I think it's really cool and great and all when you can level up a bunch of levels at once, but the real problem is that when you do level-up, you start earning darn near nothing each encounter.
My question is this: Does level-squatting actually work, or will I end up with the same results either way?
The annoyances of level-squatting
The annoyances of level-squatting
"A life is not important, except in the impact it has on other lives."
-- Jackie Robinson
Baruk Khazad! Khazad ai-mênu!
-- Jackie Robinson
Baruk Khazad! Khazad ai-mênu!
I read in some crazy hardcore guide that yes, you could hold your chars from leveling up to avoid the exp-by-avg-lvl penalty and even turn it in your favor entering hard areas with virtually low levels; they even mentioned a strategy where in a party of 4 for example, you would fill the 2 member slots available with 2 chars that you would always keep in lvl 1 and hidden/invisible in a corner of the room just to greatly lower your party level to gain extra exp.
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Philos
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Interesting tactic of having 2 in the party but never seen. But that seems like a lot invisibility spells to have to use slots for.
I haven't run a level squatted party completely through yet. I just started a a new one (my last one bought it when when my harddrive took a dump). I am using a tactic that I believe Aerich suggested to me or perhaps k-monster a while back when I started a thread commenting on how I had created a Frankenstein and feared exactly what Klorox described would happen. The tactic is to spread out the leveling up and just do one at a time over several different screens/places along the journey. I level my spellcasters first (sometimes almost immediately when they hit the XP mark), then work on the others. That way there is no massive change in overall party level at once. This seems to be working pretty well so far. I am just starting the wandering village and my main tank (an Assimar paladin) is 11th level (12th ECL), my cleric is 12th, and my wizard is 11th with one level squatted. The other characters are 6th, 7th, and 8th level with various levels waiting to be added. So overall my party is about 9th on average and IIRC is about a level higher than my first party (that I didn't level squat) to go through the game was at this point. The XP awarded "seems" to be about the same but memory is fuzzy. Having a couple of higher level characters is making the encounters easier IMHO, but then I have also played through the game a couple of times now too. I think this party will reach the end game a level or two higher than my first party.
I haven't run a level squatted party completely through yet. I just started a a new one (my last one bought it when when my harddrive took a dump). I am using a tactic that I believe Aerich suggested to me or perhaps k-monster a while back when I started a thread commenting on how I had created a Frankenstein and feared exactly what Klorox described would happen. The tactic is to spread out the leveling up and just do one at a time over several different screens/places along the journey. I level my spellcasters first (sometimes almost immediately when they hit the XP mark), then work on the others. That way there is no massive change in overall party level at once. This seems to be working pretty well so far. I am just starting the wandering village and my main tank (an Assimar paladin) is 11th level (12th ECL), my cleric is 12th, and my wizard is 11th with one level squatted. The other characters are 6th, 7th, and 8th level with various levels waiting to be added. So overall my party is about 9th on average and IIRC is about a level higher than my first party (that I didn't level squat) to go through the game was at this point. The XP awarded "seems" to be about the same but memory is fuzzy. Having a couple of higher level characters is making the encounters easier IMHO, but then I have also played through the game a couple of times now too. I think this party will reach the end game a level or two higher than my first party.
UNCOMMON VALOR WAS A COMMON VIRTUE
Another strategy is to plan your squatting and unsquatting cycles. Don't unsquat everyone at once. There are 3 principles to this...
1) average party level controls the xp. a 4th and two 2nd level characters are like a average 2nd level party. If anyone gets another level now the average level is 3 so you might as well gain a total of 3 levels. So the best is to always be 1 short of making the average party level 1 higher
avg party levels = sum of individual levels divided by total characters.. I think it is rounded down but it has been awhile for me
2) certain levels are relatively more powerful. Example a 6 level fighter is pretty much as strong as a 7th. He gets a boost with improved critical and another boost when he gets 3 attacks. So have him 'park' at sweet levels that have a combination of relative power yet ability to lower party level. Another example of a sweet level is the level a caster gets a spell you need to survive or kick butt. Example sorceror fireball or cleric raise strong type of undead.
