[QUOTE=Jandau]Makes sense, except for one detail: She's homeless and lives on a beach. So unless she's got a laptop with a wireless net connection she's not much of an option....
I'd sooner go with Gary.[/QUOTE]
Well, there's an all-nite cyber cafe just a taxi ride away. Plus one might assume when David Hatter visits Julius he brings along a laptop to take notes. Course, come to think of it there's unattended computers all over the place in Santa Monica: the beach house, Kilpatrick's Bail Bonds, Megahurtz Computing, etc., etc.
But yeah, I'm kinda thinking Gary. LaCroix doesn't seem to like him very much and I assume the feeling is natural. One's going to eventually kill the other and Gary ain't dumb.
So I propose another theory:
By use of Mask of a Thousand Faces, Gary is "Caine".
Mysterious emails - From a friend???(SPOILERS)
Omg, I had no idea, I like that Skyline Apt to much not to shaft him out of it. 
From the offical forums I have not actually read them but I followed the orginal Offical forums Dilapidation to Gamespy.
The Devs Pubs and many people whom had read all the books posted there.
Saw it first in a thread just like this one talking about the Emails
Here is the fourm thread search, it has about 470 post for Caine
I am to tired to look it up atm (5am), it was almost a year ago.
http://www.forumplanet.com/planetvampire/search.asp
Btw Search was just in General forums, if you try to do them all it may crash.
On the first page however is a complete WW history of Caine, here are the last 4 entries.
*Eventually, their great empire fell apart and they [3rd and 4th generations] were all forced to flee (they were weak at this point).
-With no real control left, the Great Clans are created (wild embracing).
-With entirely too many vampires in the world, another great war breaks out with human armies used as puppets and the Antedeluvians go into hiding (they fear they'd be killed as they had killed their creators).
*Millenias pass, and Caine isn't heard from.
*At some point in time (relativly close to present day. Nearly centuries in the past) Caine Enters the cave-city of Kaymakli [ancient city created inside a mountain by Cappadocius himself, who sealed it so that no kindred could escape and no human could enter. Everyone in the city either went into the deepest of torpor, or were killed as the bloodlust set in] and sometimes sends his spirit out into the semi-modern world to observe what his grandkiddies are up to.
Afew years ago [1999-2001. Not entirely sure], Beckett (a Gangrel archeologist and Noddist Historian) breaks the magical barrier to kaymakli while trying to help a friend trapped inside a year before escape. This inadvertantly awakens the Antedeluvians (who had only rolled in their sleep, never fully awakening, up until this point)
-He finds Caine (who does not let his identity slip) and the two become traveling companions for the few months before Gehenna.
From the offical forums I have not actually read them but I followed the orginal Offical forums Dilapidation to Gamespy.
The Devs Pubs and many people whom had read all the books posted there.
Saw it first in a thread just like this one talking about the Emails
Here is the fourm thread search, it has about 470 post for Caine
I am to tired to look it up atm (5am), it was almost a year ago.
http://www.forumplanet.com/planetvampire/search.asp
Btw Search was just in General forums, if you try to do them all it may crash.
On the first page however is a complete WW history of Caine, here are the last 4 entries.
*Eventually, their great empire fell apart and they [3rd and 4th generations] were all forced to flee (they were weak at this point).
-With no real control left, the Great Clans are created (wild embracing).
-With entirely too many vampires in the world, another great war breaks out with human armies used as puppets and the Antedeluvians go into hiding (they fear they'd be killed as they had killed their creators).
*Millenias pass, and Caine isn't heard from.
*At some point in time (relativly close to present day. Nearly centuries in the past) Caine Enters the cave-city of Kaymakli [ancient city created inside a mountain by Cappadocius himself, who sealed it so that no kindred could escape and no human could enter. Everyone in the city either went into the deepest of torpor, or were killed as the bloodlust set in] and sometimes sends his spirit out into the semi-modern world to observe what his grandkiddies are up to.
