Hi everyone, question about detailed combat

Tiberius James · Post by **Tiberius James** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:15 am

Hi, I'm new here, just joined a new game recently and getting back into D&D, so, I have a couple people that really want to spice up the combat system and go into strict details about how they attack.

The DM doesn't really know how to work certain things but one guy had this question.

He is a ninja and has a very high dex and jump skill. When a guy attacked and he dodged, he wanted to know if he could specify how he dodges.

He wanted to be able to jump over the guys attack, and then take his round in mid air and attack that guy. Is this allowed, and wouldn't that give an attack of oppurtinity.

Either way, even if it is not in the standard edition, is there a good configuration to set something like this up, so the players can get more joy out of the combat system?

Thanks

Siberys · Post by **Siberys** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:35 am

Well...the direct ruling would say this is impossible, but since a round is in 6 seconds and that's when everybody has a turn, this is far from impossible in my opinion. Not to mention, if he's a ninja, jumping out of the way of a sword is the kind of reflex you would expect from that kind of character.

My advice, jumping is a move action so effectively he's made his move action for next turn, and he can attack, land, and personally I would require a balance check to not slip prone considering the strenuous activity he'd be doing in the air. DC 15 plus 5 per size category of the creature he's fighting.

Tiberius James · Post by **Tiberius James** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:57 am

Awsome, thats a really cool. Thanks for the advise. So what if he requested to attack the guy while in the air, before he lands?

I really have all these different attack possibilites that I am curious how to play them out, because the DM doesn't think it's easily possible, or would be to complicated to figure out.

Such as another,

when you run, you get a mod to your jump, and a player asked if he could run and climb onto one guy and jump and launch him self to the back of the croud to take down an archer.

Of course there are several questions with this like, would climbing on the guy and then being in midair active an attack of oppurtunity from everyone under him along with the archor shooting at him, and would the quick climb up onto the guy take away his run bonus for his jump?

I really just need to learn how to lay this stuff down for them. I'm not the DM, but I'm really close with him and is trying to research some stuff.

Thanks for the info guys.

Ribzlibz · Post by **Ribzlibz** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:57 am

wouldnt such a ninja require the agile riposte feat to counter an attack? im not sure if agile riposte is in d and d but it might be (got it from my d20 modern book)

Tiberius James · Post by **Tiberius James** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 12:20 pm

I don't beleive there is a counter attack option.

And I understand that these things might not be in the rules, but it all depends on if the DM is willing to adjust his style of play if we could realistically set up a good way to pull that attack off.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 12:47 pm

You might want to look in to Book of Nine Swords, it has options to counter attack and make combat more interactive.

Tiberius James · Post by **Tiberius James** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 1:25 pm

Thank you, I will definitely check that out. I really just want to give them the best possible enjoyment, and the more creative with there skills are, I beleive the better the game will be, and more xp the DM might give them.

Siberys · Post by **Siberys** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 1:55 pm

Awsome, thats a really cool. Thanks for the advise. So what if he requested to attack the guy while in the air, before he lands?

Well that was more or less what I was referring to, attack in mid air, land, make balance check and lose move action.

But barring all classes, definitely check out Tome of Battle as it does have some unique ideas in it (I say barring classes because they are absolute trash).

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 2:22 pm

Don't believe everything he says

, the Warblade & Crusader particularly are great classes. They're better than a Fighter (not to mention that the classes in the book are practicly the only way of making use of it), and making melee more fun was the whole point of Book of Nine Swords. (That, and making money, of course.)

Siberys · Post by **Siberys** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 2:47 pm

An opinion is an opinion, I say they are trash, but that could completely differ from your opinion and his.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 2:49 pm

Please, I wasn't serious. Hence the "

". It's just kind of hard to incorporate the book without the baseclasses. That's a fact. (I even say "kind of hard", not "impossible".)

Siberys · Post by **Siberys** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 3:20 pm

GawainBS wrote:Please, I wasn't serious. Hence the " ". It's just kind of hard to incorporate the book without the baseclasses. That's a fact. (I even say "kind of hard", not "impossible".)

Not really hard at all. The two feats Martial Study and Martial Stance can incorporate everything you'd need from that book without the use of the class. After taking those two feats, you then meet the requirements for a lot of other feats in that book as well, which can help build your character how you want it.

For the thread poster's case, all he'd need is one use of the feat Martial Study to find the appropriate Maneuver. That's one fighter bonus feat, that's easily spared.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 3:29 pm

Those feats only allow acces to one stance/manouvre. Given that you can only take Martial Study 3 times maximum, combined with your half Initiator Level, will bar access to a lot of manouvres and stances. On top of that, your recovery method is trash. (Non-existant, in fact.)
By using those feats, you could qualify for some Prestige Classes in the book, but you would be heavily gimped, because of the reasons above.
Further, the real beauty comes from the interaction of the different manouvres and the possible combo's.
Apart from that, the baseclasses are mechanicly well-designed. Granted, better than a Fighter and a Monk, but that's rather a problem of those classes, since they are horribly weak.

You may find their fluff trash, which I can't argue with, since it's a matter of taste.

Apart from the previous paragraph, it was all fact, no opinion. Still, no argumentation against you disliking the classes, just pointing out to Tiberius James that the classes deserve at least a personal examination.

Siberys · Post by **Siberys** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 3:34 pm

Yes yes, I know the core classes get a ton of maneuvers and crap, but I was more referring to the fact that the thread poster wouldn't need to take a core class when a simple fighter bonus feat would result in the same thing. Jumping in the air and attacking, if there's not like four or five maneuvers in their to choose from I'd be surprised, so all the player would do is pick the feat he likes best involving that kind of move.

GawainBS · Post by **GawainBS** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 3:38 pm

Ah, I see, you were working with his specific example. True enough then.

My personal recommendation then from ToB is: Sudden Leap, from Tiger Claw. It allows you to do just that: Jump high. And Far.

Tiberius James · Post by **Tiberius James** » Tue Jun 17, 2008 3:42 pm

Thanks you guys, seriously, a friend of mine has practically a D&D library at his house, hopefully he can hook me up.