Oblivion compared to Morrowind (No spoilers pls)

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 7:27 pm

O.K.

I guess I've gotten caught up in the hype (and there hasn't been a decent RPG title since forever). I bought a copy of Morrowind 'game of the year addition' (A title I passed on initially because it didn't seem to offer much that The Elder Scrolls I that I did buy and play briefly)and have started playing that to see if I will be into the costs associated with upgrading computers to play Oblivion (AU$Thousands).

Don't think me too harsh (I don't like first person RPGs much as a rule) but Morrowind is frankly not inspiring me. If Oblivion isn't a BIG leap forward in terms of gameplay and vibe then I think I'll pass. Also Morrowind, patched with all the latest patches and running on a system that EXCEEDS the recommend specs significantly, chuggs and crashes with depressing regularity. If this is an indication of the likely experience with Oblivion I think I'll save my cash and pass.

So is it just a major eye candy upgrade *yawn* or does it offer more? - Curdis !

Abuse · Post by **Abuse** » Sun Apr 02, 2006 8:05 pm

I bought Morrowind when it was released, and didn't realy get into it either.

Oblivion on the other hand is alot easier to become absorbed in.
The combat is significantly improved, and the interface is more stream-lined.

The removal of the cell loading is IMO a big boost too, I just couldn't stand the periodic loads in Morrowind - they became invasive.
There are many accessability features (quick travel, objective markers, etc) that reduce the hardcore RPG nature of the game, and compact what most consider the 'fun' parts of the game into minutes rather than hours.

I also think Cyrodiil itself is alot easier to relate to, than the sometimes rather odd architecture seen in Morrowind.

Basically Oblivion has fine-tuned all the rough edges of Morrowind, turning an excellent but flawed game, into a fantastic near-perfect game.

Denethorn · Post by **Denethorn** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:16 am

My thoughts are similar to Abuse's.

There are two schools of thought: Oblivion is either a great evolution of Morrowind, or a tremendous dissapointment and ultimately inferior to Morrowind. Now while that might dissuade you, here's the trick: it seems those hardcore/obsessional Morrowind players find Oblivion a dissapointment, while those of us who found Morrowind a tad drab and dull are generally far more impressed with Oblivion.

That just seems to be the consensus though. I am really enjoying Oblivion as it improves upon the shortfalls I perceived in Morrowind - combat is far more thrilling and polished (as are almost all skills in terms of gameplay - thieving is based on shadows a la Thief with backstab damage etc.), NPCs have a far more 'identity' to them, all locations are more unique and individual giving a true sense of location, and the economy is far better handled.

Other's dislike it as it has made these improvements at the expense of the (in my opinion) slow, monotonous progression of environments in Morrowind. Oblivion features a larger landscape, but it is nowhere near as densely featured. They've gone for quality over quantity this time round, and it truly shows.

In terms of performance, the Gamebryo engine is far more scaleable and efficient than the NetImmerse utilised in Morrowind. If you have an efficient and well managed system, don't expect to see any performance problems in Oblivion. I have a system that barely scrapes minimum requirements and runs Oblivion at very luxurious graphics levels. Think AMD 2400+, 512MB RAM, 9800Pro and resolution at 1024x768, view distance at maximum, anistropic filtering 2x, anti aliasing 2x, bloom, large textures etc. Just a few concessions made in terms of shadows and the draw distance of grass etc.

In my opinion it is a vast improvement on Morrowind, but only you can really tell. So I say you should give it a try, especially since you played Morrowind with the same outlook as I

mordib · Post by **mordib** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:33 am

i actually didnt like morrowind but love oblivion. The reason for me is the immersion level, i feel like im in the game, enjoy going on country walks, find it scary in certain dungeons/ruins, finding the quests way more doable (and i actually want to do them unlike morowind in which each mission felt like a drag..)

to be fair I only gave morrowind a couple of hours of my time and never undertand the skills sytem during that time but still, for me oblivion has proven so much more. 72 hours of game play and counting...

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:22 pm

Thank You all for your replies.

It hasn't actually made the choice any easier

Tell me why I should sell my first born to play this game? - Curdis !

Babytank · Post by **Babytank** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:53 pm

I got Morrowind for cheap about 2 yeas ago, I liked it but didn't get very far. I just got stuck on a quest and was never able to figure it out. Even though I barely got through Morrowind I knew I had to get Oblivion. And I'm very very glad I did.