Afew years ago [1999-2001. Not entirely sure], Beckett (a Gangrel archeologist and Noddist Historian) breaks the magical barrier to kaymakli while trying to help a friend trapped inside a year before escape. This inadvertantly awakens the Antedeluvians (who had only rolled in their sleep, never fully awakening, up until this point)
-He finds Caine (who does not let his identity slip) and the two become traveling companions for the few months before Gehenna.
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.
-
pennypincher
- Posts: 420
- Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 10:21 pm
- Location: Australia! WOO!
- Contact:
Ohhhh yeah, the city that swallows up Kindred. Honestly, I consider that another boo-boo really, as it doesn't make any sense to me how a man who would latter be embraced by Vampires much weaker then Caine mannaged to make a ward that would hold a vampire as powerful as Caine... Then given the fact that he and his clan were swallowed whole latter by even WEAKER Vampires... It really begs the question: When did he go from such an uber awesome guy, to such a loser?!
But yes, I do remember some refferences to the city. I wasn't aware that Caine was released from it by anyone... As I had always just assumed a guy like Caine would walk out any bloody time he wanted... And I didn't know that it had anything to do with the Antedeluvians awakening... As, in fact, the Gehenna book says almost the opposite in several endings.
Then again, this is the same game book company who had an index that listed:
Pants: See Pantaloons.
Pantaloons: See Pants.
*Helpless Shrug*
But yes, I do remember some refferences to the city. I wasn't aware that Caine was released from it by anyone... As I had always just assumed a guy like Caine would walk out any bloody time he wanted... And I didn't know that it had anything to do with the Antedeluvians awakening... As, in fact, the Gehenna book says almost the opposite in several endings.
Then again, this is the same game book company who had an index that listed:
Pants: See Pantaloons.
Pantaloons: See Pants.
*Helpless Shrug*
I was Diablorised once. I got better.
Oh, your right he could walk out or in anytime, he is not weaker, I am aware of.
This didnt mention the details as I had mentioned earlier I think, it was late.
His Exisle was self imposed, but Becket just broke the seal left by Cap.
I dont think Canine acutually walked with Neonates, just Becket, at least I recall hearing.
This didnt mention the details as I had mentioned earlier I think, it was late.
His Exisle was self imposed, but Becket just broke the seal left by Cap.
I dont think Canine acutually walked with Neonates, just Becket, at least I recall hearing.
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.
-
pennypincher
- Posts: 420
- Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 10:21 pm
- Location: Australia! WOO!
- Contact:
" No, sadly, in one of the endings in Gehenna"
Yeah, I can see how that would be a letdown, first I heard of that.
Well not to beat the dead!
I really think the reason Trokia used Caine (I mean in a perceptually based way, how ever anyone chooses to look at it) is that WW does not want (currently, could change if there new version/series sinks like a rock) to make any more material based on the VTM series, to help focus on the new content.
So Trokia (proabably WW) decided to give Caine, a little shine in the spot light, before putting VTM, to rest.
I would guess when ending a series to help promote a new series you want to go out with as big a bang as possible.
As usual Activision handled it poorly in the sense of realising what potienal could have been reached based on exponital growth of sales with more development time.
Even today a year later this Bloodlines is one of the best RPGs available in the last couple of years.
Yeah, I can see how that would be a letdown, first I heard of that.
Well not to beat the dead!
I really think the reason Trokia used Caine (I mean in a perceptually based way, how ever anyone chooses to look at it) is that WW does not want (currently, could change if there new version/series sinks like a rock) to make any more material based on the VTM series, to help focus on the new content.
So Trokia (proabably WW) decided to give Caine, a little shine in the spot light, before putting VTM, to rest.
I would guess when ending a series to help promote a new series you want to go out with as big a bang as possible.
As usual Activision handled it poorly in the sense of realising what potienal could have been reached based on exponital growth of sales with more development time.