3) some classes function better at high power and some function better at low power. high example is a sorceror. A good idea is to keep the sorceror at max possible level and just use the rest of the party (low level) as meat shields. The sourceror kills everything and the rest of the party just helps out. An example of a low character is a bard. Bard can just sing and do nothing else and still some help. Other chars can be high level and bard just needs tymoras melody and enough HP to stay alive.
Finally a plan is needed that blends these three. I once drew out a chart (it helped that all were human so they didn't hit levels at different times). In effect you create a party that is strong relative to its average party level. So it can still anihilate the monsters but it gets a lot of xp. As the game progresses since you are getting more xp your average party level goes up relative to monster difficulty but you still get a fair xp reward since you are an efficient (strong power to average party level ratio). A key is that you must always be leveling up. Otherwise you will have to level up to many guys at once to raise their hitpoints and then the average party level is too high to earn xp.
Basicly you maximize power while always earning a medium amount of xp rather than going through boom bust cycle where you barely kill things earning enormous xp then level up and earn hardly any (but killing quite easy).
so basicly your party is 2 frogs a strong frog and a weak frog. The weak frog means you get xp because low level the strong frog means you can kill. Then the weak frog unsquats (but not the strong or you'd have 2 strong frogs). Now the roles are reversed but you still have some strong and some weak. By leapfrogging you overcome the problem of the requirement that you take all possible levels upon leveling up.
1) average party level controls the xp. a 4th and two 2nd level characters are like a average 2nd level party. If anyone gets another level now the average level is 3 so you might as well gain a total of 3 levels. So the best is to always be 1 short of making the average party level 1 higher
avg party levels = sum of individual levels divided by total characters.. I think it is rounded down but it has been awhile for me
2) certain levels are relatively more powerful. Example a 6 level fighter is pretty much as strong as a 7th. He gets a boost with improved critical and another boost when he gets 3 attacks. So have him 'park' at sweet levels that have a combination of relative power yet ability to lower party level. Another example of a sweet level is the level a caster gets a spell you need to survive or kick butt. Example sorceror fireball or cleric raise strong type of undead.
3) some classes function better at high power and some function better at low power. high example is a sorceror. A good idea is to keep the sorceror at max possible level and just use the rest of the party (low level) as meat shields. The sourceror kills everything and the rest of the party just helps out. An example of a low character is a bard. Bard can just sing and do nothing else and still some help. Other chars can be high level and bard just needs tymoras melody and enough HP to stay alive.
Finally a plan is needed that blends these three. I once drew out a chart (it helped that all were human so they didn't hit levels at different times). In effect you create a party that is strong relative to its average party level. So it can still anihilate the monsters but it gets a lot of xp. As the game progresses since you are getting more xp your average party level goes up relative to monster difficulty but you still get a fair xp reward since you are an efficient (strong power to average party level ratio). A key is that you must always be leveling up. Otherwise you will have to level up to many guys at once to raise their hitpoints and then the average party level is too high to earn xp.
Basicly you maximize power while always earning a medium amount of xp rather than going through boom bust cycle where you barely kill things earning enormous xp then level up and earn hardly any (but killing quite easy).
so basicly your party is 2 frogs a strong frog and a weak frog. The weak frog means you get xp because low level the strong frog means you can kill. Then the weak frog unsquats (but not the strong or you'd have 2 strong frogs). Now the roles are reversed but you still have some strong and some weak. By leapfrogging you overcome the problem of the requirement that you take all possible levels upon leveling up.
Right Speech has four aspects: 1. Not lying, but speaking the truth, 2. Avoiding rude and coarse words, but using gentle speech beneficial to the listener, 3. Not slandering, but promoting friendliness and unity, 4. Avoiding frivolous speech, but saying only what is appropriate and beneficial.