Phreddie · Post by **Phreddie** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:25 pm

Attention Ghosts of Ye Olde Spammers (Curdis):
Thy first born son is a man of such advanced age that selling him at the value given him by the appraisers with the antique roadshow you would not be able to cover on tenth the cost of upgrading your dusty old typewriter. My suggestion is to start haunting a rich old computer geek like Al Gore, Inventor of the Interweb, until he sacrifices his gaming computer to you.

If you like going out into the world and doing things, then going abck to cities, and hearing your exploits being discusse don the streets of the towns and cities, then Oblivion is the game for you. If you like helping people by killing things that are bothering them, then Oblivion is for you. If you like questing after magicial objects, and obtaining them through magical means, the Oblivion is for you. If you like stealing from the rich and giving to yourself, then Oblivion is for you. If you like mercilessly killing people and getting paid to do so, then Oblivion is for you. If you enjoy senseless slaughter in the style of the Roman gladiatorial arena, the Oblivion is for you. If you always awanted to be a mass murderer, the Oblivion is for you. If you always wanted to heroicly help people who you dont know, the Oblivion is for you.
If you said yes to less than three of the above questions, dont get the game; if you said yes to no more than 7 of the above questions and no less than four, you might want to consider it; If you answered yes to more than seven of the above, then Oblivion is for you.

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:19 pm

Thanks again to all the people who took the time to reply. I'm still not convinced. If I was just having a punt on an AU$89 game I'd take the risk but it is seriously a AU$2500 price tag to be able to play on a PC (I wont be going the X-Box route, even though it is cheaper). So I guess this one will be a wait till I get a bigger system anyway/budget purchase. As an aside, I probably wouldn't have time to play it anyway

. - Curdis !

fable · Post by **fable** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:08 pm

Curdis, if you'd like, I'll move this over to the MW forum with a redirect, so you can the opinions of people who would naturally tend to prefer the other game. Just let me know.

From my perspective, the benefits of MW are:

1) It runs much quicker than Oblivion, and uses less resources.
2) The game mods. Specifically, 4000+ of them. Extra quests, tweaks, NPCs, shops, tons of new features, etc.
3) Game mechanics are cheesier than Oblivion, but also make a lot more sense in some respects than the latter game.
4) Interface handling is uglier, but easier to manipulate.

You've already heard the positives about Oblivion, so I won't bother with those.

Uffda · Post by **Uffda** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:28 pm

For my opionion I like Oblivion a lot and actually am obsesed with it right now. But I guess I was the same way with Morrowind and even replayed it with about 12 different people and moded the hell out of it. But it was a REALLY GOOD game. The reason I'd say that I like Oblivion better is that it adds some of the mods that everyone liked from Morrowind. And yes, it does take some money to upgrade to play Oblivion, but if you like playing games on your computer, you won't have to worry about upgradeing for a long time, just because this game had such high specs. You wouldn't be just upgradeing JUST to play Oblivion, your upgrading to be able to play it and how many other games that will have the same specs in no time.

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 5:59 pm

[QUOTE=fable]Curdis, if you'd like, I'll move this over to the MW forum with a redirect, so you can the opinions of people who would naturally tend to prefer the other game. Just let me know.<SNIP>[/QUOTE]Thanks for the offer Fable but I think I know what I need to. I am still pottering around in Morrowind but it isn't the 'missing thrill of BG (I&II)' that I was hoping to fill and in fact I think I actually like it less than TES I!

*sigh*

I want a new really great CFRPG

*whaa* - Curdis !

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 7:59 pm

Mods, Curdis. You really need to check out all the wonderful mods that add so much flavor to the game. But it's your choice.

Foss · Post by **Foss** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 8:22 pm

[QUOTE=fable]Curdis, if you'd like, I'll move this over to the MW forum with a redirect, so you can the opinions of people who would naturally tend to prefer the other game. Just let me know.

From my perspective, the benefits of MW are:

1) It runs much quicker than Oblivion, and uses less resources.
2) The game mods. Specifically, 4000+ of them. Extra quests, tweaks, NPCs, shops, tons of new features, etc.
3) Game mechanics are cheesier than Oblivion, but also make a lot more sense in some respects than the latter game.
4) Interface handling is uglier, but easier to manipulate.