Even today a year later this Bloodlines is one of the best RPGs available in the last couple of years.
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.
i know it may be long after this discussion ended - but after finally ending the game with each and every bloodline i've managed to cope with this problem.
so here are my ideas:
first of all - as we all know to become x you must be emraced by x...
thus if you chose to play tremere it would quite almost impossible for you to be embraced by anarch - as the game says many times that the tremere chooses their neonates carefully - and this means that Strauss must have allowed for the embration, therefore him "planning" your part in this play... and as you might know - in one of the endings the sarcophagus is sealed by him however we don't actually know what really happens to the bomb. and this way it is not "smilng jack" that seems to win - as it is strauss - the last of the strongest l.a. camarilla vampires - to take control. after all this is what strauss wanted (you can think this out from the talks with him). what is more - he's very intelligent, doesn't like the prince and is loyal to the cause of tremere clan. and as an old "mage" he would rather hide himself and don't give direct orders... plus the last message "don't open it"... when strauss becomes new prince why he doesn't open the sarcophagus? maybe because he knows what's inside... plus - to make things look interesting - he could make you an "outern" tremere so that if you fail, the clan would not pay the consequences. how smart...
the second person in question is gary - first of all gary and lacroix don't like each other - the only reason they work with is that prince is a little afraid of the intelligence force of the sewers ;-) gary has a class and distinct manners, and what i remember from visiting his heaven - he has a chess board... with his all-knowing, aristocratic taste to watch others do the hard work, pro-computer attitude (remember waht mitnick said - they are the best when it comes to computers), his attitude towards the player - as he tries to answer with a question and let the player do the thinking... it's so probable that he is the friend. besides if you play with nosferatu he must somehow, at least to make prince deal with something, know and allow of the embrace... plus he must have known of any nosferatu, and as i remember there are almost no nosferatu between the anarchs... as the anarchs and tremere prefer their clique...
now it's time for smiling jack. he always is where he should be, knows what's going on. been here, and will be here. and he's neither an anarch nor camarilla "thug". there is a possiblity it is him as he helps you whenever this help is needed (basing of the game plot). however he might be helping the player to make sure that his surprise would reach the boss. yet, however discreet and shadowy he would be, he is not a guy to use this kind of terms. yet again he is that old that he might even behave oddly or hide himself by sending mail that does not match him and observe the consequences - and this is what he likes the best - basing on the film in the end of the game...
now coming to beckett he is another probable friend guy - always misterious and suprisingly always watching from behind - afterall he is the historian, nothing more... and being a friend he wanted to make sure you got the email... so he spoke to you. more - he is probably one of the few to know anything of the sarcophagus and probably this would make him the one to create all the drama etc just to watch how this ends...
the taxi driver - from the begining of the game he accompanies you. he might be cain, and why do i think he is? first of all he's the most powerful, therefore whateer hapens - he will be safe. as the one who pulls all the strings he might find a pawn/helper in jack, and a puppet in pc... suprisingly, this would also be the place you want be looking for someone with almost god powers. and think how great 3d show it is for him... even if you think that he is here to see his children will kill themselves - why would he make sure that a almost thinblood make a revolution, kill many vampires and so on. probably just for fun... being that old, with a little twisted mind, he might find pleasure in doing all of this. besides his voice after the end of the game, i mean at the scene of the explosion - he doesn't speak to jack, rather it seems he stays in a mist form behind him... and lastly - if he wanted to not look as a medieval dumb demon he must have adapted even if it means using the computers... and this dialogue text when they say the pc's blood is somewhat changed... quite intriguing. besides how else would he know everything? it really seems that he is the main mastermind, even behind "jack's surprise"...
the friend lastly might be nines - why? due to the term - he seems to be "a friend" all the time... probably only when he finds out of the jack's intrigue he tries to save "the kiddo" ;-)
taking all these characteres into account i believe it is the cain/taxi driver (and i think it was cain from the beginning). the second guy probable would be gary or strauss. less possible would be the rest, however of all of them jack still seems to be a friend after all ;-)
so here are my ideas:
first of all - as we all know to become x you must be emraced by x...
