The Succeeder Stronghold

Lestat · Post by **Lestat** » Mon May 29, 2006 11:32 am

Say, GoG, wasn't it Hitler that sold you guys out to Stalin...?

Fiona · Post by **Fiona** » Mon May 29, 2006 11:36 am

[QUOTE=Lestat]Say, GoG, wasn't it Hitler that sold you guys out to Stalin...?[/QUOTE]

Was it? I sort of thought it was part of the pact that the Baltic states were left free; only Hitler did not have the power to enforce its terms when Stalin occupied them? I am not very up on this stuff though.

Edit: I have had a quick look and it seems you are right about the intentions at least. But that was before the Nazi invasion? Or is that a misconception too?

JonIrenicus · Post by **JonIrenicus** » Mon May 29, 2006 11:52 am

[QUOTE=Gunofgod]When you embrace nazism.[/QUOTE]

Nazism = doing meth? right?

Kipi · Post by **Kipi** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:06 pm

Evening everybody!!

Hmm... talking of Hitler and nazism, eh??

Ravager · Post by **Ravager** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:08 pm

I think we reached Godwin's Law yet again...

Fiona · Post by **Fiona** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:09 pm

Hi Kipi. Yes we were. I don't know enough about it although I do wish GoG would change his ava. Not a very rational wish, I grant, since the symbol is attractive in itself. But it carries such a lot of baggage it seems irreversibly tainted to me

Kipi · Post by **Kipi** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:15 pm

@Rav
What law???

[QUOTE=Fiona]Hi Kipi. Yes we were. I don't know enough about it although I do wish GoG would change his ava. Not a very rational wish, I grant, since the symbol is attractive in itself. But it carries such a lot of baggage it seems irreversibly tainted to me

[/QUOTE]
Totally agreeing you here. Actually I'm a bit suprised that Gog has been allowed to keep that ava this long. But, that's the job of mods and Buck to decided wether it's okay or not.
I myself would hope Gog change it BEFORE anything happens...

Ravager · Post by **Ravager** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:20 pm

[QUOTE=Kipi]@Rav
What law???[/QUOTE]
This one: http://www.answers.com/Godwin's%20Law?nafid=3

Kipi · Post by **Kipi** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:25 pm

Well, was the topic intended or not?

Fiona · Post by **Fiona** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:32 pm

I do not think Godwin's law applies in this discussion since no-one is adducing nazism to undermine a different point of view. Rather we have been led to discuss the limits of free expression by GoG's ava. Though since he is not engaging in any serious way we are not getting very far

Kipi · Post by **Kipi** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:35 pm

[QUOTE=Fiona]I do not think Godwin's law applies in this discussion since no-one is adducing nazism to undermine a different point of view. Rather we have been led to discuss the limits of free expression by GoG's ava. Though since he is not engaging in any serious way we are not getting very far

[/QUOTE]
True, and that's what I'm worried of...
If Gog doesn't take this matter seriously, who knows what may happen? Maybe he has already angried and insulted people with his avatar, and especially with his statements concerning of it, nazism and Hitler...

Lestat · Post by **Lestat** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:38 pm

I'm off ... to Oblivion...

Fiona · Post by **Fiona** » Mon May 29, 2006 12:42 pm

[QUOTE=Kipi]True, and that's what I'm worried of...
If Gog doesn't take this matter seriously, who knows what may happen? Maybe he has already angried and insulted people with his avatar, and especially with his statements concerning of it, nazism and Hitler...

[/QUOTE]

It is possible. There is a real question about how far freedom of speech extends, and I have some difficulty in thinking it through properly. I do not want to see things forbidden for mere offensiveness; but your point is well taken that there may be more problematic consequences than hurt feelings. This is related to other discussions about, for example, religion: and we have seen how heated and hurtful those can get. On balance I think there is enough evidence to show that this symbol is not dead and that there are people who are prepared to act on its message if they are not stopped. That is perhaps enough to make us take it seriously and to acknowledge real harm may follow? I am not very sure where I stand, but I am pretty sure it is at least "tasteless" if not more than that

@ Lestat. You're late :laugh:

Aramant · Post by **Aramant** » Mon May 29, 2006 1:23 pm

Back to a less sensitive subject...