You've already heard the positives about Oblivion, so I won't bother with those.[/QUOTE]

Just to add a bit more to it. My own opinions.

I felt Morrowind had a better setting. With the lore and stuff. Not sure exactly why. One thing could be the NPC "dialog". In Oblivion it is voiceover where morrowind was simply text. But, you get far less info from NPCs in Oblivion, probably because it is voiceover. And that might be one of the things that doesn't give the same amount of setting as Morrowind, IMO.

Another thing that is some way approved but also gone the other way, is Quests.
Quests has been made more quality minded, and the objectives are better than in Morrowind. But the bad thing IMO, is that you get guided to much through them. Get to many quest updates that tells you what to do next. Where in Morrowind, you had to find out alot more on your own about a quest.
But, I think thats what some people didn't like in Morrowind, they thought it to be to hard, what to do next and stuff, so they changed that with purpose in Oblivion.
Its then just up to each person what they like the best then.

fable · Post by **fable** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 9:01 pm

Good comments.

One more: there were a lot more books written for MW, and a lot more included. Oblivion has a lot more books with different bindings, but the texts themselves appear to be only a fraction of those included in MW, with a very few new ones.

stillodium · Post by **stillodium** » Sun Apr 09, 2006 3:16 am

I hate to be the one who badmouths the game, especially seeing as i am playing it

(though that is due more to the utter lack of single player rpg's right now)

I also do not like first person rpg's, it hardly provides more immersion than third person and it deprives you of quite elementary things, like seeing your huge Nord clad in shiny plate armor decapitating some infidel with a mighty swing of his greatsword. The game does provide third person but it's more like a joke meant to remind you that it's made for first person (badly bugged, from a practical point of view).

Anyway, my main problem with it would be the new GTA feeling, the inventory is way too obviously designed for console, it quickly becomes a pain to search things in it, especially spells, the skills are peculiar, especially blade and blunt. All in all the whole game is devoid of consequences, streamlined for mindless running around and killing things. No more tough choices between what weapon skills to choose and upgrade, no more balance, only blurry lines, between knight, mage, and thief (you can even sneak in heavy armor:

)
The only thing that requires any forethought is attribute leveling, and unlike the skills were supposed to, this does not provide any immersion or sense of accomplishment, it's just a royal pain, as it succedes in taking away not only your development freedom but also the freedom to explore the world properly (you need to do things that suit your attributes, this might seem like a good thing but it is not, most times attribute development restricts you to some sort of strange multiclassing)

The game is good, and 80% of all will find it satisfying, but as an RPG it's just an attempt. (in my oppinion a Role Playing Game doesn't mean things to upgrade from time to time, it means choices, decisions and the inevitable immersion those induce, you reinvent yourself in the game)

moltovir · Post by **moltovir** » Sun Apr 09, 2006 5:16 am

Quoted from my reply in the "What do you think of TES IV"-poll:

[quote="moltovir]I voted very good"]

Basicly, what bothers me the most is that Morrowind was a pc rpg game which happened to have a console port, while Oblivion is a console game more or less 'accidently' ported to PC.

Curdis · Post by **Curdis** » Mon Apr 10, 2006 7:17 pm

Thanks to all who have taken the time to reply.

I have had a chance to spend some time with Morrowind now and here are my Pros and Cons.

Pros

Open ended gameplay.
Advancement based on actions.
SPOILER (Morrowind)-

Some NPC's do cool stuff - Shop keepers putting on the things they bought from me.

Cons

Ridiculous clunky interface.

Map feature 'broken'. World too coarse scale/Local too fine, no assignable labels.

Frame Rates at 5-7 on a system that easily beats the 'recommended' one on the box!

Lack of companion NPC's of any depth/worth. Yes I know I was spoilt by BG but it's the thing I most want. The companion NPC's in Morrowind are decidely sub-par.

Journal feature 'broken'. It is almost unusable and wading through the literally hundreds of pages is a nightmare especially when it doesn't include all relevent info anyway. There is no option for organising quests into done/current/moot/faction. I have found a pad and pen is a vastly superior upgrade.

Theif functions 'broken'. I love to sneak around and this game makes it nearly impossible to get any sensible rewards. I'm now level 6 and haven't sucessfully back stabbed anyone/anything.

Cliff Racers! I like wandering monsters as much as the next player but I'm fast getting sick and tired of being surrounded by a pile of these suckers lying dead at my feet.