thus if you chose to play tremere it would quite almost impossible for you to be embraced by anarch - as the game says many times that the tremere chooses their neonates carefully - and this means that Strauss must have allowed for the embration, therefore him "planning" your part in this play... and as you might know - in one of the endings the sarcophagus is sealed by him however we don't actually know what really happens to the bomb. and this way it is not "smilng jack" that seems to win - as it is strauss - the last of the strongest l.a. camarilla vampires - to take control. after all this is what strauss wanted (you can think this out from the talks with him). what is more - he's very intelligent, doesn't like the prince and is loyal to the cause of tremere clan. and as an old "mage" he would rather hide himself and don't give direct orders... plus the last message "don't open it"... when strauss becomes new prince why he doesn't open the sarcophagus? maybe because he knows what's inside... plus - to make things look interesting - he could make you an "outern" tremere so that if you fail, the clan would not pay the consequences. how smart...
the second person in question is gary - first of all gary and lacroix don't like each other - the only reason they work with is that prince is a little afraid of the intelligence force of the sewers ;-) gary has a class and distinct manners, and what i remember from visiting his heaven - he has a chess board... with his all-knowing, aristocratic taste to watch others do the hard work, pro-computer attitude (remember waht mitnick said - they are the best when it comes to computers), his attitude towards the player - as he tries to answer with a question and let the player do the thinking... it's so probable that he is the friend. besides if you play with nosferatu he must somehow, at least to make prince deal with something, know and allow of the embrace... plus he must have known of any nosferatu, and as i remember there are almost no nosferatu between the anarchs... as the anarchs and tremere prefer their clique...
now it's time for smiling jack. he always is where he should be, knows what's going on. been here, and will be here. and he's neither an anarch nor camarilla "thug". there is a possiblity it is him as he helps you whenever this help is needed (basing of the game plot). however he might be helping the player to make sure that his surprise would reach the boss. yet, however discreet and shadowy he would be, he is not a guy to use this kind of terms. yet again he is that old that he might even behave oddly or hide himself by sending mail that does not match him and observe the consequences - and this is what he likes the best - basing on the film in the end of the game...
now coming to beckett he is another probable friend guy - always misterious and suprisingly always watching from behind - afterall he is the historian, nothing more... and being a friend he wanted to make sure you got the email... so he spoke to you. more - he is probably one of the few to know anything of the sarcophagus and probably this would make him the one to create all the drama etc just to watch how this ends...
the taxi driver - from the begining of the game he accompanies you. he might be cain, and why do i think he is? first of all he's the most powerful, therefore whateer hapens - he will be safe. as the one who pulls all the strings he might find a pawn/helper in jack, and a puppet in pc... suprisingly, this would also be the place you want be looking for someone with almost god powers. and think how great 3d show it is for him... even if you think that he is here to see his children will kill themselves - why would he make sure that a almost thinblood make a revolution, kill many vampires and so on. probably just for fun... being that old, with a little twisted mind, he might find pleasure in doing all of this. besides his voice after the end of the game, i mean at the scene of the explosion - he doesn't speak to jack, rather it seems he stays in a mist form behind him... and lastly - if he wanted to not look as a medieval dumb demon he must have adapted even if it means using the computers... and this dialogue text when they say the pc's blood is somewhat changed... quite intriguing. besides how else would he know everything? it really seems that he is the main mastermind, even behind "jack's surprise"...
the friend lastly might be nines - why? due to the term - he seems to be "a friend" all the time... probably only when he finds out of the jack's intrigue he tries to save "the kiddo" ;-)
taking all these characteres into account i believe it is the cain/taxi driver (and i think it was cain from the beginning). the second guy probable would be gary or strauss. less possible would be the rest, however of all of them jack still seems to be a friend after all ;-)
-
pennypincher
- Posts: 420
- Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 10:21 pm
- Location: Australia! WOO!
