since i didn't really do dispels and such. then i did a switch and was just pure offensive and disabling and made the game too easy
so are summons of any use? the only summon i like is mordaikens sword
are summons any good?
are summons any good?
I used to win combat's with summons for tanking..that was quite hard
since i didn't really do dispels and such. then i did a switch and was just pure offensive and disabling and made the game too easy
so are summons of any use? the only summon i like is mordaikens sword
since i didn't really do dispels and such. then i did a switch and was just pure offensive and disabling and made the game too easy
so are summons of any use? the only summon i like is mordaikens sword
-
Crenshinibon
- Posts: 2665
- Joined: Wed Mar 22, 2006 5:35 pm
- Contact:
Well, take advantage of the Planetar/Deva. They are very good and usefull. Time is not a problem for me as I was lucky enough to buy a Special Edition and have the Robe of Vecna.
The Planetar/Deva have a good arsenal of spells, which range from offensive, to defensive and healing. That's basically what I use instead of a cleric.
The invisible stalkers are very handy, they take some time to kill.
The elementalls (from the quest spells) are alright, they aren't too strong, but they're alright.
Also, the Wizard Eye/ Summon combination is very useful in tough places.
The Planetar/Deva have a good arsenal of spells, which range from offensive, to defensive and healing. That's basically what I use instead of a cleric.
The invisible stalkers are very handy, they take some time to kill.
The elementalls (from the quest spells) are alright, they aren't too strong, but they're alright.
Also, the Wizard Eye/ Summon combination is very useful in tough places.
“The world breaks every one and afterward many are strong at the broken places. But those that will not break it kills. It kills the very good and the very gentle and the very brave impartially.”
I'm stick sticking to my bears, I don't use them right up to end, but still...
[QUOTE=Crenshinibon]Time is not a problem for me as I was lucky enough to buy a Special Edition and have the Robe of Vecna.[/QUOTE]
The Robe of Vecna and the other special items provided by Deirdre in Adventurer's Mart are now accessible in a patch...
Can't some classes some creatures like (Fallen) Devas as High Level Abilities? Those don't take spell slots or time to summon as I recall...
[QUOTE=Crenshinibon]Time is not a problem for me as I was lucky enough to buy a Special Edition and have the Robe of Vecna.[/QUOTE]
The Robe of Vecna and the other special items provided by Deirdre in Adventurer's Mart are now accessible in a patch...
Can't some classes some creatures like (Fallen) Devas as High Level Abilities? Those don't take spell slots or time to summon as I recall...
Gates of Dawn
I'm not that partial to Gate either - they go off mauling by-standers and you get the blame...
I really like summon undead - skeletons are not bad, but Skeleton warriors are pretty good - protected from evil and hasted - have you seen 5 hasted skeleton warriors attack? even more fun if you make them mass invisible to start with!
spider spawn - great when you get sword or phase spiders
also the wand of monster summoning - you get at the beginning of the escaping Irenicus episode - sell it and buy it back re-charged when you can afford it. 50 charges can summon a LOT of ogres, knolls, dire wolves etc - most medium level monsters are susceptible to something you can summon up.
I usually summon them at the edge of range so that they are attacking in the fog of war.
now if they had done a clerics Staff of the Undead, that would have been excellent - greater mummy perhaps - I doubt vampires would be included as they are too 'personal' a monster.
Devas are good - although by the time you can get them, they are only a bit of help.
altogether, summoned allies are very much part of my game-plan - as I like to distract my enemies and also wear them down with attritional confrontations.
I'm not that partial to Gate either - they go off mauling by-standers and you get the blame...
I really like summon undead - skeletons are not bad, but Skeleton warriors are pretty good - protected from evil and hasted - have you seen 5 hasted skeleton warriors attack? even more fun if you make them mass invisible to start with!
spider spawn - great when you get sword or phase spiders
also the wand of monster summoning - you get at the beginning of the escaping Irenicus episode - sell it and buy it back re-charged when you can afford it. 50 charges can summon a LOT of ogres, knolls, dire wolves etc - most medium level monsters are susceptible to something you can summon up.
I usually summon them at the edge of range so that they are attacking in the fog of war.
now if they had done a clerics Staff of the Undead, that would have been excellent - greater mummy perhaps - I doubt vampires would be included as they are too 'personal' a monster.
Devas are good - although by the time you can get them, they are only a bit of help.
altogether, summoned allies are very much part of my game-plan - as I like to distract my enemies and also wear them down with attritional confrontations.
"All the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players"
I actually like the lower level summons. I love summons and will send in the ettercaps, kobolds and ogres before I send in the spider spawn, skeletal warriors and mountain bears. The mages will waste their high level spells on the kobolds and have none left by the time the bears get there. Plus, there are sometimes fighters near the mages so it ties them up as well.
"Korax thinks you look very tasty today...
-
Luis Antonio
- Posts: 9103
- Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2003 11:00 am
- Location: In the home of the demoted.
- Contact:
I like (love) skeletons (clerical). At higher levels you jsut cant be stopped. And they're kinda immune to magic, so its very nice to have them. Other than that:
Summon spiders
Gate (yes, gate, specially if I'm soloing and I can do that)
Summon Efretti
the lower level summons I use to divert spellcasters with targets.
Summon spiders
Gate (yes, gate, specially if I'm soloing and I can do that)
Summon Efretti
the lower level summons I use to divert spellcasters with targets.
Flesh to stone ain't permanent, it seems.
Summons are far more important for smaller parties, esp. soloists or duets.
Most agree that Skeleton Warriors are the best all-purpose summons. Another angle is that for a cleric they are a level4 cast, which means cleric/mage types can put three of them in a spell sequencer for emergencies. That swung a few battles for me, having 3 of these monsters called up instantaneously to my side.
