be compatible w/ pay pal? if it is that should help w/ the folks who don't have / want to use credit cards, or how aboput a snail mail solution?

A Player · Post by **A Player** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 1:56 pm

As they say, do what ya gotta do. I wouldn't be willing to pay for the equipment lists or things like that, but I might be willing to pay for stuff like message board access. That's definately worth money.

Equis · Post by **Equis** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 2:18 pm

Hey everyone,

I just wanted to point something out quick, for those concerned about payment methods. Check out this [url="http://www.flashlink.com/index.php?p=thecost"]payment link[/url] on flashlink.

I'm not familiar with all of them, but the important one to note is personal check. I am not a big fan of credit cards and until my bank started using check cards, I never had one. I have used personal checks for payments in the past and its as simple as an automatic withdrawl from your checking account.

I don't see PayPal listed but it may be something we can get Flashlink to consider.

A Player · Post by **A Player** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 2:30 pm

Ya know, I think this could work, provided it generates enough income. I'm warming up to this idea.

The_Pope · Post by **The_Pope** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 2:32 pm

Hmmm... It might indeed be a bit naive to think people will pay to be able to read the walkthrough etc, no matter how good this one is. There are plenty of other sites that offer these kind of things for free...

But what I've always been wondering, how come sites are that expensive? Couldn't you just move it to a non ".com/.org/.net" location? I really don't know squat about these things...

Torotorotorotix · Post by **Torotorotorotix** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 2:39 pm

I'm still suspiciously cold, so please warn me when you guys start "selling your soul", so I can abandon ship in time. :\

cheesemage · Post by **cheesemage** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 3:41 pm

So Sayeh The Wise Aluando (The Future web site)

You grew up in the information forrtress of flash link along with diablo 2.com, all was well until your website owner was slain by a your own brother site. You are a product of a the time of troubles when gamebanshee was forced to somehow make money to support the site, one such site updater saw his own unemployment and left a score of mortal web sites in his foot steps. That site updater was Buck Satan, and you our one of his websites. Your brother wanted to become the new website owner, wirh a publicity scam of saccrifice. You killed your brother and sent his tank to back to Buck. Some susspected that you share the same lineage of your brother. You soon departed in circumstances then anyone could have suspecteed.......................

Bumm Bummm Bummm
Internets Gate 2

This is what will happen if you sign up..................

Nightmare · Post by **Nightmare** » Thu Apr 19, 2001 3:54 pm

If you are going to charge for only certain parts of the site (like items\walkthrough), will this include the forums??? The forums are the main reason I go to gamebanshee everyday. As for stuff like the walkthroughs, Gamebanshee's isn't the best. No offense, but the ones From BGDungeon are still excessable and are much better detailed and informative. The one at zdnet/gamespot have text walkthroughs of the games. The only advantage is gamebanshee has all the map (even if they are not detailed very well). Again no offense.