- Contact:
[QUOTE=mCrvn]i the taxi driver - from the begining of the game he accompanies you. he might be cain, and why do i think he is? first of all he's the most powerful, therefore whateer hapens - he will be safe. as the one who pulls all the strings he might find a pawn/helper in jack, and a puppet in pc... suprisingly, this would also be the place you want be looking for someone with almost god powers. and think how great 3d show it is for him... even if you think that he is here to see his children will kill themselves - why would he make sure that a almost thinblood make a revolution, kill many vampires and so on. probably just for fun... being that old, with a little twisted mind, he might find pleasure in doing all of this. besides his voice after the end of the game, i mean at the scene of the explosion - he doesn't speak to jack, rather it seems he stays in a mist form behind him... and lastly - if he wanted to not look as a medieval dumb demon he must have adapted even if it means using the computers... and this dialogue text when they say the pc's blood is somewhat changed... quite intriguing. besides how else would he know everything? it really seems that he is the main mastermind, even behind "jack's surprise"...[/QUOTE]
SPOILERS MAY FOLLOW
The taxi driver displays a grand total of 1 power... Obfuscate 1, the ability to stand perfectly still and be unseen. He is, by far and wide, NOT the most powerful character we see in the game.
Caine would need no pawns if he wanted to remove the Prince, nor would he have any understanding or knowladge of C4. Being able to evaporate the Prince from the time line with a wave of his hand, and being from an age long before explosives, I doubt very much his first thought would be to create a conveluded plan that spaned over many nights...
The PC is not Thin Blooded, nor is it hinted at any time that his Generation is anything even close to Thin blood. Neither do you start a revolution, you carry out the Princes orders, and in doing so deliver a box filled with C4 to him... Thats akin to saying "Rats planned and carried out the Plauge".
Caine has no choice about looking like a "dumb demon". Each night when he wakes up he is going to look like a scruffy, long haired, beared neanderthal no matter what he does, short of covering it over with an illusion or twisting himself out of shape with vicissitude. He is mired in the same stagnation as other elders... His outwards apperace will remain as his inwards understanding and spirit will remain unchanged. Curse of vampires 101.
The cab driver introduces no new information of any kind to the conversations you have with him, instead he waxs about issues everyone seems to already be abreast of in the game, only he says them with a stupid acent and adds a few colourful phrases that don't really allude to anything important. The same can be done on almost any issue:
"I'm worried about global warming"
"Man lives on the back of his creations, and those same creations choke the world. Can salvation be found in more modern metal and magic, or will man be forced to cast off the new world in favour of the old? Only time will tell."
So, once again, no.
SPOILERS MAY FOLLOW
The taxi driver displays a grand total of 1 power... Obfuscate 1, the ability to stand perfectly still and be unseen. He is, by far and wide, NOT the most powerful character we see in the game.
Caine would need no pawns if he wanted to remove the Prince, nor would he have any understanding or knowladge of C4. Being able to evaporate the Prince from the time line with a wave of his hand, and being from an age long before explosives, I doubt very much his first thought would be to create a conveluded plan that spaned over many nights...
The PC is not Thin Blooded, nor is it hinted at any time that his Generation is anything even close to Thin blood. Neither do you start a revolution, you carry out the Princes orders, and in doing so deliver a box filled with C4 to him... Thats akin to saying "Rats planned and carried out the Plauge".
Caine has no choice about looking like a "dumb demon". Each night when he wakes up he is going to look like a scruffy, long haired, beared neanderthal no matter what he does, short of covering it over with an illusion or twisting himself out of shape with vicissitude. He is mired in the same stagnation as other elders... His outwards apperace will remain as his inwards understanding and spirit will remain unchanged. Curse of vampires 101.