Two items/summons that deserve a mention - the horn which summons a berserk warrior. I always end up using this a number of times, the upgraded version can take a bit of punishment.
Also the staff of fire. This seems to be bugged on my version; it is supposed to have 20 casts of fireshield (red) and 20 casts of summon fire elemental. I found that there was no fireshield available, but clicking it summons the elemental (clicking for summons had no effect). Anyway, a neat way to quickly call up fairly powerful creatures.
Most agree that Skeleton Warriors are the best all-purpose summons. Another angle is that for a cleric they are a level4 cast, which means cleric/mage types can put three of them in a spell sequencer for emergencies. That swung a few battles for me, having 3 of these monsters called up instantaneously to my side.
Two items/summons that deserve a mention - the horn which summons a berserk warrior. I always end up using this a number of times, the upgraded version can take a bit of punishment.
Also the staff of fire. This seems to be bugged on my version; it is supposed to have 20 casts of fireshield (red) and 20 casts of summon fire elemental. I found that there was no fireshield available, but clicking it summons the elemental (clicking for summons had no effect). Anyway, a neat way to quickly call up fairly powerful creatures.
Fire in the (Spell) Hole!
usually devices are re-charged before you can buy them back - so it is wise not to use up a wand - the PC can usually afford to buy recharged wands. you may have a bug as I seem to recall the Staff of Fire counting down.
the one to watch is spellstrike/breach - can run out really quickly.
with the Wand of Fire - did you notice that fully charged it has 50 fireballs AND 50 scorchers? I thought using either was 1 charge, but it keeps count separately.
usually devices are re-charged before you can buy them back - so it is wise not to use up a wand - the PC can usually afford to buy recharged wands. you may have a bug as I seem to recall the Staff of Fire counting down.
the one to watch is spellstrike/breach - can run out really quickly.
with the Wand of Fire - did you notice that fully charged it has 50 fireballs AND 50 scorchers? I thought using either was 1 charge, but it keeps count separately.
"All the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players"
Yes the charges on Staff of Fire did count down from 20. The bug I experienced was that upon clicking to use it, I was presented with two options: Fireshield (20 charges) and Summon Elemental (20 charges).
Clicking 'Summon Elemental' had no effect other than the charge counting down.
Clicking 'Fireshield (red)' had the effect of summoning a fire elemental, and the charge counting down.
Clicking 'Summon Elemental' had no effect other than the charge counting down.
Clicking 'Fireshield (red)' had the effect of summoning a fire elemental, and the charge counting down.
-
ellipsis jones
- Posts: 41
- Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:15 am
- Contact:
Aerial Servants deserve a mention. Way more hit points than a mountain bear, and they inflict excellent damage when they hit. I'd class them with skeleton warriors and devas as the must-have summons for clerics.
Also, there are things summoned creatures can do that straight offensive & defensive spells can't. Obstructing the battlefield (or being summoned behind enemy obstructions), sucking up nasty spells, drawing attackers away from vulnerable party members, etc.
Also, there are things summoned creatures can do that straight offensive & defensive spells can't. Obstructing the battlefield (or being summoned behind enemy obstructions), sucking up nasty spells, drawing attackers away from vulnerable party members, etc.
-
ellipsis jones
- Posts: 41
- Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:15 am
- Contact:
I don't think they've been nerfed, but you made me curious to see what their stats were, so I had a look on my tutu install. I don't think these creature files have been changed from vanilla...
Aerial Servant
128 HPs
AC 3
THAC0 5
1 Attack @ 23 Str
Skeleton Warrior
80 HPs
AC 2
THAC0 10
2 Attacks @ 18/51 Str
Resist cold (100), magic (90), slashing (40), piercing (50), missile (60)
Interesting! I hadn't looked at these before. Of course the skeleton warrior is badass. With his resists and AC, that 80 hps goes a long way - I'd say he's just as durable as the servant, if not moreso. The servant doesn't have the immunities that the warrior does, but he has a few things going for him: 1) plenty of hps, because resists don't cover everything; 2) nice default movement speed; 3) when that one attack lands, it counts for something. Haste adds much more to the servant's offense than it does to the warrior's, given the servant's higher damage and lower thaco.
Bottom line: I think the skeleton warrior is by far the best summons, but the servant shines in battles against fighter-types (especially golems and elementals, with their crushing weapons to which the warrior has no resistance) where there's little enemy magic.
Given the party you're considering, though, I'd say give the servant a miss. You'll have plenty of summoning power already in levels that don't have Heal in them.
Aerial Servant
128 HPs
AC 3
THAC0 5
1 Attack @ 23 Str
Skeleton Warrior
80 HPs
AC 2
THAC0 10
2 Attacks @ 18/51 Str
Resist cold (100), magic (90), slashing (40), piercing (50), missile (60)
Interesting! I hadn't looked at these before. Of course the skeleton warrior is badass. With his resists and AC, that 80 hps goes a long way - I'd say he's just as durable as the servant, if not moreso. The servant doesn't have the immunities that the warrior does, but he has a few things going for him: 1) plenty of hps, because resists don't cover everything; 2) nice default movement speed; 3) when that one attack lands, it counts for something. Haste adds much more to the servant's offense than it does to the warrior's, given the servant's higher damage and lower thaco.
Bottom line: I think the skeleton warrior is by far the best summons, but the servant shines in battles against fighter-types (especially golems and elementals, with their crushing weapons to which the warrior has no resistance) where there's little enemy magic.
Given the party you're considering, though, I'd say give the servant a miss. You'll have plenty of summoning power already in levels that don't have Heal in them.