So are there any mods that fix these cons?

Does Oblivion fix any of the Cons listed (and if so which ones)?

Thanks in advance - Curdis !

Bloodstalker · Post by **Bloodstalker** » Mon Apr 10, 2006 8:03 pm

Cons

Ridiculous clunky interface.
The interface is streamlined a good deal in Oblivions in some ways I like. I used to hate digging for lockpicks everytime I wanted to pick a lock, and now I don;t have to. It automatically uses it if I have one. Overall, the inventory and interface is much better IMO than MW, but it can get cluttered if you have a large amount of items still.

Map feature 'broken'. World too coarse scale/Local too fine, no assignable labels.
Map in Oblivion is better as well I think. The world map looks like a drawn map to me, and the local map I never use. You are provided with a compass of sorts on the bottom of the screen that you can use to navigate to where you want to go.

Frame Rates at 5-7 on a system that easily beats the 'recommended' one on the box!
Play on the 360, so I wouldn;t know

Lack of companion NPC's of any depth/worth. Yes I know I was spoilt by BG but it's the thing I most want. The companion NPC's in Morrowind are decidely sub-par.
The NPC's are more specialized as far as local and information they have. However, they also don;t generally have a lot to say to you beyond a few (maybe 5-6 average) dialogue options that once they are exausted are just reptetive. There is no character depth on the scale of of BG series. Honestly, I don;t find there to be much more than MW, I just see that they've done away with the countless dialogue option you had to wade through.

Journal feature 'broken'. It is almost unusable and wading through the literally hundreds of pages is a nightmare especially when it doesn't include all relevent info anyway. There is no option for organising quests into done/current/moot/faction. I have found a pad and pen is a vastly superior upgrade.
Journal is a vast upgrade IMO. Rather than having to sort through pages of info just to find something relating to your current quest, you can go to your journal and select a quest to make your active quest. This allows all quest updates on the quest you are working on to appear seperate from everything else. It's a lot easier than getting a quest, follwed by 10 journal entries before it updates, and having to wade through all the trash.

Theif functions 'broken'. I love to sneak around and this game makes it nearly impossible to get any sensible rewards. I'm now level 6 and haven't sucessfully back stabbed anyone/anything.

Sneaking works fine for me. I do backstab damage regularly with my bow, as well as my melee weapon at times when I can get close enough. There is also an onscreen indicator when in sneak mode that will brighten as you get close to being detected. I still can't pickpocket for squat though.

Cliff Racers! I like wandering monsters as much as the next player but I'm fast getting sick and tired of being surrounded by a pile of these suckers lying dead at my feet.

No cliff racers that I've seen. Not every creature in the game will attack you either, as you'll come across deer and such that will be no threat. wolves seem fairly common, but not to the degree cliffracers were where you took two steps, killed one, and took two more and repeat for the next 20 minutes.

Fljotsdale · Post by **Fljotsdale** » Tue Apr 11, 2006 5:40 am

[QUOTE=mordib]i actually didnt like morrowind but love oblivion. The reason for me is the immersion level, i feel like im in the game, enjoy going on country walks, find it scary in certain dungeons/ruins, finding the quests way more doable (and i actually want to do them unlike morowind in which each mission felt like a drag..)

to be fair I only gave morrowind a couple of hours of my time and never undertand the skills sytem during that time but still, for me oblivion has proven so much more. 72 hours of game play and counting...[/QUOTE]

Some of the dungeons are even scarier than Daggerfall dungeons. I was never scared in Morrowind. They didn't have the atmosphere, and I knew I could beat whatever the game threw at me, even if I had to change tactics.

You are NOT sure in Oblivion! And some of the critters are FAST. You really ARE fighting for your (character's) life. And you can be pasted but good, and have to go back to a savegame and run away. It's FAR more challenging than Morrowind.
I liked Morrowind a lot. But not the dreary grey concrete architecture. I hated that with a passion! Oblivion has some very good archtecture; and a much more natural, pleasant, environment. Eye-candy? Yes. But there is much more to Oblivion than eye-candy!

Pillage · Post by **Pillage** » Tue Apr 11, 2006 6:34 am

[QUOTE=Fljotsdale]You are NOT sure in Oblivion! And some of the critters are FAST. [/QUOTE]
I know the first time one of the Oblivion rats lunged at me, I almost jumped. It was a welcome change, though.