The cab driver introduces no new information of any kind to the conversations you have with him, instead he waxs about issues everyone seems to already be abreast of in the game, only he says them with a stupid acent and adds a few colourful phrases that don't really allude to anything important. The same can be done on almost any issue:
"I'm worried about global warming"
"Man lives on the back of his creations, and those same creations choke the world. Can salvation be found in more modern metal and magic, or will man be forced to cast off the new world in favour of the old? Only time will tell."
So, once again, no.
I was Diablorised once. I got better.
Smilin' Jack...
...could most likely be the sender. The chess playing allusions don't sound like Jack, but remember:
1. Jack is a very old vampire, and before that was not exactly a young pirate when he got turned.
2. In the old days of sailing ships, sailors did what they could to make time go by. This went for pirates, whalers, or anyone else who was at sea. This included dancing (!) , music, carving /whittling, and, oddly enough, games like chess, which was played across class lines more than you'd think. (There's all sorts of hand-carved chess sets from the 18th and 19th centuries in museums that were made by sailors, prisoners of war, etc.) One of the best chess players I ever saw was a bosun on ship, low-ranking.
3. He might be sending those messages couched in chess playing allusions and laughing his hole off because noone could ever suspect him of doing this.
...could most likely be the sender. The chess playing allusions don't sound like Jack, but remember:
1. Jack is a very old vampire, and before that was not exactly a young pirate when he got turned.
2. In the old days of sailing ships, sailors did what they could to make time go by. This went for pirates, whalers, or anyone else who was at sea. This included dancing (!) , music, carving /whittling, and, oddly enough, games like chess, which was played across class lines more than you'd think. (There's all sorts of hand-carved chess sets from the 18th and 19th centuries in museums that were made by sailors, prisoners of war, etc.) One of the best chess players I ever saw was a bosun on ship, low-ranking.
3. He might be sending those messages couched in chess playing allusions and laughing his hole off because noone could ever suspect him of doing this.
It's only a game
the point is - this forum is about the computer game which doesn't have to stick to the pnp or other milieu - it is best that the discussion limits itself to the in-game aspects of the milieu, as otherwise you can go to sources which may even be contradictory. In the game, there are certain pieces of data and that data is not enough to establish what the developers had in mind for sure. they wanted to leave certain aspects uncertain and did not put the key datum in that would give certainty.
when I saw the anarch ending for the first time, I was not sure that Jack was talking to a final-dead corpse - it was only on further run-throughs that I felt sure Mr Messy was Dead. the body had been hoiked out of the sarcophagus and replaced with c4. Beckett seemed to have known that - hence his warning. Beckett has no liking for the Prince, but wants to know what is in the box out of curiosity, but then changes his mind and warns you off. his view of the lore will not have changed, but his knowledge of facts may have done.
the one to replace the body with the c4 was Jack - Jack the Pirate: the one who has plotted to rid LA of the Prince, as he has stepped up the war with the anarchs.
BTW
Andre the Tmis - as for the blood being more powerful - that is simply that the player has assigned more XP to points during the intervening time.
He does seem to know about the PCs sire, but doesn't say enough.
the point is - this forum is about the computer game which doesn't have to stick to the pnp or other milieu - it is best that the discussion limits itself to the in-game aspects of the milieu, as otherwise you can go to sources which may even be contradictory. In the game, there are certain pieces of data and that data is not enough to establish what the developers had in mind for sure. they wanted to leave certain aspects uncertain and did not put the key datum in that would give certainty.
when I saw the anarch ending for the first time, I was not sure that Jack was talking to a final-dead corpse - it was only on further run-throughs that I felt sure Mr Messy was Dead. the body had been hoiked out of the sarcophagus and replaced with c4. Beckett seemed to have known that - hence his warning. Beckett has no liking for the Prince, but wants to know what is in the box out of curiosity, but then changes his mind and warns you off. his view of the lore will not have changed, but his knowledge of facts may have done.
the one to replace the body with the c4 was Jack - Jack the Pirate: the one who has plotted to rid LA of the Prince, as he has stepped up the war with the anarchs.