I realize that dilated pupils are supposed to be attractive, but really. Any more dilation and I'd have to wonder if she's dead.

Spoiler

And then she'd be even MORE attractive.

Kipi · Post by **Kipi** » Mon May 29, 2006 1:28 pm

[QUOTE=Fiona]It is possible. There is a real question about how far freedom of speech extends, and I have some difficulty in thinking it through properly. I do not want to see things forbidden for mere offensiveness; but your point is well taken that there may be more problematic consequences than hurt feelings. This is related to other discussions about, for example, religion: and we have seen how heated and hurtful those can get. On balance I think there is enough evidence to show that this symbol is not dead and that there are people who are prepared to act on its message if they are not stopped. That is perhaps enough to make us take it seriously and to acknowledge real harm may follow? I am not very sure where I stand, but I am pretty sure it is at least "tasteless" if not more than that
[/QUOTE]
Well, I have met enough Jews during last years that I can honestly say that they still think that symbol as an symbol of nazism, Hitler and such. And, at least those who I know, have been very sensitive about the subject.
And it's not even the matter of the avatar only, but the comments Gog made some posts ago... especially the one which answered the question of why such avatar...
It's sad that the symbol has got the meaning of nazism and so on, but honeslty I can't accept that someone uses it's, neither as in joke nor seriously, because even though I won't take it as an offense, there are quite many who will. And especially if it's consequently linked to nazism when used, like Gog is doing right now, I wouldn't be suprised if he gots tons of flames either via PM or posts in threads like this. And, as I already said, I'm quite suprised that Gog has been allowed to keep it. But I'm not the one who is going to complain about it to mods or Buck... yet.

Aramant · Post by **Aramant** » Mon May 29, 2006 1:38 pm

[url="http://www.tshirthell.com/store/product.php?productid=192"]http://www.tshirthell.com/store/product.php?productid=192[/url]

And with that, I'm off to shower. I just got back in from a run and I'm sweating like a redneck at a math exam.

Fiona · Post by **Fiona** » Mon May 29, 2006 1:40 pm

[QUOTE=Aramant][url="http://www.tshirthell.com/store/product.php?productid=192"]http://www.tshirthell.com/store/product.php?productid=192[/url][/QUOTE]

Eeeugh!

Kipi · Post by **Kipi** » Mon May 29, 2006 1:47 pm

[QUOTE=Aramant][url="http://www.tshirthell.com/store/product.php?productid=192"]http://www.tshirthell.com/store/product.php?productid=192[/url]

And with that, I'm off to shower. I just got back in from a run and I'm sweating like a redneck at a math exam.[/QUOTE]
Ummm.... what good things???

but, what Fiona said just before me...

The Balance · Post by **The Balance** » Mon May 29, 2006 1:49 pm

Hiya SS ! ...

Spoiler

"SS" ... to stay on topic

"Succeeder Stronghold"-ists of course!

Spoiler

and nooot "SchutzStaffel"!!

[QUOTE=Ravager]Respect for people who can kick a ball in different directions around a field in front of a crowd earning respect and tons of money? While the rest of us actually work for it? Oh, yes, I have the utmost respect for it...

[/QUOTE]

These are some of the most beautiful words I've heard in 219 years of life !!

Ravager · Post by **Ravager** » Mon May 29, 2006 1:57 pm

[QUOTE=The Balance]These are some of the most beautiful words I've heard in 219 years of life !!

[/QUOTE]
Hehe.

Look at this comic that firmly represents my view: http://www.frozenreality.co.uk/comic/bu ... php?id=612
219 years, eh?