BTW
Andre the Tmis - as for the blood being more powerful - that is simply that the player has assigned more XP to points during the intervening time.
He does seem to know about the PCs sire, but doesn't say enough.
"All the world's a stage and all the men and women merely players"
Well I have seen in Dialogue and the Happy Birthday, Bloodlines! thread by the Dev, that is was Jack that set the C4, besides (at least to me) seem pretty obvious.
http://www.planetvampire.com/
Becket was most likely warned by Jack and I believe our PC and Becket were meant to be friendly and Becket chose to warn us, or Becket noticed something very odd/dangerous about it studing it.
http://www.planetvampire.com/
Becket was most likely warned by Jack and I believe our PC and Becket were meant to be friendly and Becket chose to warn us, or Becket noticed something very odd/dangerous about it studing it.
Trust me, most of the names I have been called you can't translate in any language...they're not even real words as much as a succession of violent images.
-
ProgRockGhoul
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2006 6:04 pm
- Contact:
I just finished my first time siding with the Kuei-Jin, and for the first time I did not receive the email from "a friend" warning me not to open the sarcophagus. (Beckett still stopped me on the street to warn me not to open it, just before I went to The Last Round/Griffith Park. And because of that I tend to rule him out.)
The final email said instead "A true master has played the entire game before the first move." I hadn't thought of Ming-Xiao as the "friend" before, but this made me reconsider. Not so much the message itself - which is just as obscure as the others - but the fact that I only saw this email when I sided with the Kuei-Jin. I usually count Ming-Xiao out after the email that seems to refer to her as the Black Queen, but compared to theories about Jack suddenly talking in grandiloquent chess metaphors just for kicks, to throw you off his scent - or to Gary masquerading as Caine and controlling everything behind the scenes - it doesn't seem too far out.
In this ending, Ming-Xiao definitely seems to win it all. It doesn't end with Jack and the cabbie watching the Tower burn, so they don't seem to be the ones pulling all of the strings. (The sarcophagus could still be full of explosives when you sink with it, but you'd only even consider that if you'd already finished the game differently.)
I'd always thought that the emails were sent by the taxi driver, whom I thought to be Caine - for a number of reasons.
The idea that it might be Gary, and that Gary is really the taxi driver/Caine, is interesting but kind of a stretch. If this hypothesis is correct, Gary could conceivably be - excluding the group cut-scenes - virtually every NPC. I personally think the only use of "Mask of a Thousand Faces" appears in the Nosferatu introduction to the game, where your sire appears as a Toreador before you're discovered by the Camarilla police. (There's enough paranoia in the game without suspecting that every one is literally someone else, whether it's Gary or Ming-Xiao or Caine or whomever - they all have enough faces as it is.)
So it seems possible that the anonymous "friend" could be a different vampire, depending on how you play the game. I think it's Caine/cabbie, unless you side with the Kuei-Jin - then it's Ming-Xiao. [I still haven't played as the Tremere.]
In any case, the most solid conclusion I have about this mystery is that it's intentionally left unanswered, and that the designers were careful to leave it open to interpretation.
The final email said instead "A true master has played the entire game before the first move." I hadn't thought of Ming-Xiao as the "friend" before, but this made me reconsider. Not so much the message itself - which is just as obscure as the others - but the fact that I only saw this email when I sided with the Kuei-Jin. I usually count Ming-Xiao out after the email that seems to refer to her as the Black Queen, but compared to theories about Jack suddenly talking in grandiloquent chess metaphors just for kicks, to throw you off his scent - or to Gary masquerading as Caine and controlling everything behind the scenes - it doesn't seem too far out.
In this ending, Ming-Xiao definitely seems to win it all. It doesn't end with Jack and the cabbie watching the Tower burn, so they don't seem to be the ones pulling all of the strings. (The sarcophagus could still be full of explosives when you sink with it, but you'd only even consider that if you'd already finished the game differently.)
I'd always thought that the emails were sent by the taxi driver, whom I thought to be Caine - for a number of reasons.
The idea that it might be Gary, and that Gary is really the taxi driver/Caine, is interesting but kind of a stretch. If this hypothesis is correct, Gary could conceivably be - excluding the group cut-scenes - virtually every NPC. I personally think the only use of "Mask of a Thousand Faces" appears in the Nosferatu introduction to the game, where your sire appears as a Toreador before you're discovered by the Camarilla police. (There's enough paranoia in the game without suspecting that every one is literally someone else, whether it's Gary or Ming-Xiao or Caine or whomever - they all have enough faces as it is.)
So it seems possible that the anonymous "friend" could be a different vampire, depending on how you play the game. I think it's Caine/cabbie, unless you side with the Kuei-Jin - then it's Ming-Xiao. [I still haven't played as the Tremere.]
In any case, the most solid conclusion I have about this mystery is that it's intentionally left unanswered, and that the designers were careful to leave it open to interpretation.
-
Anaximander
- Posts: 367
- Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 4:47 pm
- Location: The City of Sin
- Contact:
[quote="PogRockGhoul]The final email said instead "]
Everyone gets that message, regardless of which ending is chosen. You simply didn't see it before. Here's how these messages work: When the story state reaches a certain point, one of these cryptic e-mails shows up in your haven computer. When it's time for the next message to show up, the previous one will disappear. So if you don't read one before you get the next one, you'll never see it.
"Don't open it." Is the very last one of the messages, and it appears at story state 100, just before you head off to kill LaCroix.
To see this for yourself, open the file ~Vampire\vdata\hackedterminals\havenpc.txt. The dependency lines determine when various e-mails arrive. If the dependency is false, or becomes false, the e-mail will not show up in your haven pc. Deciphering the various story states is a little more tricky. You have to dig around in the dialogues to find those, usually.
Everyone gets that message, regardless of which ending is chosen. You simply didn't see it before. Here's how these messages work: When the story state reaches a certain point, one of these cryptic e-mails shows up in your haven computer. When it's time for the next message to show up, the previous one will disappear. So if you don't read one before you get the next one, you'll never see it.
"Don't open it." Is the very last one of the messages, and it appears at story state 100, just before you head off to kill LaCroix.
To see this for yourself, open the file ~Vampire\vdata\hackedterminals\havenpc.txt. The dependency lines determine when various e-mails arrive. If the dependency is false, or becomes false, the e-mail will not show up in your haven pc. Deciphering the various story states is a little more tricky. You have to dig around in the dialogues to find those, usually.
".... for I had seen the Human face of the Vampires, and now I beheld the monstrousness of these Men..."
-
ProgRockGhoul
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2006 6:04 pm
- Contact:
Thanks, that's completely right. I had some idea of how the mystery emails would sort of override previous ones (read or not) once you reach a certain point in the story, but I certainly did miss the same old final email before heading out to kill Lacroix.
(When I checked, it was funny to see Smilin Jack still sitting there in my Santa Monica apartment, like he had nothing better to do, even after I'd taken the cab to Chinatown to betray everyone.)
So my little theory about Ming-Xiao - and the "friend" appearing to be a different vampire depending on how you align yourself - is a bust. If that were my only run through the game I wouldn't be unhappy with my interpretation, but it obviously doesn't hold up as a comprehensive read.
(When I checked, it was funny to see Smilin Jack still sitting there in my Santa Monica apartment, like he had nothing better to do, even after I'd taken the cab to Chinatown to betray everyone.)
So my little theory about Ming-Xiao - and the "friend" appearing to be a different vampire depending on how you align yourself - is a bust. If that were my only run through the game I wouldn't be unhappy with my interpretation, but it obviously doesn't hold up as a comprehensive read.